Gm Teetering

[Patfig]

http://uk.biz.yahoo.com/27052009/323/gm-s-...deal-falls.html

[blankster]

It looks that way - German government considering putting Opel into 'trust'. Does that mean a sort of temporary nationalisation? Where would that leave Vauxhall?

The' trust' bit has been moved to the Europe pages on Bloomberg.

Edited May 27, 2009 by blankster

[yellerkat]

It looks that way - German government considering putting Opel into 'trust'. Does that mean a sort of temporary nationalisation? Where would that leave Vauxhall?

At the mercy of Mandelson.

[Patfig]

The septics better imvade North Korea pdq and start selling a few arms etc

[blankster]

I see Mandelson as more Saab than Vauxhall!

Edited May 27, 2009 by blankster

[Darxide]

I hope they don't. GM are the biggest customer of the company I work for.

If they go pear shaped, so do a lot of UK jobs. Not just Vauxhall, but the massive OEM parts makers.

[Patfig]

I hope they don't. GM are the biggest customer of the company I work for.

If they go pear shaped, so do a lot of UK jobs. Not just Vauxhall, but the massive OEM parts makers.

OEM?

[SNACR]

OEM?

Original Equipment Manufacturer

Usually genuine components rather than generic.

[Darxide]

OEM?

Original Equipment Manufacturer.

It means parts or components supplied directly to a factory. Not a retail product.

[Patfig]

you mean not cheap rip of parts from China

[SNACR]

Original Equipment Manufacturer.

It means parts or components supplied directly to a factory. Not a retail product.

OEM product can be retail.

Velcro branded velcro would be an OEM product.

[SNACR]

you mean not cheap rip of parts from China

Not necessarily, some manufacturers aren't interested in selling certain aftermarket parts and there is no OEM product available. Even franchised dealers won't use all genuine parts, most independents will use hardly any if they can avoid it. Some generic parts are superior quality to genuine.

OEM is a handy phrase and sounds better than telling customers they're buying a non-genuine part.

[STRLondon]

The bond holders should get their money back before the shareholders, suprising that this still has a share price. I suppose if a miracle does happen, theres large sums of money to be made, but it seems to me that the shareholders should have been taken out long ago. Why are the bond holders being bent over a barrel still?

[abharrisson]

I remain convinced this all a negotiating tactic to screw the bondholders... it will go technically bankrupt ( chapter 11) in my view then they'll also nail the unions down and we'll end up with something like:

Bondholders 20/30%

Unions 20/30%

sharholders 1/2% (basically wiped out)

Amercian govt 30/40% ( in exchange for another £20/30bn)

Saab sold, opel sold, vauxhall sold etc.

Unions wound back severely in terms of workers pay and conditions and retirement benefits etc

Plants closed

dealerships closed.

But you never know if they can then produce the right cars, well built and as efficiently as toyota they may stand a chance.

[yellerkat]

Gloomberg:

Transferred to Opel

GM said today that its European assets such as plants, sales organizations and technology have been transferred to Adam Opel GmbH, based in Ruesselsheim near Frankfurt, signaling a further separation of the European operations from its U.S. parent.

Consolidation of GM Europe a done deal.

[STRLondon]

this is a prime example of crashioning in action. Keeping this company on life support, spreading the pain over a longer period. The recession wont be a sharp one because of such actions and by the time we should be recovering, more companies will have to admit they are finished which in turn just prolongs the agony even further.

What a mess

[Darxide]

Not necessarily, some manufacturers aren't interested in selling certain aftermarket parts and there is no OEM product available. Even franchised dealers won't use all genuine parts, most independents will use hardly any if they can avoid it. Some generic parts are superior quality to genuine.

OEM is a handy phrase and sounds better than telling customers they're buying a non-genuine part.

Most people don't realize that 'generic' parts are often made by the same people. My company makes OEM parts for Ford, GM, Nissan and so on. We brand these parts with the customers logo. i.e. the Ford parts will have the Ford logo molded into the plastic casing, and packed into a 'genuine Ford' bag or box.

But, we also make unbranded 'aftermarket' parts. They are identical except for the lack of the logo, and plain packaging. (And they cost a lot less to buy from a motorfactors than the OEM would from a main dealer).

[interestrateripoff]

If it does go under we'll get to see whether the markets have accurately priced the failure into the system!

[three pint princess]

Most people don't realize that 'generic' parts are often made by the same people. My company makes OEM parts for Ford, GM, Nissan and so on. We brand these parts with the customers logo. i.e. the Ford parts will have the Ford logo molded into the plastic casing, and packed into a 'genuine Ford' bag or box.

But, we also make unbranded 'aftermarket' parts. They are identical except for the lack of the logo, and plain packaging. (And they cost a lot less to buy from a motorfactors than the OEM would from a main dealer).

I still remember the issue a motherboard manufacturer had using the wrong glue, all the different rival brands had the same problems and had to recall. It's like LCD or Plasma panels, Sony don't

make their own LCD panels they buy them from another manufacturer or as part of a group. Same with laptop batteries, or car air con systems, sometimes it's a close brand where everyone

thinks it odd, other times it's just seen as a part of a whole so ok.

Or Cisco router production in China, the factories realised the cost of the item was in it's design, marketing and support etc, so running production 24 hours a day instead of 18 they could sell anything extra for

the cost of materials and labour, plus profit. Some ended up in US defence networks after being marked up again for millions in free cash.

Brand counts for a lot, as does design, anything outside the production process.

Edited May 27, 2009 by Tom Peters

[SNACR]

If it does go under we'll get to see whether the markets have accurately priced the failure into the system!

My guess would be probably not enough. Its tentacles stretch so far I think it'll be a bigger cardiac arrest than Lehman.

[interestrateripoff]

My guess would be probably not enough. Its tentacles stretch so far I think it'll be a bigger cardiac arrest than Lehman.

It appears we are getting close to finding out.

PPT on standby?

[dubsie]

Well no. It may go bust but the name will live on as there are too many vultures willing to take huge amounts of state money to take over the name......As Obama says...it will emerge stronger as a result of insolvency.

[SurgeonGeneral]

I remain convinced this all a negotiating tactic to screw the bondholders... it will go technically bankrupt ( chapter 11) in my view then they'll also nail the unions down and we'll end up with something like:

Bondholders 20/30%

Unions 20/30%

sharholders 1/2% (basically wiped out)

Amercian govt 30/40% ( in exchange for another £20/30bn)

Saab sold, opel sold, vauxhall sold etc.

Unions wound back severely in terms of workers pay and conditions and retirement benefits etc

Plants closed

dealerships closed.

But you never know if they can then produce the right cars, well built and as efficiently as toyota they may stand a chance.

agreed

[CokeSnortingTory]

It's just the British Leyland tactic of delaying the end of an essentially dead company by nationalisation/hiving/joint ventures to avert the short-term economic and social shock, but at the cost of a long-term dead weight on the national economy.

GM USA is dead. Not sure how GM Europe will survive the long-term decline in car sales, but it is at least potentially a much better company.

[bagsos]

It's just the British Leyland tactic of delaying the end of an essentially dead company by nationalisation/hiving/joint ventures to avert the short-term economic and social shock, but at the cost of a long-term dead weight on the national economy.

GM USA is dead. Not sure how GM Europe will survive the long-term decline in car sales, but it is at least potentially a much better company.

Disagree. GM USA will survive and will thrive, once it is shorn of the legacy liabilities which we are learning as a nation, as well as in individual companies, are easy promises to make in good times when the working population is growing and impossible to keep once times turn tough and the size of the workforce is shrinking. Those retiring from 5 years hence to 2030 are going to be the first generation to pay for their retirement twice, unfortunately.