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redwing

A New Wave Of Entryism On Hpc.co.uk

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This month has seen a whole new bunch of HPC users. Most have described themselves as Bears. However, a great proportion are bulls.

They are coming up with all the property bull stuff that I thought we'd dealt with fairly comprehensively - even before the credit crunch really got underway in August 2007.

It's time to OUT some of these bulls.

Loopholes - joined 13 Jan - status = neither. link to post

Well, they say that all is fair in love and war, but not so with property dealings. If the property was once on at 200.000, why on earth would someone accept 97,000? I find it a tad far fetched TBH. Unless the sellers bought the house in the early 70's for 500.00, had no loans secured on it what soever and were wishing to live in a caravan on the Isle of Sky, what would be the point of them selling at

such a loss. I doubt the property was actually originally 100% over valued even by current figures.

Hairy - joined 15 Jan - status = bear. Link

I have been reading doom and gloom all around, mainly from a lot of people with something to gain from spreading the doom and gloom but the bare facts seem to be, from what I have understood of the situation, is that there is a shortfall in housing stock in the SE, that the current fall in the market is based on global conditions, and that inside 2 years, there will be a recovery.

I am all ears about this as I do intend buying a couple more properties, in the same location, in the near future. My own house was valued at £400k 8 months ago and £330k last month. The valuation was stable last week.

Shergar75 - joined 16 Dec - status = bear. link

I came into some money lately enough for me to put down a nice deposit on say a 115grand property and have a decent morgage payment on the remainder....People keep telling me to stay put as there is still 30percent to come of house prices but it just does not seem to be happening in Edinburgh....The other thing i wanted to know was does it really matter that much if i bought just now and then there was a big crash as long as i kept the flat for say 25years....my parents lifes depend on your advice..if nobody replies to this i will understand...Ime 23 by the way to old to be with mum and dad...my brother left years ago..he laughs at me..
Almost incomprehensible - but essentially bullish.

Shooting fish in a barrel time..

HAMISH_MCFARTFACE, status neither, joined 8 Dec

This may yet get much worse. But the recovery will be far quicker than the last crash's charts seem to suggest.

and much much more of the same sort of utter rubbish.

w_n_s joined 19 Jan. status=bull link

Also, lets not forget that there are supposedly LOTS of FTB's out there holding off. Can they all stay where they are forever??? I'm assuming circumstances will change for some and they'll soon be forced to have to make a choice. You could see a snowball effect in that once some FTB's start to move, the rest follow suit. This probably won't cause a rise in prices, but will see less houses available.
Quite timid really.

Rumour joined Today, status=neither link

Personally, I think there is a boat to miss in the housing market...

When the bottom is in sight sellers no longer have as much incentive to accept significantly lower offers on their properties. Therefore as the bottom nears I believe there is a reduction in the gap between asking price and price paid. The true bottom will therefore be different for each individual case but for many we may well have already passed it (those who are currently getting very low offers accepted).

Shortage of housing stock and pent up demand could mean there is in fact a bounce rather than a protracted bottom to this fall particularly when credit restrictions are eased and people once again join the national obsession of getting on the housing ladder

Come on everybody - let's buy a house!

and more from Rumour

If someone was thinking about buying a year ago and waited to see what happened to the market they will be jumping back in soon along with a new generation of buy-to-lettors and bargain hunters. Those renting a 2 bed flat for £800 a month will soon be rethinking their position when they can get a mortgage for £800 a month on a nice semi.

multiple migs joined 5 Jan status=bear link

apparently house prices have fallen circa 20% from peak on average from oct 2007. i dont think there is anything to worry about as prices will soon return to these peak levels

What's going on? It hasn't been this bad since we got bombarded by the BNP. There must be an awful lot of bored estate agents out there with absolutely nothing to do.

Or is that we are still in the denial stages. Surely not. It's sheer panic out there. These guys are 5hitting their pants. What I don't get is why they want to expose themselves here.

And top marks to Si1 for his valiant efforts to single-handedly fight off the hordes.

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Possibly some of the new members think this is a forum without any discussion , just put in your opinion and no need to research it. So they see doom and gloom but missed out on all the graphs and long boring posts.

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I'd like to vote in favour of HAMISH_MCFARTFACE. He may take the p*ss once in a while (don't we all?), but some of the points he makes are quite good. I don't think this site would benefit by excluding statements that run counter to its overall bearish stance.

There must be an awful lot of bored estate agents out there with absolutely nothing to do.

Some of the angriest and stupidest posts from recent newcomers can only have come from EAs about to lose their jobs I think. There were a couple of incompenent videos linked to in posts by newcomers that were particularly pitiable.

Edited by williamdb

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A lot of newcomers have been attracted to the site following the onset of HPC and when you join, you have to state, bull, bear or neither, but a lot of people don't know what these mean.

Unless you follow finance closely, they are terms rarely used in the headlines by the media either. Many people in denial about HPC don't even know that they are a 'bull.' Being called a bear sounds, well, more cuddly in a Winnie-the-Pooh sort of way. :rolleyes:

Edited by deflation

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This month has seen a whole new bunch of HPC users. Most have described themselves as Bears. However, a great proportion are bulls.

They are coming up with all the property bull stuff that I thought we'd dealt with fairly comprehensively - even before the credit crunch really got underway in August 2007.

It's time to OUT some of these bulls.

Loopholes - joined 13 Jan - status = neither. link to post

Hairy - joined 15 Jan - status = bear. Link

Shergar75 - joined 16 Dec - status = bear. link

Almost incomprehensible - but essentially bullish.

Shooting fish in a barrel time..

HAMISH_MCFARTFACE, status neither, joined 8 Dec

and much much more of the same sort of utter rubbish.

w_n_s joined 19 Jan. status=bull link

Quite timid really.

Rumour joined Today, status=neither link

Come on everybody - let's buy a house!

and more from Rumour

multiple migs joined 5 Jan status=bear link

What's going on? It hasn't been this bad since we got bombarded by the BNP. There must be an awful lot of bored estate agents out there with absolutely nothing to do.

Or is that we are still in the denial stages. Surely not. It's sheer panic out there. These guys are 5hitting their pants. What I don't get is why they want to expose themselves here.

And top marks to Si1 for his valiant efforts to single-handedly fight off the hordes.

Are you a self-appointed groupthink mindguard? :lol:

I quite like reading contradictory views or opinions expressed by the majority here FWIW.

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I'm new here, but I've been on the main article forum since at least mid 2004, as 'paul'.

We've had people posting odd comments under false identities there but the Admin fixed the issue by having all usernames in lowercase.

There are definitely people with a lot at stake who would like to instill less confidence in the mainstream views here on the direction of the housing market - and some of them I suspect (in fact I know David Smith from The Sunday Times has posted here under a false name because he said almost the same thing - parrot fashion - on his blog ten minuted later) have much more at stake than a couple of BTL properties.

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the thing that really winds me up is those who describe themselves as 'neither', as opposed to bull or bear, but are very blatantly on here to talk up prices.

that said, it is a bit of a shame when things get overly bearish, e.g. when someone says, 'oh, that's a nice enough place, it's overvalued no doubt but you can see why it'd be worth a lot' and gets shouted down & more or less told to agree that the place is a worthless shithole.

Edited by the flying pig

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noone knows whats going to happen. either way I couldn't care less - we're all fooked one way or another. I like discussions that explore all possibilities for crashes and rises. It's even better due to the fact that these economic factors have never happened before so everyone is blind as to what could happen next.

I also find it funny how worked up some people get about it all. :lol:

p.s.

When I signed up, I didn't know what Bull or Bear meant and chose one at random! I stick by that choice! :P

Anyway, i'm hooked, and this thread is pointless. People can have opinions either way and it doesn't necessarily mean they are right / wrong or talking the market up or down. It's only an opinion and I for one like reading peoples.

EDIT

The more I think about it, the more i think the original poster is poo'ing his own pants incase prices do go up, because he's been waiting around these forums for 3 years waiting for a crash and if it doesn't happen soon, he can soon see those 3 years as being a waste of time when he could have bought in 2005. Can't see any other reason for the existance of this thread.

Edited by w_n_s

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<br />I'd like to vote in favour of HAMISH_MCFARTFACE. He may take the p*ss once in a while (don't we all?), but some of the points he makes are quite good. I don't think this site would benefit by excluding statements that run counter to its overall bearish stance.<br /><br /><br /><br />Some of the angriest and stupidest posts from recent newcomers can only have come from EAs about to lose their jobs I think. There were a couple of incompenent videos linked to in posts by newcomers that were particularly pitiable.<br />
<br /><br /><br />

Is there really a poster called HAMISH MCFARTFACE?

That is the best user name in the known universe.

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i didnt know what a bull or bear was at first so i put neither. then i went and found out what it meant and changed to bear. all newbies should start as sheep then they get the choice to change! :lol: i actually started a topic a bit similar to this stating how so many newbies have 2 posts then ask when should i buy.

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To be fair, the first quote from Loopholes is a bad example

<Quote>

Well, they say that all is fair in love and war, but not so with property dealings. If the property was once on at 200.000, why on earth would someone accept 97,000? I find it a tad far fetched TBH. Unless the sellers bought the house in the early 70's for 500.00, had no loans secured on it what soever and were wishing to live in a caravan on the Isle of Sky, what would be the point of them selling at

such a loss. I doubt the property was actually originally 100% over valued even by current figures.

</Quote>

There's still enough numpties out there who would jump at thirty percent off. If you had an offer of 97K for your place that was valued at 200K and you were really desperate, you'd ring up Sibley and offer it to him for a 'cheap' 150K :lol: .

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<br /><br /><br />

Is there really a poster called HAMISH MCFARTFACE?

That is the best user name in the known universe.

Jimothy, you have the funniest avatar in the universe - I crack up every time i see it. :lol:

(I hope that isn't you :huh: )

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1 more... bruno is back he has created a number of accounts and only posted links to his youtube, with alternative titles...

Edited by moosetea

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This month has seen a whole new bunch of HPC users. Most have described themselves as Bears. However, a great proportion are bulls.....

What I find annoying is that the influx of new posters is rapidly burying what made this site the awesome site it was. Chartists, survivalists, bankers and genuinely clever people producing top quality analysis that was both interesting and often prophetic.

I don't mind genuinely thought out bullishness. As Hamish has found out you can't make blase statements and expect to get away with it here. To be fair he's upped his game. I still think he's wrong mind. Even Sibbers has his purpose. Believe it or not the vast majority of the U.K. populace do not think like hpc'ers. They think more like the delightful sibbers. When reality bites I reckon we'll see divorce, riots, suicide and chaos...

Oops... compared to most I'm a new poster... adding to a thread doing what I decry. Ah well.

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<br /><br /><br />

Is there really a poster called HAMISH MCFARTFACE?

That is the best user name in the known universe.

:):):) With a name like that he can't be so bad can he?

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Throw them in the river. If they drown they are innocent bears. If they float they are bulls and we can hang them.

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To be fair, had I thought of that, I'd absolutely have used it. :lol:

Awww, I had my hopes up for a moment. :(

MCTAVISH is just sh*t!

Only joking. :P

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People are entitled to hold whatever views they want to hold and to express them as they see fit.

If you don't like what they say, either reply to set the record straight as you see it or ignore them.

Indeed, setting up a bit of a strawman or Aunt Sally can be quite a useful way of getting things sorted in your own mind.

I object to the idea behind this thread.

If you want all encompassing group think and the silencing of contrary voices may I suggest the Labour Party Conference instead?

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I can't see that this particularly matters, considering the passing of time is going to conclusively prove their views to be incorrect. Even if it were possible to 'talk the market up' at this stage, which seems a complete impossibility to me, a few 'bullish' internet posts are going to be difficult to hear above the cacophony of doom broadcast by the mainstream media.

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Bring on the bulls......

A few contrary voices leads to a more informed debate. Some of the newbies (and you will probably think I am one...lurked since Nov 07 honest!) have their own vested interests or are naive, but will probably change their views as they spend more time on the site reading threads and articles. (I know I have).

For what its worth...Hairy sounds like a bit of a troll to me. From th linked thread he claims to have bought last month with a 90% LTV BTL IO mortgage. I can't be bothered to research it but does such a product currently exist? Personally I doubt it. Even i he is for real, he has just bought .....he has a VI. His research included discussions with an Estate Agent....well it must be true....and his recent valuation of his property that is steady at £330K...I wonder if an estate agent did the valuation? Maybe he was gelling his hair and straightening his 'large knotted' tie in the mirror when he was talking to the aforementioned Estate Agent!!!! ;)

Below is a cracker from Loopholes. I read this a couple of days ago on the market psychology forum. It's not quite as special as the thread about the lady from Tamworth who wanted to just say NO to lower house prices, but it is close. Not even the mighty moo from Maidstone could keep a straight face while saying this!!!

So, if you do not offer your house for sale, that makes it sound as if it is still worth what you paid for it ;-)

Also, a house is worth what the owner is willing to sell it for, why do people assume that every house for sale is fair game for a massive price reduction.

The vast majority of houses for sale have NOT reduced their for sale prices, they are NOT under reposession orders or bereavement sales and therefore NOT fair game for ridiculous offers as many people are claiming they are.

I cannot believe that quite so many are assuming the whole country is desperate to sell their properties at any cost.

Anyway, live and let live I say. If they stay on the site we can watch their growth and development until they start pooing in the woods!!!

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  • 284 Brexit, House prices and Summer 2020

    1. 1. Including the effects Brexit, where do you think average UK house prices will be relative to now in June 2020?


      • down 5% +
      • down 2.5%
      • Even
      • up 2.5%
      • up 5%



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