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Most People Are Still In Denial.

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The housing market since around 1997-98 has been a SCAM-

the biggest SCAM in UK history-


The Chancellor knew perfectly well - 25% of his tax revenues at the peak came from the banksters. The house market scam is the only reason we could go to war in Iraq/Afghanistan, waste hundreds of billions on the health service, and labour were re-elected twice.

Meanwhile, blair and Powell, his right hand man, both work for US investment bank JP Morgan.

It's so bleeding obvious it's risible.

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I agree with the OP. The one thing that strikes me about the last 10 years is how I've become progressively less happy as the decade has gone on. I don't think this is entirely because I couldn't buy a home; it's also a combination of other quality-of-life things that have been eroded too such as:

Job security (I'm redundant from a permanent post in March and will probably end up taking on the personal risk of self employment merely to continue doing the same job for the same organisation that I have done for the last 8 years),

Pension (final salary pension will be destroyed at the same time),

Real cost of living (rent, council tax, food, energy and public transport costs, as opposed to being able buy a cheap sh1t washing machine for £150)

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There are some specific gripes I have with Browns handling of the economy, I shall cover them and what I believe the Tories would have done.

Well, this is what they'd have ACTUALLY done if they'd won in 1997. Much of it is now Labour policy, interestingly.

Over the next parliament, we will achieve our goal for the government to spend less than 40% of our national income.

Our aim is to ensure Britain keeps the lowest tax burden of any major European economy.

Over the next parliament, our aim will be to achieve our target of a 20p basic rate of income tax, while maintaining a maximum tax rate of no more than 40p.

During the next parliament, we will maintain an inflation target of 2.5% or less.

The goal which we set ourselves in 1995 is to double living standards over 25 years.

We will cut the small companies rate of corporation tax in line with personal taxation as we move towards a 20p basic rate

We will continue to reduce the burden of capital gains tax and inheritance tax as it is prudent to do so.

In the next parliament, we will reform business rates to reduce the cost that falls upon small businesses.

We will introduce "sunset" requirements into new regulations whenever appropriate so that they are automatically reviewed or dropped after a specific period.

We will therefore insist that the whole of the public sector adopts the same stringent rules that we require of central government in justifying the benefits of new regulations against their costs.

No Conservative government will sign up to the Social Chapter or introduce a national minimum wage We will insist at the Intergovernmental Conference in Amsterdam that our opt-out is honoured and that Britain is exempted from the Working Time Directive: if old agreements are broken, we do not see how new ones can be made

As Project Work succeeds and demonstrates that its costs can be met by the savings from getting people into work, we will extend the programme to cover the long-term unemployed nationwide

We will also develop an innovative "Britain Works" scheme which uses the experience and ingenuity of private and voluntary sectors to get people off welfare into work.

We will use the Millennium Lottery Fund to transform the computer facilities and information links available in schools, libraries, museums, voluntary organisations and other public places after the turn of the century.

Our aim is nothing less than tariff free trade across the globe by the year 2020

We will introduce a Competition Bill to take forward these proposals in the first session of the next parliament

We will give priority to future reductions in personal taxation that help families looking after dependent children or relatives by allowing one partner's unused personal allowance to be transferred to a working spouse where they have these responsibilities.

Our goal is that by 2000, more than half of the employees of Britain's larger companies will own shares in those companies.

We will continue to raise the threshold for inheritance tax as it is prudent to do so.

We will make it easier for small employers to set up personal pension plans for groups of employees.

We will create more flexibility for people who save in personal pension plans to continue investing in those schemes if they subsequently move to jobs with company pension schemes.

We will also create flexibility for employees with savings in Additional Voluntary Contributions (AVC) schemes to take part of that pension earlier or later than their main company pension.

At the start of the next parliament we will set out proposals to provide all young people entering the workforce with a personal pension fund paid for through a rebate on their national insurance contributions. At retirement they would be entitled to the full pension earned by this accumulated investment. This could give them a pension significantly higher than they would currently receive from the state. But they will be guaranteed a pension at least equal to the current bask state pension, increased in line with inflation.

We will provide new guidance to ensure social workers properly reflect the values of the community - focusing their efforts on those families who most need support, and minimising unnecessary interference. Social workers working with children will receive special training to cope with the often heart-rending cases they face.

We will raise standards through a new regulatory framework which will apply the same standards in both the public and private sector.

We will also remove the power of local authorities to operate care homes where this is in the best interests of the people for whom they are responsible.

We will review the direct payment scheme, and provided it has been cost effective, we will extend it to other users of social services.

We will introduce a Respite Care Programme. This will enable family members with heavy responsibilities caring for a relative to take a much needed break. We will also offer more practical advice for carers who want to go back to paid work.

In the first session of the next Parliament we will implement our partnership scheme for long term care, making it easier for people to afford the cost of care in old age without giving up their lifetime savings.

We will intensify our current initiatives of inspections and checks, including more home visits, to crack down further on benefit cheats. We will introduce benefit cards across the country. We will establish a Benefit Fraud inspectorate to monitor local authorities' performance. We will also improve the sharing of information between government departments to catch more fraudulent claims.

We will also carry through our draft Bill, creating the option for those buying flats to choose a new form of commonhold ownership.

Public landlords will have to sell houses which are available for occupation yet have been left empty without a good reason for more than 12 months.

We will make it easier for those receiving incapacity benefit to volunteer by removing the 16 hour weekly limit on their voluntary work.

First, we will set national targets for school performance that reflect our objective of ensuring that Britain is in the top league of international standards across the whole spectrum of education.

Second, we will require every school to plan how to improve its performance, and to set targets which relate to similar schools and national standards.

Third, we will give all parents full information on the performance of their child's school

Fourth, to underwrite our pledge, we will ensure action is taken to bring any under-performing school up to the mark.

We will publish all school test results, including the results of tests of 7 and 14 year olds.

We propose also to assess every child at five.

We will also introduce a new test for 14 year old children that covers the whole National Curriculum - assessing progress before they choose subjects for GCSE.

We will allow for on independent inspection of education authorities and intervene directly to raise standards where education authorities are letting children down.

We will establish a more rigorous and effective system of appraising teachers, which reflects how well their pupils perform in tests and exams: this will identify which teachers need more help and, where necessary, which teachers need to be replaced.

We will extend the benefits of greater self-governance to all LEA schools. We will require local authorities to delegate more of schools' budgets to the schools themselves. We will give them more freedom over the employment of their staff and over admissions. And, where they want it, we will allow them to take over ownership of their assets, so they can make best use of the resources.

We will continue to encourage the establishment of more specialist schools in technology, arts, languages and sport. We aim to help one in five schools become specialist schools by 2001.

We will allow all schools to select some of their pupils.

We will help schools to became grammar schools in every major town where parents want that choke.

We will give students between 14 and 21 a learning credit which will enable them to choose suitable education or training leading to recognised qualifications up to A levels or their equivalents.

We will continue, year by year; to increase the real resources committed to the NHS, so NHS spending will continue to share in a growing economy

We will publish more information on how successfully hospitals are treating patients so that they and their GPs can make more informed choices between services in different hospitals and help stimulate better performance

We shall implement the new Primary Care Act which will enable all family doctors to provide a broader range of patient services within their surgeries. This will include ("super surgeries" and practice-based cottage hospitals that can offer faster and more local treatment.

We will extend nationwide our plans to enable more nurses to prescribe a wider range of drugs for patients, recognising their contribution to primary care.

We will not close any long-stay mental hospitals unless it can be shown that adequate care services exist in the community.

We will promote the Private Finance Initiative which will unleash a new flow of investment funds into the modernisation of the NHS.

We will require all government agencies to apply for Chartermarks.

We will ensure private ownership, competition and regulation continue to deliver lower prices and better services for consumers.

We will extend competition for domestic gas users, and introduce competition in the water industry, starting with large users.

We will guarantee to preserve the national identity, universal service and distinctive characteristics of the Royal Mail, while considering options - including different forms of privatisation - to introduce private capital and management skills into its operations.

We will transfer Parcelforce to the private sector whilst ensuring that every Post Office in the land continues to provide a full parcel service at an economical price.

We will push Challenge Funding further to reward effective local government.

We will keep up the pressure for higher standards and improved value for money by insisting on compulsory competitive tendering.

We will legislate to remove legal immunity from industrial action which has disproportionate or excessive effect Members of the public and employers will be able to seek injunctions to prevent industrial action in these circumstances. Any strike action will also have to be approved by a majority of all members eligible to vote and ballots will have to be repeated at regular intervals if negotiations are extended.

We will complete the successful transfer of British Rail into the commercial sector.

We will bring forward plans to privatise London Underground. Proceeds from privatisation will be recycled in order to modernise the network within 5 years - creating an underground system to serve the capital in the 21st Century. We will regulate fares so they rise by no more than inflation for at least 4 years after privatisation. We will also protect services - including the Travel Card and concessionary fares.

We will support chief constables who develop local schemes to crack down on petty crime and improve public order.

We will fulfil the Prime Minister's pledge to support the installation of 10,000 CCTV cameras in town centres and public places in the 3 years to 1999. We will provide £75 million over the lifetime of the next parliament to continue extending CCTV to town centres, villages and housing estates up and down the country that want to bid for support.

We will introduce a voluntary identity card scheme based on the new photographic driving licence it will, for example, enable retailers to identify youngsters trying to buy alcohol and cigarettes or rent classified videos when they are under age.

The courts would be able to impose an order - a Parental Control Order - on the parents of children whom they believed could keep control of their children but were refusing to do so.

We will give the courts the power to impose speedy sanctions on youngsters, involving wherever possible an element of reparation to the victim. The probation service - rather than social services - will be responsible for enforcing community punishments for under-16s.

We will establish a national crime squad to provide on improved nationally coordinated approach to organised crime.

We will extend electronically monitored curfew orders nationwide for those aged 16 and over.

Anyone convicted of a second serious sexual or violent crime, like rape or armed robbery, will get an automatic life sentence.

Persistent house burglars and dealers in hard drugs will receive mandatory minimum prison sentences of 3 and 7 years respectively.

We will restore honesty in sentencing by abolishing automatic early release.

We will also take action to allow a judge to stop a defendant from personally questioning the victim in rape cases and other cases where the victim is particularly vulnerable.

We will bring forward in the next parliament a package of measures designed to modernise the current systems for dealing with City fraud.

We will change the structure of legal aid to ensure that it, like other vital public services, functions within defined cash limits.

We will continue the fight against drugs through a coordinated approach: being tough on pushers; reducing demand by educating young people; tackling drug abuse at local level through Drug Action Teams; saying "No" to legalising drugs; and working with international agencies and foreign governments to resist the menace spreading.

Over the next decade, we aim to raise some £25bn of new private investment in housing estates by encouraging tenants in more than half of the remaining public sector housing stock to opt for transferring their homes to new landlords. These transfers will only occur where tenants choose this mute to improve theft estates.

We will use this approach to regenerate the worst housing estates and transform the lives of those who live in them - targeting support for programmes to improve education standards, employment and crime prevention alongside new private sector investment.

We will provide sufficient hostel places to ensure that no-one need sleep out on the streets.

We need to protect the best of the countryside whilst ensuring good jobs and living conditions for people who live there.

We will use the planning system to ensure that more new homes are built on reclaimed sites in our towns and cities. We will aim for more than 60 per cent of all new homes to be built on derelict sites.

We will introduce a new Rural Business Use Class to encourage job creation in the countryside.

We will increase support for schemes which promote care for the countryside - like Countryside Stewardship.

We will tighten up control over food safety by appointing a powerful and independent Chief Food Safety Adviser and Food Safety Council to advise government

We will insist at the IGC and elsewhere on measures to stop quota hopping and prevent the vessels of other countries from using UK fishing quotas.

We will seek to ensure that all European countries have to raise animal welfare standards

We will publish a Green Paper on rabies protection, setting out all the options including the existing controls, early in the new parliament

We will encourage the use of Lottery money to train young athletes and artists, with revenue funding for bursaries, concessionary tickets to professional performances and support for young people's organisations and productions.

A Conservative Government will seek a partnership of nation states. Some others would like to build a federal Europe. A British Conservative Government will not allow Britain to be part of a federal European state.

We will argue for a flexible Europe which fully accommodates the interests and aspirations of all its member states and where any new proposals have to be open to all and agreed by all. We will not accept other changes to the Treaty that would further centralise decision-making, reduce national sovereignty, or remove our right to permanent opt-outs.

We will retain Britain's veto and oppose further extension of qualified majority voting in order to ensure we can prevent policies that would be harmful to the national interest. We will defend the rights of national parliaments and oppose more powers being given to the European Parliament at the expense of national parliaments.

We will take whatever steps are necessary to keep our frontier controls. We will resist attempts to change the inter-governmental nature of co-operation in justice and home affairs. We will not accept the development of new legal rights that extend the concept of European citizenship.

We believe it is in our national interest to keep our options open to take a decision on a single currency when all the facts are before us. If a single currency is created, without sustainable convergence, a British Conservative government will not be part of it.

If, during the course of the next parliament, a Conservative government were to conclude that it was in our national interest to join a single currency, we have given a guarantee that no such decision would be implemented unless the British people gave their express approval in a referendum.

To give parliament more time to consider legislation thoroughly we will extend the Queen's Speech to cover not only legislation for the immediate year but also provisional plans for legislation in the year after that

Edit: Nitty Gritty here. http://www.conservative-party.net/manifest...manifesto.shtml

Edited by Jonnyargles
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Labour became the vehicle for the wealthy to become even wealthier. This was simply because the Tories had become unacceptable to the general population. UK govts appear to exist primarily to shift wealth upwards, Labour differentiates itself by tossing a few more crumbs to the lower orders than the Tories would. The wealth has shifted as per normal, and now the lower orders will have to live with their debts, decreasing standards of living and stress. Mission accomplished and partially deserved because we are apathetic.

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I think weve all agreed it was a bubble rather than a boom.

A boom implies a positive element.

The thing is, it was poistive for most people while it was going on.

It certainly was positive for me. Provided you didn't get carried away and think it would never end, it was a good time to make money.

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We will recover within 1-2 years.

But the biggest bust will happen in 10 years time - the pension timebomb!

I think it'll take us longer to recover, but agree with the rest. IMHO we'll just be finding our feet again when the timebomb will blow us off them.

Soon to be followed by IO mortgagees getting to the end of their 25 years and realising they do actually have to pay the capital back.

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Guest KingCharles1st
The Chancellor knew perfectly well - 25% of his tax revenues at the peak came from the banksters. The house market scam is the only reason we could go to war in Iraq/Afghanistan, waste hundreds of billions on the health service, and labour were re-elected twice.

Meanwhile, blair and Powell, his right hand man, both work for US investment bank JP Morgan.

It's so bleeding obvious it's risible.

Yes- I understand the chancellor realised what was going on. however, I don't think he took it for quite the scam it was- I feel he genuinely thought it was a good thing..

And when he found out the truth- he was like the person who won't open his credit card statement envelope because he knows the bottom line is doom

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......almost right ...but the sales led lender and the lending was the problem....they were in it for the commission built into the loan and banked at point of sale...repayment .....?.....ah ...that wasn't the consideration....the commission was the golden bullet fired at every application....risk control ...no need ...loans were 'packaged' and sold on in tinsel wrappers...without the health warning ..'all that glitters is not gold'.....regulation ...?..no.. no ...the FSA were on watch.. <_<

I agree with this; when I say that 'borrowing' was the problem I don't necessarily mean borrowers, but rather the amount of (unrepayable) borrowing currently outstanding on the books. Obviously that borrowing came from the activities of both borrowers and lenders, in fact you can trace it back to an excessive supply of cheap money from Japan as they tried to avoid the fall-out from their own (earlier) bubble collapse.

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Example: I would like to buy a new car, but I am not going to, not even if a car dealer grovelled, begged, and offered me zero percent finance over ten years. I'm STILL NOT going to buy a car. The reason is simple. I cannot AFFORD a new car and even if I could there are more sensible things to spend my money on.

The mass delusion that is currently sweeping over the US and the UK is that somehow injecting cash into the economy is going to prop it up. This is crass, stupid and childish.


You are not their target audience, as you have seen through it.

You are in the minority though - their plans may well work simply because you have undersestimated the sheer number of stupid people, whereas they have not.

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Well, I'm pathologically debt-averse, but even I wouldn't go so far as to say 'never ever borrow'.

There's a difference between borrowing for the car you need to get to work, and borrowing for a car to impress the neighbours. And for most people, borrowing is the only route to property-ownership -- if that's what they want.

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By now the following factors hold true.

Government spending and debt is out of proportion with long term incomes.

Government projections are telling people that growth will never end.

Private spending and debt is out of proportion with long term incomes.

Banks willingness to lend based on inflated asset prices is unsustainable.

The currency is be held up by the purchase of debt, both unsustainable.

Eventually, of course, someone notices and is unwilling to buy assets at the inflated value, they start to sell the assets they have, the growth reverses.

This analysis is spot on IMO.

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Not even when the bailiffs come round?

OP I think you misuse the word 'rout'

' This denial is routed in the continuing illusion that things will somehow recover if only loans were enabled'

–verb (used with object) 8. to disperse in defeat and disorderly flight: to rout an army.

9. to defeat decisively: to rout an opponent in conversation.



It was clearly a typo. Of course I meant "rooted". I do try to avoid these but some slip through!


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