pilchardthecat Posted January 22, 2009 Share Posted January 22, 2009 Surely there will be lots of people largely uneffected by the catastrophe, they will keep their jobs and homes, and their children will be warm in their beds? And eventually, we will adjust our consumption/way of life and trudge on... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
clubberdude Posted January 22, 2009 Share Posted January 22, 2009 Possibly, assuming hyperinflation does not occur, and the economy isn't totally annihilated. Sadly i'm not so convinced anymore that it will all just blow over. Put it this way, i'd be feeling a lot better if this government "did nothing". Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Confounded Posted January 22, 2009 Share Posted January 22, 2009 Surely there will be lots of people largely uneffected by the catastrophe, they will keep their jobs and homes, and their children will be warm in their beds?And eventually, we will adjust our consumption/way of life and trudge on... Lets hope so, the evidence is to the contrary though. The trouble with building a faith based economy is when that faith is lost you have no economy! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
pilchardthecat Posted January 22, 2009 Author Share Posted January 22, 2009 So if hyperinflation is the danger, how will this effect people who are still in work? surely employers will have to make monthly/weekly/daily pay adjustments in order to keep their businesses alive (nobody's actually going to come to work if their monthly salary is effectively 5p) Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
50%deposit Posted January 22, 2009 Share Posted January 22, 2009 Surely there will be lots of people largely uneffected by the catastrophe, they will keep their jobs and homes, and their children will be warm in their beds?And eventually, we will adjust our consumption/way of life and trudge on... i dont think too many people are aware of whats going on. I remember never noticing the 1990's depression at all. I was at university, the first i heard of it was this year really. Might have heard the news etc, but it never sunk in. Its not really much of a crash in my opinion, yet at least. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
VeryMeanReversion Posted January 22, 2009 Share Posted January 22, 2009 It will all blow over, leaving a lower standing of living in its wake. (mixing my metaphors but who cares). Those that lose their jobs and/or with excessive debts will be the hardest hit. The rest will just cut back yet still feel hard done by. VMR. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Soul Reaver Posted January 22, 2009 Share Posted January 22, 2009 Surely there will be lots of people largely uneffected by the catastrophe, they will keep their jobs and homes, and their children will be warm in their beds?And eventually, we will adjust our consumption/way of life and trudge on... Of course it will! Humans have suffered some terrible things over the years including numerous total civilisation collapses and yet we still have the internet, x factor and got to the moon (maybe) What you are really asking is "Will it blow over soon so I can stop worrying get back to Strictly whilst planning my next holiday in the Med Ahh the dream of all mankind ehh to live a simple uncomplicated life! Even in the worst recessions or depressions there are still people working and taking holidays. If we have total global financial collapse (we wont) Then it would be game over for years, Mad Max tin foil and generally not a nice place to be. Don't forget a recession is all about perspective. If you have a million quid then it's a buying opportunity and your lifestyle does not change. If You're up to your neck in debt and relying on a job then you will be constantly worried for the duration! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bagsos Posted January 22, 2009 Share Posted January 22, 2009 It will all blow over, leaving a lower standing of living in its wake. (mixing my metaphors but who cares).Those that lose their jobs and/or with excessive debts will be the hardest hit. The rest will just cut back yet still feel hard done by. VMR. Exactly - but, as in the 1970's, our standard of living will only be lower to the extent that imports are more expensive and therefore relative to those parts of the world that are less affected than us. Could we see Gordon doing a modern day equivalent of Harold Wilson's "pound in your pocket" speech (lie) soon I wonder? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
5 year plan Posted January 22, 2009 Share Posted January 22, 2009 I'm still going to hide food on the moors though, Just to be "sure"... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
gilf Posted January 22, 2009 Share Posted January 22, 2009 Surely there will be lots of people largely uneffected by the catastrophe, they will keep their jobs and homes, and their children will be warm in their beds?And eventually, we will adjust our consumption/way of life and trudge on... Yeah if you look back over history you will see how successfully the Romans, Greeks, Egyptians all turned it round when things started to slide. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
pilchardthecat Posted January 22, 2009 Author Share Posted January 22, 2009 What you are really asking is "Will it blow over soon so I can stop worrying get back to Strictly whilst planning my next holiday in the Med Ahh the dream of all mankind ehh to live a simple uncomplicated life! Not at all - holiday's in Devon, don't watch reality TV... I haven't borrowed excessively although i do have a mortgage (2x salary) and a car HP that represents about 10% net income. No other debts. What worries me is that the recklessness of others might threaten my family's security, safety, etc Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
thecrashingisles Posted January 22, 2009 Share Posted January 22, 2009 (edited) Capitalism is resilient. Life and the economy will go on, but asset prices will not go back up to bubble levels. People whose wealth depended on these valuations will get wiped out. Edited January 22, 2009 by thecrashingisles Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Gone baby gone Posted January 22, 2009 Share Posted January 22, 2009 What worries me is that the recklessness of others might threaten my family's security, safety, etc I don't think it will come to that. I would not be surprised to see some rioting in UK city centres if very unpopular decisions are made this year or next, but I don't think we are going to see the complete breakdown of everything. Just my opinion. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest sillybear2 Posted January 22, 2009 Share Posted January 22, 2009 Possibly, assuming hyperinflation does not occur, and the economy isn't totally annihilated.Sadly i'm not so convinced anymore that it will all just blow over. Put it this way, i'd be feeling a lot better if this government "did nothing". There will be two very positive outcomes after it has all blown over :- 1. People will see the banksters for the unproductive parasites that they are and never trust them again. 2. There will never ever be another Labour government again. Two very important structural changes. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The Spaniard Posted January 22, 2009 Share Posted January 22, 2009 To paraphrase John Maynard Keynes, eventually we're all dead. For any future genetically engineered immortals, in due course our sun explodes and engulfs the Earth. Some time later the whole universe disappears into a big black hole (given enough dark matter). Let's get a sense of perspective. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest sillybear2 Posted January 22, 2009 Share Posted January 22, 2009 Some time later the whole universe disappears into a big black hole (given enough dark matter). I bet our debt still lingers. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Gone baby gone Posted January 22, 2009 Share Posted January 22, 2009 There will be two very positive outcomes after it has all blown over :-1. People will see the banksters for the unproductive parasites that they are and never trust them again. 2. There will never ever be another Labour government again. Two very important structural changes. I think you're right on both points. This whole episode has lifted the rock on the global banking community and now members of the public can see the cockroaches in the daylight. Acquaintances who previously thought of banks as a fairly benign force are now questioning their actions and motives. Unfortunately there probably will be another Labour government at some point in the future, but after this I would expect to see 20+ years out of power, plus a 'rebranding' Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
chichi Posted January 22, 2009 Share Posted January 22, 2009 Possibly, assuming hyperinflation does not occur, and the economy isn't totally annihilated.Sadly i'm not so convinced anymore that it will all just blow over. Put it this way, i'd be feeling a lot better if this government "did nothing". I'm worried that doing nothing was the best option. Letting markets correct themself whilst saving the bits that need saving (ie: my savings!) would have been a much better idea. But they're so obssessed with the idea that an economy built on debt is a good thing that they can't see beyond that. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rick62 Posted January 22, 2009 Share Posted January 22, 2009 What I think we will see is an economic re-alignment. Where for the past 10 years we have enjoyed a livestyle far beyond our means based on cheap credit and illustrated by our balance of payments deficit of about £200 billion a year (i.e. we spend that much more than we actually make, including services) this will not be possible in the future. With a weaker pound and no more credit available, either to the government or individuals we will have to live within our means. This means less new cars (mostly imported) and more old bangers (maintained by local mechanics) less sunny med holidays and more camping in wales and more watching the pennies at the supermarket. Much like our parents in the 60's. Except with a greater population and less nuclear family units its not so much fun having no money in a new build flat on your own as it is with a family in a decent house with a garden. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Selling up Posted January 22, 2009 Share Posted January 22, 2009 Yeah if you look back over history you will see how successfully the Romans, Greeks, Egyptians all turned it round when things started to slide. This is very relevant. BUT remember that the decline of the Roman Empire was clearer to historians than to the population at the time. The last century of the Western Roman Empire (around 400-500 AD) is considered its period of "decline and fall". But people continued to live in Rome even beyond its "fall" (a military coup by Germanic soldiers formerly under the command of the empire). They they worked, they had children. They just happened not to be living in the capital of a great empire. Some luxury goods from the far shores would have become unavailable or prohibitively expensive. Fewer books were written. Technical expertise was lost and technology regressed (Until the Renaissance there was nothing to match the grandeur of the Roman aqueducts). But it was not Mad Max. It was a slide over generations from dominance to obscurity. Life went on, with incessant minor setbacks. Presumably those so inclined would have seen numerous "green shoots of recovery" throughout the process. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
chichi Posted January 22, 2009 Share Posted January 22, 2009 What I think we will see is an economic re-alignment. Where for the past 10 years we have enjoyed a livestyle far beyond our means based on cheap credit and illustrated by our balance of payments deficit of about £200 billion a year (i.e. we spend that much more than we actually make, including services) this will not be possible in the future. So if you didn't live it up in debt you should have? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Johnny Cash Posted January 22, 2009 Share Posted January 22, 2009 This is very relevant.BUT remember that the decline of the Roman Empire was clearer to historians than to the population at the time. The last century of the Western Roman Empire (around 400-500 AD) is considered its period of "decline and fall". But people continued to live in Rome even beyond its "fall" (a military coup by Germanic soldiers formerly under the command of the empire). They they worked, they had children. They just happened not to be living in the capital of a great empire. Some luxury goods from the far shores would have become unavailable or prohibitively expensive. Fewer books were written. Technical expertise was lost and technology regressed (Until the Renaissance there was nothing to match the grandeur of the Roman aqueducts). But it was not Mad Max. It was a slide over generations from dominance to obscurity. Life went on, with incessant minor setbacks. Presumably those so inclined would have seen numerous "green shoots of recovery" throughout the process. BUT Things happen much more quickly today. Back then, it would take weeks to get a message from Rome to an outlying part of the empire, today, it's instant. Back then markets would move very slowly, even in the aftermath of some major event or tragedy, today all information is instantly available. Just food for thought... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
VeryMeanReversion Posted January 22, 2009 Share Posted January 22, 2009 Surely there will be lots of people largely uneffected by the catastrophe, they will keep their jobs and homes, and their children will be warm in their beds?And eventually, we will adjust our consumption/way of life and trudge on... Just call Wendy, Bob said he could fix it. VMR. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest sillybear2 Posted January 22, 2009 Share Posted January 22, 2009 (edited) Fewer books were written. Technical expertise was lost and technology regressed (Until the Renaissance there was nothing to match the grandeur of the Roman aqueducts).But it was not Mad Max. It was a slide over generations from dominance to obscurity. Life went on, with incessant minor setbacks. Presumably those so inclined would have seen numerous "green shoots of recovery" throughout the process. Exactly, the thing about declining societies is the inability to prove a negative, it's very much like debt, your future is stolen from you, and as a society we can't appreciate what should have been. It's pretty obvious when you look around this country and appreciate the legacy of our crumbling infrastructure still in use today, built at the zenith of the British Empire, the UK should be in a far better position, especially given the size of our population and potential labour pool combined with the potential productivity of modern technology. People confuse slowing our rate of stagnation and regression with progress itself. Personally I think it's all about land, its use and its ownership. Any progress seen over recent decades is simply a product of our shadow slave, oil. Edited January 22, 2009 by sillybear2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rosepetal Posted January 22, 2009 Share Posted January 22, 2009 Has everyone taken happy pills? This is a lot more upbeat than the normal HPC thread. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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