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House Price Crash Forum


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Posts posted by cnick

  1. On 14/10/2021 at 09:21, rantnrave said:

    Capitalism in this country died when the banks were bailed out. What should have been a significant house price collapse then was staved off by massive money printing and wave after wave of government intervention. We've had a version of crony capitalism since then - with a corresponding misallocation of economic resources and zombified businesses kept alive by ultra low interest rates. Moral hazard abounds.

    When I see reports that today's younger people are massively against capitalism, I think it gets lost that if the banks had not been bailed out in 2008, by now the relationship between hard work, earnings and property prices might have been restored. Didn't Iceland protect retail deposits, let the banks collapse, lob a few bankers in jail to make a point, endure a couple of years of hardship then bounce back stronger?

    Capitalism has always had an element of creative destruction. Business enterprises have always run the risk of failure, and the resources they take up then being reallocated to more profitable initiatives. Never has capitalism been about everybody winning all the time, and anyone in danger of losing receiving a state bailout. That is however where things seem to be at today.

    A separate question is whether that necessary destructive element and the short to medium term hardship it inflicts is compatible with democratic cycles of five years or less. Increasingly, politicians in this country and elsewhere don't seem to think it is. The Chinese authorities of course don't have to worry about such issues.

    Post of the year?

    Under capitalism interest rates would have been a measure of scarcity of money....... interest rates should be akin to a pressure gauge....... but all governments have locked the pressure gauge to under read.

    Should this be taught in schools?



  2. 1 hour ago, iamnumerate said:

    I voted Tory last time and however if there had been a reasonable party that didn't support HPI that might have got my vote.

    However there was a party of any type that didn't support HPI so I am not sure you are right.

    Of course I fear I am not typical of voters (of any party).

    I suggested to our mp that perhaps the young should be educated as to the reasons house ownership is now beyond most of them........ but I guess that would not be allowed under the new hatred incitement laws.


  3. 5 minutes ago, jonb2 said:

    Edited for accuracy. Regulation has been out the windows since Thatcher and Reagan. It lead to the GFC and an 80% ownership of the media by right wing billionaires. The theft of trillions from the 99% too.

    "An attempt by the CFTC to regulate OTC derivatives in 1998 was rejected by Alan Greenspan, then Chairman of the Federal Reserve, Robert E. Rubin, then Secretary of the Treasury, and Lawrence ("Larry") H. Summers, then Assistant Secretary of the Treasury.  At the time, regulation ran counter to the dominant ideology in Washington D.C., which reflected the views and interests of the banking and financial services industry.

    Despite early warnings such as the bankruptcy of Orange County, California, the Proctor & Gamble lawsuit against Bankers Trust and the failure of Long Term Capital Management (LTCM), the President's Working Group on Financial Markets described OTC derivatives in November 1999 as an important innovation that had "transformed the world of finance, increasing the range of financial products available to corporations and investors and fostering more precise ways of understanding, quantifying, and managing risk."  In 2000 Greenspan, Rubin and Summers backed deregulation of OTC derivatives."



    Couldn't agree more as regards the bankers.....but has all the bankers' thin air fraud 'money' paid for the welfare / workers rights that has saddled the west with overheads China does not have?


  4. 12 hours ago, Mikhail Liebenstein said:

    This is worth a read.


    It does some what dispel the idea of some of the Brexit classes that its all those "furriners coming over and buying our houses and cutting wages"

    Essentially the blame lies with interest rates.

    Interest rates are the effect..... the root cause is the over supply of thin air fraud credit.


  5. 15 hours ago, jonb2 said:


    Thatcher was told to lose manufacturing as the BIg Bang would sort out everything. Enter stage 'Prof' Patrick Minford who had her ear and hasn't stopped talking shit since.

    MPs react after Vote Leave economist admits Brexit would 'mostly eliminate manufacturing'


    The devastating future for Welsh manufacturing predicted by a Brexit economist - and why he said it was a good thing



    He said the same thing about farming - throw it to the wolves.



    You can see the naked ideology with this Brexit High Priest. Jobs and prosperity for the masses are to be dismissed with a wave of Jacob Rees-Mogg's limp wrist.


    Yes, but Skargill et al predated Thatcher?..... some say Thatcher could not have existed without Scargill, as it were? 

  6. 16 hours ago, kzb said:

    Since they are not doing any of these things there cannot be a problem can there?

    Yes. If there was an envirnmental problem, they would stop the quest for never ending growth.......aka fraud thin air credit money printing.

    ......also there'd be no need for energy hungry crypto if the mad money printing ended.(?)

  7. 13 minutes ago, nero120 said:

    Pardon my ignorance, but don't you need "capital" (i.e. "savings") to have capitalism? Remember, debt is not capital, and most governments (especially in the West) wouldn't know the meaning of living within their means. So then, what exactly have we been living through since the 80s because it doesn't much resemble capitalism...

    When you say 'debt is not capital'..... do you mean debt for money earned honestly (is capital)....or debt for 'money'  created from thin air (is not capital).

  8. 2 hours ago, TheCountOfNowhere said:



    "Bail-in is one of the stabilisation tools available to the Bank as resolution authority under the Banking Act 2009. Bail-in ensures investors, rather than public funds, bear losses where a firm fails. "


    Dont say you weren't warned.

    They're coming for your cash

    Thankfully, we're a democracy, so we can vote to prevent this.

    ...oh hang on....

  9. 50 minutes ago, zugzwang said:

    The financialisation of Western economies should never have been allowed to happen (1980-the present). The Glass-Steagall Act should never have been repealed (1999). The Financial Services Authority should never been set up (2001). Thatcher's 'Big Bang' should have been aborted or reversed (1986). The shadow banking system should have been regulated to within an inch of its life (circa 1980 to the present). A belief that there can be profit without production should never have been allowed to direct govt policy.

    Great.... thanks for the clarity. 

    Your last sentence is (or should be?) an absolute capitalist principle.......or, at least  profit for production of goods and services at the market rate.......ie where the state 'pays' rather than 'sets' the market rate.


  10. 40 minutes ago, zugzwang said:

    The GFC was the greatest financial crisis the world has ever seen. A second Great Depression was averted only because of the co-ordinated response of the world's central banks. Without it economic output would have been depressed for decades and we'd have had 25% unemployment and millions starving.

    So what should have been done to avert GFC?.....would it have involved a quest for never ending growth?  (not rhetorical)

  11. On 28/07/2021 at 17:39, Horseradish said:

     The true cause is low interest rates, because low interest rates lead to skyrocketing asset prices. So there's only one thing that will kill this goddamn market off, and it's increased interest rates.


    Yes but what is the root cause for manipulating interest rates.....seldom discussed here these days?

    Is it not the unique ability for a few politico bankers to create money from thin air to (first) pay themselves and a few of their cantillon mates.


    ".....this meant that the closer you were to the king and the wealthy, the more you benefitted, and the further away you were, the more you were harmed. Money, in other words, is not neutral. This general observation, that money printing has distributional consequences that operate through the price system, is known as the “Cantillon Effect.”....."

  12. 42 minutes ago, byron78 said:

    Move to America would be my advise.

    You'll still get taxed, but you'll mostly get a massive army for your money.

    Don't get sick mind. It will bankrupt you, unless you can afford a pretty decent wedge every month in insurance.

    (I hate the place. Reminds me of their 50s cars. All flash and show, but all over the place once you're in the thing. America has become a complete hole IMHO. Seeing elderly folk and kids living rough on the streets shocked me to my core).



    Same goes for USA poeple..... ask them if they want massive army, they all agree....yes?   Then ask them if they would mind paying $1000 directly to cover the cost.......what would be their answer ...... if they could chose freely they might just chose health over arms?...maybe?

  13. 22 minutes ago, zugzwang said:

    ....If you want that kind of arrangement you'll have to find a political party willing to advance it.

    Good luck with that.

    And therein lies the the problem....... you know, I could be socialist (would be a danm sight easier)  if I thought there would be some kind of order and limit to the massive amount of money creation, that seems(!) to benefit the 1% and massively distort asset (housing) prices.

    But as you say good luck with finding any political party not willing to buy votes with thin air credit.  

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