copydude Posted January 24, 2009 Share Posted January 24, 2009 Andrew Grice: Will Brown accept any blame? Leader: It is time for our leaders to be honest about this crisis The response of the Government to the sombre confirmation yesterday was unimpressive. Gordon Brown took to the airwaves to assert, yet again, that the crisis was generated abroad and that Britain finds itself innocently caught up in the devastating blowback.This insults the public's intelligence, especially in the week that a British bank announced a £28bn write-down. Yes, the downturn is global. But it was the failure of Mr Brown as Chancellor to curb the excesses of our financial services sector in the boom years that lies at the root of our particular troubles. Is the recent attack on banksters another attempt to divert blame? Why is only the Independent pointing the finger the right way? Meanwhile, Brown is using the BBC - in particular the Today programme - to deny any culpability. (I notice that the 'Today' programme has been re-christened 'Toady' on the net.) Will he get away with it? Or is the 'nothing to do with me mate' just pi$$ing everyone off? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Nelly Posted January 24, 2009 Share Posted January 24, 2009 Love the thread title Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
deflation Posted January 24, 2009 Share Posted January 24, 2009 I thought it was generally accepted now that the majority of the media are all VI, BTL scum? They won't want to blame it on him will they? :angry: If the s**t that the world banks are in IS truly global, are the financial ministers of all countries equally inept? If the FSA / Brown had regulated it more, would all the ponzi money have gone elsewhere? I doubt any country is unaffected, even that fabled utopia Dubai is up to its neck in it. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest theboltonfury Posted January 24, 2009 Share Posted January 24, 2009 Andrew Grice: Will Brown accept any blame?Leader: It is time for our leaders to be honest about this crisis Is the recent attack on banksters another attempt to divert blame? Why is only the Independent pointing the finger the right way? Meanwhile, Brown is using the BBC - in particular the Today programme - to deny any culpability. (I notice that the 'Today' programme has been re-christened 'Toady' on the net.) Will he get away with it? Or is the 'nothing to do with me mate' just pi$$ing everyone off? Can't understand it either. Anyone would think he was Chairman Mao Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
interestrateripoff Posted January 24, 2009 Share Posted January 24, 2009 Is the recent attack on banksters another attempt to divert blame? Why is only the Independent pointing the finger the right way?Meanwhile, Brown is using the BBC - in particular the Today programme - to deny any culpability. (I notice that the 'Today' programme has been re-christened 'Toady' on the net.) Will he get away with it? Or is the 'nothing to do with me mate' just pi$$ing everyone off? He's desperately trying to stay in power, and I think he really does believe that somehow it was down to him the UK had 10 years of growth under him as Chancellor, the reality that he just got lucky and blew the lot is just too much for his ego to bare so he's trying to blame everyone just so people don't think it's his fault. Ultimately there is only one person left in govt who's responsible for this and that's Ponzi Brown, he was at the centre of it all and did nothing to stop it because it might have made him unpopular. The Tories would have been jumping up and down saying he didn't want this country to be rich, ironic really when you consider the mess we are in and some people on here seem to think if only the Tories had been in power things would have been better. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
29929BlackTuesday Posted January 24, 2009 Share Posted January 24, 2009 On Any Answers this afternoon someone called in blaming Brown and complaining how he takes no blame for what's happening. After he'd finished his point, Dimbleby paused then said".......next caller" with no comment... BBC 'journalism' at its best. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
petrodollar Posted January 24, 2009 Share Posted January 24, 2009 Andrew Grice: Will Brown accept any blame?Leader: It is time for our leaders to be honest about this crisis Is the recent attack on banksters another attempt to divert blame? Why is only the Independent pointing the finger the right way? Meanwhile, Brown is using the BBC - in particular the Today programme - to deny any culpability. (I notice that the 'Today' programme has been re-christened 'Toady' on the net.) Will he get away with it? Or is the 'nothing to do with me mate' just pi$$ing everyone off? the media dont need to blame him they are too busy promoting celeb culture and trash VI. History will nail the begger ....and it lasts longer. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bimyo Posted January 24, 2009 Share Posted January 24, 2009 New Labour don't do truth. There is only voice and presentation. Sometimes people talk about New Labour using doublethink and this is more true than they realise - as in Orwell, it's not because they're lying, it's because their sincere beliefs only ever follow how well something can be presented as a public truth. Brown is not 'bad' in this sense, he's not a liar, he is just a product of a New Labour moment in which there is no truth. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
copydude Posted January 24, 2009 Author Share Posted January 24, 2009 On Any Answers this afternoon someone called in blaming Brown and complaining how he takes no blame for what's happening. After he'd finished his point, Dimbleby paused then said".......next caller" with no comment... BBC 'journalism' at its best. Highly selective, isn't it. Annoying thing: if you see any programme about Iceland, even the humblest cod filleter will make the connection between the madness of banks and the failure of regulation. Somehow it's different here. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
interestrateripoff Posted January 24, 2009 Share Posted January 24, 2009 the media dont need to blame him they are too busy promoting celeb culture and trash VI.History will nail the begger ....and it lasts longer. History won't be kind on our dear leader, he'll be trashed in hundreds of future books as will our media for having been essentially lapdogs. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
petrodollar Posted January 24, 2009 Share Posted January 24, 2009 History won't be kind on our dear leader, he'll be trashed in hundreds of future books as will our media for having been essentially lapdogs. Absolutly the good thing about history turning out to be the nemisis of Brown is he is a Dr of the subject. I suspect he knows deep down how it will unfold and I can only guess as to the anguish he will suffer from this fate. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bimyo Posted January 24, 2009 Share Posted January 24, 2009 Annoying thing: if you see any programme about Iceland, even the humblest cod filleter will make the connection between the madness of banks and the failure of regulation. Somehow it's different here. Yep. I think I have just about worn myself out UK-hating for the moment but it is a phenomenon, you live abroad and get used to it and the lack of critical thinking here is absolutely staggering. The inability to connect their own experience to the world's and start acting on it. It is some kind of amazing victory for state ideology. Surely to God some negative equity will correct it a bit... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
cbetofop Posted January 24, 2009 Share Posted January 24, 2009 Gordon Brown, Tony Blair and the scum they lead are responsible for the destruction of my country. Last last time this scum was in power we were treated to years of socialist clap-trap and neo communist policies which very nearly destroyed the UK economy. It took Margaret Thatchers government 11 years to put it right. This time is different however. Not only have Labour destroyed the economy once more, they have irreparably damaged the social fabric of the country. Most of our cities resemble third world indian / pakistan sub continent cities or great swathes of them are like eastern europe. In some places, Leicester, Preston, Dagenham to name a few Labours policies have discriminated against our own people to such an extent they feel like second class citizens in their own country. Not content with this, Labour insists we must 'respect' these people and have strangled freedom of speech to ensure that any criticism of their dogma or any criticism of the results of their immigration policies will result in losing your job, or being prosecuted under their hate crime - or as it more properly should be called 'islamic protection' legislation. Not only that but they have systematically gone about destroying our education system with their politically correct dogmas....teaching children diversity studies instead of maths and english. You only need to interview a few 16 - 18 year old job applicants to understand the effects. Bottom line they have woven this nonsense into the fabric of our society and it will take YEARS for the next government to rectiy it, if it ever can be rectified, and thus opens the door to extreme solutions such as the BNP's policies. And the best bit?..........NO ONE IS ALLOWED TO SAY SO!!!!!!! Freedom of speech and expression, unless of course it is the rights of Muslims to threaten to kill us all in a 'jihad' is the price we all pay. No-one gave Labour, Blair and Brown permission to do this to the United Kingdom. These people not just be voted out, they should be put on trial for treason and imprisoned for the rest of their lives Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest mattsta1964 Posted January 24, 2009 Share Posted January 24, 2009 New Labour don't do truth. There is only voice and presentation. Sometimes people talk about New Labour using doublethink and this is more true than they realise - as in Orwell, it's not because they're lying, it's because their sincere beliefs only ever follow how well something can be presented as a public truth. Brown is not 'bad' in this sense, he's not a liar, he is just a product of a New Labour moment in which there is no truth. I think this article explains quite well the mindset of these people. http://frankfurtschool.us/history.htm 'Cultural Marxism' and 'critical theory' are concepts developed by a group of German intellectuals, who, in 1923, founded the Institute of Social Research at Frankfurt University. The Institute, modeled after the Marx-Engels Institute in Moscow, became known as the Frankfurt School [1]. In 1933, when the Nazis came to power in Germany, the members of the Frankfurt School fled to the United States. While here, they migrated to major U.S. universities (Columbia, Princeton, Brandeis, and California at Berkeley). These intellectual Marxists included Herbert Marcuse, who coined the phrase, 'make love, not war,' during the anti-Vietnam War demonstrations. By promoting the dialectic of 'negative' criticism, that is, pointing out the rational contradictions in a society's belief system, the Frankfurt School 'revolutionaries' dreamed of a utopia where their rules governed [2]. "Their Critical Theory had to contain a strongly imaginative, even utopian strain, which transcends the limits of reality." Its tenets would never be subject to experimental evidence. The pure logic of their thoughts would be incontrovertible. As a precursor to today's 'postmodernism' in the intellectual academic community, [3] "...it recognized that disinterested scientific research was impossible in a society in which men were themselves not yet autonomous...the researcher was always part of the social object he was attempting to study." This, of course, is the concept which led to the current fetish for the rewriting of history, and the vogue for our universities' law, English literature, and humanities disciplines -- deconstruction. Critical theory rejected the ideal of Western Civilization in the age of modern science, that is, the verification or falsifying [4] of theory by experimental evidence. Only the superior mind was able to fashion the 'truths' from observation of the evidence. There would be no need to test these hypotheses against everyday experience. This is how NuLabour and the BBC works. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bimyo Posted January 24, 2009 Share Posted January 24, 2009 Gordon Brown, Tony Blair and the scum they laed are singlehandedly responsible for the destruction of my country. That's a lot of people for a single hand Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
cht Posted January 24, 2009 Share Posted January 24, 2009 Highly selective, isn't it.Annoying thing: if you see any programme about Iceland, even the humblest cod filleter will make the connection between the madness of banks and the failure of regulation. Somehow it's different here. The virtual silence of the British media on the Icelandic peoples overthrow of their government is telling. The media are as afraid (and contemptuous) of 'the masses' as the political class. Expect the media to do a 180 and throw themselves at the feet of Cameron the second it looks clear that Brown's continuation will lead to 'social unrest'. In fact, I think this is already happening. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
interestrateripoff Posted January 24, 2009 Share Posted January 24, 2009 Gordon Brown, Tony Blair and the scum they laed are singlehandedly responsible for the destruction of my country.Last last time this scum was in power we were treated to years of socialist clap-trap and neo communist policies which very nearly destroyed the UK economy. It took Margaret Thatchers government 11 years to put it right. Do you seriously believe we would be in a better position now under the Tories? Do you really think they would have stopped HPI or stopped the move to stealth taxes continually ramping up the fuel/alcohol escalator? I think the bubble would have been even worse, house prices would have been even higher and we'd just be in just as much shit, true it might not be the same shit, but never the less it would be shit. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bimyo Posted January 24, 2009 Share Posted January 24, 2009 I think this article explains quite well the mindset of these people.http://frankfurtschool.us/history.htm This is how NuLabour and the BBC works. I think you are right to an extent Mattsta, though that is an unusually badly-written and Daily Mailesque wikipedia entry - deconstruction really has no link to Frankfurt School, Derrida was interested in Benjamin but that's about all I can think of. Deconstruction takes a lot of its framework from the right, Heidegger and Nietzsche, and anyway isn't the destruction of value as it is often portrayed (which is where it gets Mailesque). In fact a bit of Derrida would do us a lot of good in reading our state-controlled media. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
petrodollar Posted January 24, 2009 Share Posted January 24, 2009 Do you seriously believe we would be in a better position now under the Tories? Do you really think they would have stopped HPI or stopped the move to stealth taxes continually ramping up the fuel/alcohol escalator?I think the bubble would have been even worse, house prices would have been even higher and we'd just be in just as much shit, true it might not be the same shit, but never the less it would be shit. we will never know and you may well be right. But the fact of the matter is labour govs have form on driving the country into financial crisis imf style and pound in your pocket devaluation what is different this time is the media control which prevents open debate of the truth. That opens a can of worms for those responsible for the media i am thinking bbc. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Crossbow Posted January 24, 2009 Share Posted January 24, 2009 Do you seriously believe we would be in a better position now under the Tories? Do you really think they would have stopped HPI or stopped the move to stealth taxes continually ramping up the fuel/alcohol escalator?I think the bubble would have been even worse, house prices would have been even higher and we'd just be in just as much shit, true it might not be the same shit, but never the less it would be shit. What's the point of your constantly saying that it would have been worse under the Tories? It's a hypothetical point, so why keep making it ad nauseum? The fact is we have been under Labour, they are responsible for this mess, no other party is, so you may as well face that fact. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest mattsta1964 Posted January 24, 2009 Share Posted January 24, 2009 The virtual silence of the British media on the Icelandic peoples overthrow of their government is telling. The media are as afraid (and contemptuous) of 'the masses' as the political class. Expect the media to do a 180 and throw themselves at the feet of Cameron the second it looks clear that Brown's continuation will lead to 'social unrest'. In fact, I think this is already happening. I haven't seen any evidence of social unrest here.........YET The political elite will be very concerned about events in Iceland. Although their PM has stood down, there are not going to be immediate elections and thus, protesters are keeping up their vigil outside the Icelandic parliament and the Icelandic central bank and demanding immediate elections and the resignation of the government and the head of the central bank Brown attempts to palm off the blame for his appalling management of the UK economy is not going work As soon as people realize what a terrible mess we are in, there will be civil unrest on a HUGE scale. We are talking about MASS unemployment, MASS seizure of homes and businesses and the destruction of pensions, savings and investments........fiscal armageddon frankly. Once that happens, and it ain't far away, Brown will be finished, Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Crossbow Posted January 24, 2009 Share Posted January 24, 2009 Gordon Brown, Tony Blair and the scum they lead are responsible for the destruction of my country.Last last time this scum was in power we were treated to years of socialist clap-trap and neo communist policies which very nearly destroyed the UK economy. It took Margaret Thatchers government 11 years to put it right. This time is different however. Not only have Labour destroyed the economy once more, they have irreparably damaged the social fabric of the country. Most of our cities resemble third world indian / pakistan sub continent cities or great swathes of them are like eastern europe. In some places, Leicester, Preston, Dagenham to name a few Labours policies have discriminated against our own people to such an extent they feel like second class citizens in their own country. Not content with this, Labour insists we must 'respect' these people and have strangled freedom of speech to ensure that any criticism of their dogma or any criticism of the results of their immigration policies will result in losing your job, or being prosecuted under their hate crime - or as it more properly should be called 'islamic protection' legislation. Not only that but they have systematically gone about destroying our education system with their politically correct dogmas....teaching children diversity studies instead of maths and english. You only need to interview a few 16 - 18 year old job applicants to understand the effects. Bottom line they have woven this nonsense into the fabric of our society and it will take YEARS for the next government to rectiy it, if it ever can be rectified, and thus opens the door to extreme solutions such as the BNP's policies. And the best bit?..........NO ONE IS ALLOWED TO SAY SO!!!!!!! Freedom of speech and expression, unless of course it is the rights of Muslims to threaten to kill us all in a 'jihad' is the price we all pay. No-one gave Labour, Blair and Brown permission to do this to the United Kingdom. These people not just be voted out, they should be put on trial for treason and imprisoned for the rest of their lives Heartfelt points and I applaud you for making them. If only we had free speech in this country you would be able to make them without fear of attack. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest mattsta1964 Posted January 24, 2009 Share Posted January 24, 2009 we will never know and you may well be right.But the fact of the matter is labour govs have form on driving the country into financial crisis imf style and pound in your pocket devaluation what is different this time is the media control which prevents open debate of the truth. That opens a can of worms for those responsible for the media i am thinking bbc. The consequences of the mess we are in might finish the post war 2 party state forever. That's how bad things could get It's anyone's guess what the political situation will be in 2 years time Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bogbrush Posted January 24, 2009 Share Posted January 24, 2009 Highly selective, isn't it.Annoying thing: if you see any programme about Iceland, even the humblest cod filleter will make the connection between the madness of banks and the failure of regulation. Somehow it's different here. I know don't about JD. DD is a Tory, there's no question about that. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ah-so Posted January 24, 2009 Share Posted January 24, 2009 On the Today programme, Evan Davies tried to nail him on the "End to Boom and Bust", but never drove it home. What really annoyed me was Davies' acceptance that the economic crisis was unforeseeable, so pretty much let Brown off. Well we bloody well foresaw it. We have been tapping away at this site for 5 years saying just that. The raison d'etre of this site early on was to expose the housing bubble. Perhaps the collapse of Britain's banks was not expected, but we all foresaw something pretty big on the way. Nor did he push the point that this "Global Crisis" is hitting Britain worse than anywhere, with the exception of Iceland and Ireland. Beating Brown up should be the easiest game in town. Davies' performance was pretty poor. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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