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Whats Going To Bring It All To A Head

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I'm sure there are lots out there like me who think this situation is beginning to develop into a once in lifetime moment, I have never seen politics held in such contempt by the ordinary punters add on bankers et al, and everyone else thats making lots of cash.

The corrosive drip of expenses titbits on top of the exposure of the bankers jamboree will lead to an explosion of the masses at some point what do you think will bring this to a head.

Personally I think it will be a high level government corruption big bucks story, or the financial markets imploding.

I just can't see this Horror show staggering on for another year until theres an election.

I think the reset button will get pushed much sooner, what will be the cause.

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I'm sure there are lots out there like me who think this situation is beginning to develop into a once in lifetime moment, I have never seen politics held in such contempt by the ordinary punters add on bankers et al, and everyone else thats making lots of cash.

The corrosive drip of expenses titbits on top of the exposure of the bankers jamboree will lead to an explosion of the masses at some point what do you think will bring this to a head.

Personally I think it will be a high level government corruption big bucks story, or the financial markets imploding.

I just can't see this Horror show staggering on for another year until theres an election.

I think the reset button will get pushed much sooner, what will be the cause.

Agreed. Here's my favoured five in no particular order:

Petrol prices shooting up? (in my opinion, oil prices will shoot up before the year is up)

Another round or two of bank bailouts?

Bond market collapse leading to rocketing inflation? (not sure this would happen in the next year)

People being forced to dig up roads in order to qualify for state benefits?

The proactive introduction of draconian measures to quash a proletariat uprising having the exact opposite effect?

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I'm sure there are lots out there like me who think this situation is beginning to develop into a once in lifetime moment, I have never seen politics held in such contempt by the ordinary punters add on bankers et al, and everyone else thats making lots of cash.

The corrosive drip of expenses titbits on top of the exposure of the bankers jamboree will lead to an explosion of the masses at some point what do you think will bring this to a head.

Personally I think it will be a high level government corruption big bucks story, or the financial markets imploding.

I just can't see this Horror show staggering on for another year until theres an election.

I think the reset button will get pushed much sooner, what will be the cause.

It would be nice to think that things were shaping up for the "once in a lifetime" moment but there is no coherent political left to sieze the day should it come. The majority of the disaffected poor are apolitical and apathetic. Ranged against those who are politically aware and ready to disrupt are all the highly developed surveillance systems we've been paying for, a police force who've had a dry run in the miners strike, an army with years on the streets of Northern Ireland and the legion of private security bouncers from Sercos to the muppets at your local supermarkets front door. So, whilst there is always a chance to sieze the moment, no one should imagine that the cororate state will give up anything without some real sacrifice by a resiliant, organised, very committed and politically savvy vanguard. Some comments on this site (strangely) give me hope!

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People being forced to dig up roads in order to qualify for state benefits?

That would cause mass celebration amongst anyone who actually works for a living..... And probably guarantee the re-election of whichever party introduced it.

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Say, what now?

No idea what disingenuous scheme they might conjure up - how about conscription for all benefit claimants under 21?

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I think the far right will take power in a European nation, there has been massive momentum going to those parties across Europe as people simply don't believe any of the mainstream parties will do what they want... and that might catalyze the elites in Europe into actually trying to solve the issues of today. Instead of pretending they don't exist and carrying on business as usual as those problems grow larger. But then again the elites probably won't change.

There is also the possibility of a long slide. Britain is spending like >60% of our gdp on government, by some definitions we are a communist nation. Those communist nations seem to gradually drift downwards until the state eventually collapses, but it takes decades.

Spain who has a catastrophic 17.4% unemployment rate does seem to be trying something serious. The government brought on 240,000 temporary workers, which helped slow down the rate of job loss. Interestingly at least in Spain even with 17.4% unemployment the people don't seem to be complaining too much. No big demonstrations that I've heard of demanding change.

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Btw this Russian guy I was reading said severe economic crisis' follow the pattern of Financial Crash---->Unemployment Crisis---->Political Crisis--- then social and cultural change.

It seems to me the parliament is under seige in Britain.. would all of these revelations really have come out if times were still good? I doubt it. Its quite a historic time with the bank of england rate going lower than it ever has since the creation in the 1690's. There has to be huge pressure from the power players for change.

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Btw this Russian guy I was reading said severe economic crisis' follow the pattern of Financial Crash---->Unemployment Crisis---->Political Crisis--- then social and cultural change.

It seems to me the parliament is under seige in Britain.. would all of these revelations really have come out if times were still good? I doubt it. Its quite a historic time with the bank of england rate going lower than it ever has since the creation in the 1690's. There has to be huge pressure from the power players for change.

Are you're referring to Mr Orlov? If so, I read that too. I believe we're approaching stage 3 of 5.

Faith that "the government will take care of you" is lost. As official attempts to mitigate widespread loss of access to commercial sources of survival necessities fail to make a difference, the political establishment loses legitimacy and relevance.

For those that are interested:

http://cluborlov.blogspot.com/2008/02/five...f-collapse.html

Edited by RajD

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I think the trigger would be something far more trivial than those so far. Something far more of a butterfly flaps its wings.

I would think it could be something like a council treating a war veteran pensioner, with a trifling amount of council tax arrears, in a disproportionately heavy-handed manner.

Another thing would be a broken window theory sort of thing. A couple of MP's homes get looted, then everyone helps themselves like the container ship off the Cornish cost all over again (which TBH was not the nation's finest hour).

Although, having said that I don't think it would need many more performances like Anthony Steen's to cause the nation to stir.

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Btw this Russian guy I was reading said severe economic crisis' follow the pattern of Financial Crash---->Unemployment Crisis---->Political Crisis--- then social and cultural change.

It seems to me the parliament is under seige in Britain.. would all of these revelations really have come out if times were still good? I doubt it. Its quite a historic time with the bank of england rate going lower than it ever has since the creation in the 1690's. There has to be huge pressure from the power players for change.

Exactly, there was the whole Derek Conway paying his student son a wage out of office expenses. People weren't so worked up then. Although, little did everyone know what the tip of the iceberg that was.

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That would cause mass celebration amongst anyone who actually works for a living..... And probably guarantee the re-election of whichever party introduced it.

That is actually so retarded - even by your egregious standards - that I am going to put you on ignore. Goodbye doo-doo muncher.

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In the next 12/24 months, all those who bought into the housing price bubble in the UK,

putting a huge bet on property using borrowed money, especially those who MEWd' in the last 5 years,

are gonna be significantly crucified.

Shifting from a bubble-style mortgage, where the lender didn't care about making money, just grabbing market share,

onto, at best, their lender's SVR, still a theoretically bearable 2.50-6.00%

should not be crippling...

but it will be for folk who expected to get another "great" deal.

When this filters through, there will be massive HPC, and then...

probably nothing much will happen.

Edited by Jiji

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Are you're referring to Mr Orlov? If so, I read that too. I believe we're approaching stage 3 of 5.

For those that are interested:

http://cluborlov.blogspot.com/2008/02/five...f-collapse.html

Yes that is him! Thanks for that link.

I also believe we are approaching stage 3 of 5. An article from one of the papers I was reading really struck me when it said the public's opinion of parliament may be at its lowest level ever. Imo the kindling is piling up not just for a change of which party is in power but a major systemic change.

How many Brits honestly believe one of the mainstream parties will solve the problems we face? How many Brits believe in the legal system as a great arbiter of justice? Or the banks as careful stewarts of our savings? Or that the economy generally rewards those who add value.

The reason I supported taking by force the bankers ill gotten bonuses for the last few years, wasn't about recovering the money. It was about restoring faith of the public in the integrity of the system. To not even fire the people or cancel their current bonuses was a terrible betrayal and imo dangerous.

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Although I would love something to happen, I really dont think anything will ( as in amazing change or a new system)

1) Labour will take huge losses in the European elections, with single issue and right wing parties making gains

2) Gordon Brown will be ousted, forcing a general election

3) Conservatives continue with their "change" theme. Hey it fooled the Yanks didnt it? Get elected with large majority. Labour become 3rd party.

Things carry on as before, with more obvious taxes, less public sector jobs, higher interest rates

Lets hope im proved wrong :ph34r:

Yes that is him! Thanks for that link.

I also believe we are approaching stage 3 of 5. An article from one of the papers I was reading really struck me when it said the public's opinion of parliament may be at its lowest level ever. Imo the kindling is piling up not just for a change of which party is in power but a major systemic change.

LOL we havent had any of those stages. Except perhaps in a very trivial minor way. Savings wiped out in stage 1? Errr no. Stage 2, Widespread shortages of survival necessities becomes the norm? Errr no

Edited by Johnny Storm

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I think that there is a reasonable chance that, rather than a headshot, it will be a stomach shot that slowly bleeds out. This shot could be the resumption of normal or near normal mortgage lending practices. In this case it won't be long before everyone piles in. The over-riding assumption of properdee really hasn't gone anywhere. It is still seen as doubling every 7 years (someone said this to me just last week), but post "crash" it's seen as even better. In the absence of continued bad news this will be quite some bounce. It might last another 10 years! Then the swhtf. But don't underestimate the tyranny of optimism. We had a boom based on nothing for 10 years, we can do it again.

I'm not saying that this is the most likely thing to happen, but it's in the probabilities. It's more likely than a currency collapse and the EOTWAWKI.

My P50 case is still something along the lines of a smallish drop from here, and (hopefully) a) stasis for a few years, then B) house prices not racing away from earnings again. This relies almost entirely on banks restricting LTV. I'm not sure they will.

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Guest eight
Things carry on as before, with more obvious taxes, less public sector jobs, higher interest rates

For many people, this might be considered restitution enough.

Shame they practically have to revolt to get it.

eight

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Although I would love something to happen, I really dont think anything will ( as in amazing change or a new system)

1) Labour will take huge losses in the European elections, with single issue and right wing parties making gains

2) Gordon Brown will be ousted, forcing a general election

3) Conservatives continue with their "change" theme. Hey it fooled the Yanks didnt it? Get elected with large majority. Labour become 3rd party.

Things carry on as before, with more obvious taxes, less public sector jobs, higher interest rates

Lets hope im proved wrong :ph34r:

LOL we havent had any of those stages. Except perhaps in a very trivial minor way. Savings wiped out in stage 1? Errr no. Stage 2, Widespread shortages of survival necessities becomes the norm? Errr no

Of course this is what will happen.

Blair promised all kinds of electoral reforms before 1997, when in power he completely abandoned them and no one said a word. This country is pathetic.

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That would cause mass celebration amongst anyone who actually works for a living..... And probably guarantee the re-election of whichever party introduced it.

GOD HE IS SUCH A CHALLENGE - I CAN'T IMAGINE WHO WOULD CALL HIM TO BED CAN YOU?

I have to love him because I don't believe that hate ever solved anything, but every time I read a post by McTavish I am reminded of something Jack Kornfield said about his time in Cambodia during the Khmer Rouge. Fifty thousand people had become communists at gunpoint, threatened with death if they continued their Buddhist practices. In spite of the danger, a temple was established at a refugee camp, and twenty thousand people attended the opening . There were no lectures or prayers but simply continuous chanting :

Hatred never ceases by hatred

But by love alone is healed

This is an ancient and eternal law.

Kornfield says that thousands of people chanted and wept, knowing the truth in these words was even greater than their suffering.

McTavish of course would have them all whipped and then shot, but I suppose it means he needs MORE love than the rest of us

:wub:

Edited by Sybil13

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Although I would love something to happen, I really dont think anything will ( as in amazing change or a new system)

1) Labour will take huge losses in the European elections, with single issue and right wing parties making gains

2) Gordon Brown will be ousted, forcing a general election

3) Conservatives continue with their "change" theme. Hey it fooled the Yanks didnt it? Get elected with large majority. Labour become 3rd party.

Things carry on as before, with more obvious taxes, less public sector jobs, higher interest rates

Lets hope im proved wrong :ph34r:

LOL we havent had any of those stages. Except perhaps in a very trivial minor way. Savings wiped out in stage 1? Errr no. Stage 2, Widespread shortages of survival necessities becomes the norm? Errr no

"Let's hope I am proved wrong", so what would you like to see happen?

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The masses need to rise up and put a stop to goverment and all it's legs that are endimicaly corrupt.

Independant department look at MP's expencise is going to be about as independant as the BoE and say nothing about the kick backs these people are getting,

It's too broken to mend and explaines why we are taxes so high and get so little in return.

Where is Oliver Cronwell when you need him.

be nice to people in the armed forces we need them to take the guns off the police and most people in the lower ranks of the army think like us having been treated like $hit for decades.

the boil must be lanced i say.

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Ah. I thought you meant a Sarajevo moment.

That is what I fear may happen - Member of Royalty and a Foreign (Asian) patsy.

Then it all kicks off.

Edited by Red Kharma

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It's like waiting for a windscreen with a big crack in it to blow. It won't take much and will create a hellova mess.

Nah, as soon as some real news happens or the Telegraph stop publishing, it will vanish in an instant.

A Conspiracy nut might be expecting a major terrorist act anytime soon.

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