EUBanana

The Prime Minister and Minister for Europe are both members of the EU executive, so technically yes, even before going further.

What makes you think anybody who wants to leave disagrees? Why do you think there were calls from Farage et al for a referendum? If Parliament was representative you'd not need a referendum, ever. The only point of a referendum was to appeal to an authority above even Parliament, because Parliament itself has become a conspiracy against the people. These arguments about this all consuming blob monster that we've suddenly woke up to find ourselves enmeshed in after 40 years just prove that that analysis is absolutely spot on. The frog was being boiled slowly but it's finally cottoned on.

This thread is quite shocking, and indicative of the lies that have emanated from the EU over the years that have led us to this point. The EU has gone from something which was a "trifling thing really, worried about by political anoraks and obsessives only, an irrelevance to the rest of us and absolutely no limit on parliamentary sovereignty" to something which is so deeply entrenched, so all consuming and all pervading that extricating ourselves from it's Cthulhoid grip will take twice as long as defeating the Nazis did. I think if we accept the Remoaner arguments about the insuperable difficulties of leaving then it has to be accepted that the entire thing was also a gigantic con and that the worst fears of the wingnuts like Bill Cash and Farage were actually on the nail all along. I'm not sure this position helps the Remoaner side.

Lucky slebs. They tend to love tax after all. They should be so happy!

Last I heard they've basically given up, she's being put onto the old style JSA instead. She has a whole bunch more forms to fill out. Not backdated... naturally. It's being treated as a brand new claim, with UC being discreetly forgotten.

It's a hell of a lot effort for a pittance, I'll say that much.

Well, the latest, as of today, is that we've been told to ignore everything we've already filled out and done ( everything is done as a family in UC so I had all the rigmarole of turning up as well even though I'm working - online ID verification, bank statements, tenancy agreement, interview with a Jobcentre dude, the full monty even for me) and that she has to fill out some forms they would email her straight away. Forms have not yet arrived. Fack knows what's going on but smooth and by the numbers it ain't.

It's just not ready. The staff are sympathetic and trying their hardest, but it just does not appear to work. The IT is a shambles. She's had to apply 3 times now, every single time something happens that means she goes back to square 1. It's not backdated either so she's lost out on 2 weeks and counting of benefits so far. The situation for someone who has no income and no savings who is reliant on UC would be truly, truly dire based on my experience. I can see why people hit up Wonga for a loan.

My wife is attempting to sign up with UC right now. I say this as an anecdote from a right winger: it's a complete catastrophe. God help anybody who actually needs UC to survive, for the wife it's fortunately mostly an optional thing. (Need it for NI subs more than anything else). Ridiculous delays, IT failures, all the rest - and the money doesn't show up until over a month after you apply.

It's just the usual false consciousness rot. Sore loser can't believe the thick plebs don't think like them, must be lies / demagoguery / sunspots that have warped their lil minds.

In Corbyn's case he's a party leader who looks to control policy, in Brexit's case it's a referendum looking for an answer to 1 question - which wsa not (directly) about the NHS. It is absolutely true that we could spend the EU contribution on the NHS instead, if parliament so chose.

I don't think anybody bar a few nutters 'call themselves neofascists'.

So when Corbyn says lets ditch Trident and spend it on schools n hospitals - this is different?

Using a treaty. When did treaties become a constitutional override?

Problem is trust in the Establishment is low - thanks to their own antics. The judges may well be right, I imagine quite a lot of people are past caring.

You ought to feel ashamed. These guys won the referendum and are being suppressed, and you call THEM fascists? The fascists are the ones in Brussels who have made undermining democratic nations a way of life.

The world turned upside down. The oligarchs are now democrats and the democrats are fascists.

Yup. Ditto the slump in the pound.

And if you're not in government housing, you're facked.

Has that gone down the memory hole already? http://www.zerohedge.com/news/2016-05-09/camerons-project-fear-goes-full-mad-vote-no-brexit-or-face-world-war-3

Top trolling. Has WW3 started yet because of Brexit?

The advantage of an unwritten constitution is that we get to make it up as we go along. If they back down on Brexit there may well be trouble. If cannons are the last argument of kings, the last argument of democrats are pitchforks.

But a Frenchman living in France is. The EU is 510 million people, quite a lot of whom are significantly poorer than us, in many cases desperately poor. You don't need to add Russia on top of this to cause a problem. On top of that we don't have a contributions based benefit system but a more Marxist "you get what you need" based benefits system which is easily abused by people who would be living on a roundabout in Romania otherwise.

No opt out of free movement of people though, and that's an issue quite high on the agenda of the electorate.

What we're experiencing is proof that elections are not very democratic.