Is Britain A Third World Economy...

[Guest Steve Cook]

This questions arises for me out of the string about companies shipping in workers from elsewhere. We now have the bizarre economy where anyone with kids is better off not working unless they are in the top 30% of earners, becasue of the benefits and the low wages, so we pay them to do nothing while companies shift in overseas workers - of course these workers don't have the same requirements to feed others and they live piled up 10 bunks to a room, so basically they are 3rd world living conditions.

Rather than bleat about the minimum wage, we need to recognised the real nature of the low wage economy - which is simply that wages are so low compared to cost of living that nobody can actually afford to live on them - so we end up subsidising wages through tax (which rather than being communism (which is collective ownership), is basically the taxpayer subsidising capitalism - or actually subsidising Cartel Britain), becasue the cost of living has become so out of kilter with the money paid in the low wage economy.

The cost of living needs to come down or wages need to rise so people can stand on their own two feet and not have to rely on the government and through the government, ME.

Neither of the above are what will, eventually, pertain I fear

Rather, the cost of living will remain static at best but will, more likely, rise

Meanwhile, the income for the average citizen will remain static at best but will, more likely, fall.

In other words, we are all about to get a lot poorer. Arguably, the only debate that remains is whether it is a poverty of empty pockets or ones bulging with pieces of worthless paper

Either way, the poverty will be the same.

Edited February 2, 2009 by Steve Cook

[steve99]

You sure about that? These companies may have their offices in the uk, but where is the production based?

Basicly we have a set up that allows those in control to game the system to extract as much wealth as possible while automating and outsourcing the jobs to keep the cash rolling in while massive lending kept the shoppers on their feet.

Now the credit tap has been turned off we have this abrupt and wildly comic spectacle of a small group of high earners suspended at the top end, the general public at the bottom buried in debt- and nothing in between but air- and it's just begining to occur to the people at the top that maybe plundering the system and impoverishing the public may not have been the smartest move they ever made-because they now have no f u c k i n g customers. Morons.

Yes, this is the case, sort of like the snake that ate it's self, started at the tail and now its up to its neck and just realised what a tosser it is.(we hope!)

[1929crash]

The UK's standard of living is appalling compared to the USA.

I have to disagree with your outrageous statement. Have you been to the doctor's at all in the last few years, or hospital? If the answer is yes, are you sure that you wouldn't have been deeply in debt for that if you had lived in the US?

[1929crash]

I wonder how this standard of living is measured?

By the way have you wet the bed?

How did you know?

[Patfig]

How did you know?

If I told you, I'd have to kill you

[1929crash]

If I told you, I'd have to kill you

[Patfig]

In the interests of national security of course

[1929crash]

In the interests of national security of course

Where are my co-proxamol tablets? Oh, they have been banned!

And I only have an electric razor!

[Patfig]

Where are my co-proxamol tablets? Oh, they have been banned!

And I only have an electric razor!

Makes sure it's well charged it's a bugger when they stop mid cut

[1929crash]

Makes sure it's well charged it's a bugger when they stop mid cut

Good job I only do my face then.

[Patfig]

Good job I only do my face then.

[Mr Nice]

I have to disagree with your outrageous statement. Have you been to the doctor's at all in the last few years, or hospital? If the answer is yes, are you sure that you wouldn't have been deeply in debt for that if you had lived in the US?

most americans ARE governed by insurance or government programs.

the idea that everyone that has to have medical attention ends up under mountains of debt is just rubbish.

[aa3]

Do you think greedy uk companies will want to pay a living wage to the people who work for them,if this was the case their would never have been a need for the min wage to be brought in. the ceo's of these companies are out to line their own pockets !!!

i know some companies paid more then the min wage it's not all companies i'am talking about.

our exports must compete, so we need to pay fair wages for a fair days work demands by workers need to be fair for their companies to compete in the world. rent's are too high if rent's and property prices were brought down by the government building 2m to 3m new homes wages need not be too high.

people need fair rents and property prices if property is in short supply then you will pay high prices for crap..like it has been in the recent past !!!

Good point if home prices were very affordable people could spend a lot more on other things. Lots of young people are spending like 60% of their after tax income on rent or mortgage. Cut that in half to 30%, and their disposable income would rise by 75%. (From 40% of after tax income to 70% of after tax income).

[1929crash]

most americans ARE governed by insurance or government programs.

the idea that everyone that has to have medical attention ends up under mountains of debt is just rubbish.

47 million Americans were not covered by any insurance at the time of the Presidential election.

Large numbers are no longer covered because they have lost their jobs.

Many complain that they are not covered by treatment becuase their insurers argue that the policy does not cover them for particular condition, or that the condition was pre-existing. Some of the insurers have been awarding bonuses for staff who cancel policies on a technicality eg.one woman had her policy cancelled when it was argued that she had not given ehr corretc weight exactly at the time of the commencement of the policy.

Obama's mother died arguing about whether she was covered for her illness.

But, to repeat, 47 million Americans had no cover whatsoever at the time of the election.

I hope you never find yourself screaming in pain because you cannot afford pain relief.

[Wuluf]

The third world was a shithole before EVIL WHITE MEN ever set foot there.

Another IDIOT (sorry MarkG)

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_regio..._GDP_(PPP)#1000

world_econ_1000.bmp

world_econ_1000.bmp

[Wuluf]

And just to show that some people never learn..

1.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/European_expl...ese_expeditions

"Portuguese explorer Prince Henry, known as the Navigator, was the first European to methodically explore Africa and the oceanic route to the Indies."

2. http://www.bbc.co.uk/worldservice/specials...ca/page46.shtml

"By the 15th century Portugal was comparable to many kingdoms in Africa, although possibly less rich and less well endowed scholastically than Mali and Ghana. The Jewish and Moorish populations had been expelled from Portugal in the mid 15th century severely depleting the cultural and intellectual life. But already by the beginning of the 15th century Portugal had begun to excel in one area - navigation.!"

3. http://www.housepricecrash.co.uk/forum/ind...mp;#entry651268

--

So sorry I was wrong.. A t*at AND an idiot.. Otherwise, why keep repeating the same falsehoods..??

[Wait & See]

The universal basic income is also the main pillar of what I would do if in charge. To me it deals with two of the main issues; how to provide benefits for thsoe in need without diminishing the reward for work. Which imo all welfare states have failed at.. to the point it actually is turning negative in Britain.

Secondly how to deal with an economy which is going to be more and more automated, and simply requires far less workers. The second point is more of a long run issue that we'll have to deal with eventually. But we're already seeing signs of it; if everyone make £5.50 an hour there is no one to buy new cars, and even the rich owners of the capital are wiped out.

This is something I've never been able to understand. Why do the ruling classes want everybody so poor that they cannot afford the products that they produce. It's a one way ticket to disaster, but yet we still think paying people £6 an hour is ok and that they should be grateful. No ones going to support the economy on this.

Property will crash, car makers will go to the wall along with every other enterprise who sells anything (China tat or services) that the majority cannot afford out of their salary. This adds up to 50% of all businesses IMO.

Stupid basta*ds, the lot of them.

[macca]

Considering the amount of money that has flowed through the UK, its not unreasonable to expect a better standard of living for average pay workers.

[workingnomad]

Britons do not have a Third world mentality.

Third world characteristics are....

- a poorly run country

- corruption at all levels

- inadequate housing

- low work expectancy

- general sense of hopelessness

- inadequate healthcare

- poorly educated people

[Patfig]

Britons do not have a Third world mentality.

Third world characteristics are....

- a poorly run country

- corruption at all levels

- inadequate housing

- low work expectancy

- general sense of hopelessness

- inadequate healthcare

- poorly educated people

Most Britons couldn't survive in the third world

[nixy]

This questions arises for me out of the string about companies shipping in workers from elsewhere. We now have the bizarre economy where anyone with kids is better off not working unless they are in the top 30% of earners, becasue of the benefits and the low wages, so we pay them to do nothing while companies shift in overseas workers - of course these workers don't have the same requirements to feed others and they live piled up 10 bunks to a room, so basically they are 3rd world living conditions.

Rather than bleat about the minimum wage, we need to recognised the real nature of the low wage economy - which is simply that wages are so low compared to cost of living that nobody can actually afford to live on them - so we end up subsidising wages through tax (which rather than being communism (which is collective ownership), is basically the taxpayer subsidising capitalism - or actually subsidising Cartel Britain), becasue the cost of living has become so out of kilter with the money paid in the low wage economy.

The cost of living needs to come down or wages need to rise so people can stand on their own two feet and not have to rely on the government and through the government, ME.

We now have the bizarre economy where anyone with kids is better off not working unless they are in the top 30%

Yes, and you can be sure they will (must) spend all their benefits, which in turn pushes up prices for the low paid.

In fact the striking oil workers should be striking for lower benefits, fewer worker rights etc.

[nixy]

This is something I've never been able to understand. Why do the ruling classes want everybody so poor that they cannot afford the products that they produce. It's a one way ticket to disaster, but yet we still think paying people £6 an hour is ok and that they should be grateful. No ones going to support the economy on this.

Property will crash, car makers will go to the wall along with every other enterprise who sells anything (China tat or services) that the majority cannot afford out of their salary. This adds up to 50% of all businesses IMO.

Stupid basta*ds, the lot of them.

but yet we still think paying people £6 an hour is ok and that they should be grateful.

So how much would you pay them an hour?

£10??

£15??

other?

[Wait & See]

So how much would you pay them an hour?

£10??

£15??

other?

How much does a Premier League Footballer get an hour??

How about minimum wage = a quarter of their salary.

[nixy]

How much does a Premier League Footballer get an hour??

How about minimum wage = a quarter of their salary.

So you are suggesting something like say £50+ an hour?

Is this your recipe for saving the pound?

[Mr Nice]

47 million Americans were not covered by any insurance at the time of the Presidential election.

Large numbers are no longer covered because they have lost their jobs.

Many complain that they are not covered by treatment becuase their insurers argue that the policy does not cover them for particular condition, or that the condition was pre-existing. Some of the insurers have been awarding bonuses for staff who cancel policies on a technicality eg.one woman had her policy cancelled when it was argued that she had not given ehr corretc weight exactly at the time of the commencement of the policy.

Obama's mother died arguing about whether she was covered for her illness.

But, to repeat, 47 million Americans had no cover whatsoever at the time of the election.

I hope you never find yourself screaming in pain because you cannot afford pain relief.

thats about 1 in 6, less if you count the illegal aliens.

as for people screaming in pain because they don't have pain meds, it doesn't work that way.

the hospital emergency rooms are obligated by law to treat everyone.

so if there ever was a need for emergency services, it is available to all.

on top of that, many of the immigrants and underemployed use the emergency services in place of a GP.

it is not at all unusual to see families in getting things like ear infections treated.

while it is by no means an ideal situation, the idea that a working individual with even middling skills is going to find themselves in the gutter if a medical problem pops up is ludicrous.

Edited February 2, 2009 by Mr Nice