Snicks918

This. I've lost count of the number of people who've told me they don't want to go to London, they want the money invested in local rail services. The reason you can't have more frequent local services is because of capacity constraints elsewhere on the rail network (Birmingham New Street is a massive bottleneck, for example). By moving the long distance services onto a separate track you create more capacity on the existing rail lines to offer more frequent local and regional services. You can also run services closer together if they are all travelling at similar speeds, meaning more trains. I swear, every time I go to Birmingham I get stuck behind a delayed slow train and end up arriving 30 minutes late. Having the faster trains on a separate track addresses this. It also frees up additional freight capacity on the existing lines which has environmental benefits. The only other way to address this capacity issue is to build additional conventional speed tracks alongside the West Coast Mainline but you would need to build 2 or 3 extra sets of tracks, which would require much more land and have more environmental impacts than HS2. Honestly they never should have named it HS2 because the speed is not really the main benefit. There are a quite a few reasons why it's more expensive than building a similar project in other countries. A few I don't see mentioned a lot are 1. European high speed rail doesn't tend to go directly into city centres, and of course the cost of land and the complexity of construction is increased when you are dealing with any city. 2. The UK doesn't build infrastructure projects often enough to have a skilled workforce. Every time a new project starts up there is a substantial cost to upskill the workforce, supply chain, etc.

He owned the flat before marriage and kept it to rent out when they bought their house. They're worried about their mortgage payments increasing so are going to put all the proceeds towards paying down the mortgage on their (very expensive) house.

A colleague was telling me yesterday that he finally sold his flat in London that has been on the market since January. The only genuine offer came from a foreign cash buyer who repeatedly negotiated the price further down over the course of the sale. They begrudgingly went along with it because 500+ similar flats are due to come on the market in their area soon and they wanted to sell before the surge in supply.

This one comes with a Mini Cooper... https://www.zoopla.co.uk/for-sale/details/44016474?search_identifier=c94e370e545ffa3e1e54d4b9de291eae

My in-laws are thinking of selling their 3-bed semi in the Southeast to retire to a cheaper area of the country. They had an EA out to value the property last week. According to him, sales of of 4 and 5 bed houses are on the floor ("no one wants them because they can't afford them") but 3 beds are selling very quickly. (Although I looked at the land registry data and in their town only three 3-bed semis had sold since August. I guess that's "quickly"?). This matches what I'm seeing on Zoopla. Very few 3 beds for sale at all, but the ones that have been on for months and months are all 4 and 5 beds, many which have already dropped their asking prices by 10%. If these homes have motivated sellers pretty soon they're going to be approaching the asking prices for 3 beds.

My husband is British. But I did do a Masters in the UK a few years ago and was able to work on the Post Study visa before they got rid of it.

http://www.wsj.com/articles/luxury-apartment-boom-looks-set-to-fizzle-in-2017-1483358401 Foreshadowing of what will happen will all those "luxury" flats in London? I listened to their podcast on the topic this morning and they said that many young professionals who could afford to buy just don't want to because of the choice of rentals available. I'm about to join my husband in London next month but am currently living in the DC area. An apartment complex just opened up with a salt water pool and a pet spa, and it's one of many similar complexes. Not only are there so many developments with empty flats, but as a young professional why on earth would I buy when I can live in luxury (for $1100-$1300/month for a 1 bed) and have the flexibility to move wherever I need to for my career?

There is an obsession in my generation (millennials) with property. They've been told house prices will go up indefinitely, it's the only way to acquire any wealth or savings (because we all know wages aren't going up anytime soon), and they've rationalised taking on huge amounts of debts because if they don't "get on the ladder" now, they never will. A friend of mine recently told me that her partner doesn't want to get a huge mortgage and doesn't think the properties for sale are worth that amount of money, but feels like he's not successful if he doesn't own something. He feels like he's "fallen behind" his peers. Another bought a house in Brixton last year and were distressed that it had lost x% of value since (why are you tracking the "value" of a house you just moved into if you purchased it to live in?). A lot of them truly believe the value some EA told them is actual money in the bank and so feel comfortable splashing out on holidays rather than saving. We can't underestimate the panic that will set in if prices start to drop and people try to sell in order to salvage some of their "wealth".

I don't know, I'm 30 and all the couples I know who bought a 2-bed house (Southeast) and are ready to start a family are cashing in their equity to add an extra bedroom since they can't afford to trade up to a bigger property. Most of the homes are small with tiny gardens. Maybe they will be happy with it for a few years, but as soon as they are ready for baby #2 they are going to be in a position of trying to fit a family into the living and garden space of (what was) a 2 bed FTB home and will probably want to move. (Plus they all seem to feel like having a spare bedroom is a status symbol) The extension costs have already eaten up their equity. A HPC may cancel out the added value they were anticipating from the extension.

A few years ago I was renting a room in a flatshare in London. It was a 2 bed flat and then the 3rd person lived in the lounge. He wasn't the landlord but I assumed he was either a friend or family member of the landlord since he collected all the payments from us. I found out later he had come to the UK years before to do a degree, any degree, in order to over stay and claim asylum. His visa applications kept being denied but he was able to stay in the country for years by constantly appealing (I have sympathy as he was Syrian and I wouldn't want to return there either, but as someone who went through the legal immigration process this bothers me a little. Plus he was just an awful person). Right before I moved out I also found out he was on housing benefit (probably not his housing benefit since I don't think it was his flat) when he told me he needed to raise my rent due to the implementation of the bedroom tax. I'm pretty sure the rent the other tenant and I were paying was funding his life in London while he waited for his asylum request to be granted.

I do wonder how well these extended houses will sell once prices start to go down. I have friends who are about to break ground on an extension in the new year. They purchased a 2-bed/1-bath semi with garage in the South East for about 225k in 2012. (This was including a 70k deposit from their parents since their salaries were too low to get a bigger mortgage). The house is quite small. Just one reception room which isn't very big and must hold the dining table as well as their sofa since the kitchen isn't large enough to fit a table. Their plan is to extend the kitchen to create a kitchen diner which will eat into their already small garden. They will also add a loft extension that has a third bedroom but the only place for the stairs is through one of the existing bedrooms, which will either make it a very large landing or a single bedroom rather than a double. They are of course using the equity due to HPI to pay for this. Up until now the thought process has been "I'll just extend it and someone will buy it. Doesn't matter if it has a tiny garden or is really 2.5 bedrooms rather than 3. Buyers are desperate for anything they can afford". But we've already seen people becoming more picky lately. It will be interesting to see the reaction if these homes with ill-thought out extensions don't end up being quite so desirable and the owners suddenly have an even higher mortgage than what they started with.

Well we have President Trump now And the Democratic Party seems to be imploding with Bernie Sanders and other Progressives attempting to lead (with resistance of course). The upside of this is we get to elect someone else in 4 years. I was dreading 8 years of Hillary.

There was a great segment on MSNBC this morning about the Trump victory and all the factors behind it, including the shenanigans of the Democratic Party that refused to accept any other candidate than Hillary, despite her being incredibly unpopular. (I mean, she spent $2 billion and still lost to literally the most unpopular candidate in US history) Michael Moore was the guest because he is from the blue collar midwest area that flipped from Democrat to Trump and he accurately predicted this months ago (http://michaelmoore.com/trumpwillwin/). The segment was supposed to be 7 minutes but they cancelled all the commercials and just let them go for 45 minutes. They completely shut down the "everyone who voted for Trump/Brexit is uneducated or racist" discussion. http://www.msnbc.com/morning-joe/watch/michael-moore-joins-wide-ranging-election-talk-806604867876

I wouldn't say the left voted for her in droves. Many of us would have preferred Bernie Sanders, who had a similar trade message and momentum to Trump. He won 22 out of 50 states despite the media's effort to give him as little coverage as possible (cutting away to an empty stage at Trump rally in the middle of his speech, giving minimal coverage to rallies that attracted tens of thousands in a primary!), and the DNC's blatant collusion (CNN moderators being fired for feeding her questions before debates, DNC Chairmain resigning amidst accusations of a lack of neutrality only to be given a position in Clinton's campaign). And the states he defeated her in during the primaries were the very same Democrat strongholds that flipped in the general election. She lost Michigan by 11,000 votes. 90,000 voters in Detroit voted for every question on the ballot except for president which they left blank because they were so furious over the White House's lack of reaction to the crisis in Flint. They were never going to vote for Trump but couldn't stomach voting for Hillary. The Republicans didn't get many more votes than they normally do (around 60 million). But she lost millions of the votes Obama had because people disliked her so much they just stayed home.

Well, as an immigrant, I can say that I never thought the restrictions would get lighter, nor do I know if I even want to be a British citizen. Quite proud of my American passport, thanks. I don't know anyone else who expected restrictions to change either (our experiences are equally anecdotal, before we even go down that road). If the goal is to increase migration it wouldn't make sense to lighten restrictions, unless it's for a specific skill category, such as engineering, that would benefit UK business to do so. It would just be preferable for everyone to be held to the same high standard. And honestly, it's pretty offensive that you are portraying immigrants like they all are stupid and desperate to be British, as if they all come from some godforsaken hole. Attitudes sure have changed since 2012. I wonder where all those unskilled workers were coming from?

The requirements I listed are for visas, not passports. It takes years of residency in the UK (which requires a visa) before you can apply for Indefinite Leave to Remain. Then after that you are eligible for a passport, provided you pass the Life in the UK test. So I don't think anyone is talking about a 'passport club', just the ability to live/work/study.

There actually used to be a points system - the Highly Skilled Migrant Programme. You received points for knowledge of the English language, savings, level of education, etc. If you reached a minimum number of points you were eligible for a visa. There is also a "shortage occupation list" that already exists. It is updated on an ongoing basis. If you can perform one of these in demand jobs (I suspect many NHS positions will be on this list so the idea that the NHS will not have any employees is questionable) you can work in the UK without going through the normal visa process. The HSMP was ended in 2008, when pressure from EU immigration began forcing the UK government to reduce non-EU immigration as that was the only population they had control over. We now have a tier system, which requires you to be sponsored by an employer. I believe there may also be an entrepreneurial route, but I haven't applied for that myself, so I'm not 100% sure. In the years since 2009 the UK has also scrapped the Post Study Work Visa, which allowed graduates of UK universities to work in the UK for two years. Now those who are trained in the UK, to UK standards, are taking their skills, and contribution to the economy, elsewhere. In 2012, the restrictions on non-EU spouses were increased. You now must earn a minimum of £18,600 to bring your spouse over. This increases to £22,400 for a spouse and a child, and £2,400 for each additional child after that. It is estimated that 43% of British citizens can not meet this requirement. The income can only be earned in the UK by the British spouse, so you if you move abroad and the British spouse is a stay at home parent, for example, they will have to move back to the UK alone, earn the minimum salary for six months (unlikely if they have been out of work for awhile) and then their family is allowed to join them. Or they are essentially exiled from their own country. If you are an EU citizen moving to the UK from another area in the EU, with a spouse from outside the EEA, you are allowed to bring your spouse with you without having to meet any of the income requirements, paying the application fee, or the non-EEA spouse paying the annual NHS surcharge that is required of family members of British citizens. You also don't have to repeat this process every three years. In April, the Home Office enforced a new rule: any non-EU immigrants working in the UK must earn £35,000/year after five years of residency, or leave. Many people who have built a life here will be forced to return home. Sounds similar to many of the stories that have come out after the vote. These people include teachers and charity workers who contribute to society but don't work in high paid careers. The school system is in need of qualified teachers, aren't they? Many of these people who add true diversity to the UK - diversity that goes beyond different European nations. Where was the So is the EU literally saying 'we only want white European. Everyone else keep out"? Of course not. But these restrictions have gotten tighter as the UK struggles to cope with the amount of migrants coming from Europe. With no ability to control European migration it indirectly forces the UK to discriminate against non-EU immigrants, including spouses and children of British citizens, and Commonwealth citizens.

I have a family member who lives in the UK as well although we are both from outside the EU. She is posting all these photos on Facebook0 that have the NHS workers holding up signs listing their nationalities. The captions always say something about how we will lose all this wonderful diversity. No one is going to be deported. And the absolute worst case scenario is that any new immigrants will have to go through the same visa process every other non-EU immigrant has been going through for years. Most of the NHS positions will probably end up on the shortage occupation list, so anyone working in these fields won't have to go through that process anyway! I understand other people who haven't had to deal with the visa system not understanding how it works and posting this kind of stuff, but she's gone through the process four or five times. She knows the rules. Stop fanning the flames! Although she is obsessed with the idea of being "cultured" and "European" so she's been very distraught over how the UK has "embarrassed itself on the world stage".

That's interesting. Obviously my experience is only anecdotal, but every time I talk to a very angry Remain voter and point out that if they are worried about the UK government going unchecked and any policies they make that might disadvantage "vulnerable" people they can vote against those politicians or even run for office themselves, they look at me like I'm crazy. Maybe they are just in shock and aren't at the point of entertaining any ideas for moving forward yet

I find it incredibly interesting to compare the thought process of young people in the UK (And I'm 29, so not old ) who voted to Remain with what has been happening in the United States with Bernie Sanders. It is the younger generation in the latter instance that is pushing for change, for better working conditions, for more regulation on the banks, and they have belief that they have the power to do it. They don't have to accept the system they've been given. I'm not picking on you because I've seen similar statements from many people about how the system is broken but there is nothing we can do about it. I don't know if it's a different of mentality ('this is my lot in life' vs 'the American Dream') or if it's because you do have other options (you mentioned you could move to Berlin to get a cheaper house. Good idea, but why isn't fixing things at home an option?, and the EU is another alternative if the UK government is terrible) whereas Americans just have to make the best of what we have because we don't have a higher authority like the EU to turn to or another country we can easily move to. This seems to be the difference between a lot of voters as well. Remain thinks 'the British system is broken, so at least we have the EU to keep them in check since we can't do anything about it', whereas the Leave voters think 'the British system is broken, they use the EU as a scapegoat, let's take that crutch away and force them to improve. Or replace them'. I'm a bit of an armchair psychologist so the difference in thinking patterns is curious to me. Especially how in the US it is the young people who feel most empowered to create change, yet it seems to be the other way around in the UK if the voting demographics are to be believed.

As someone who has experienced immigration from the non-EU side I would like to see it made it easier for companies to hire foreign workers. Lower the restrictions, but then apply the same restrictions for everyone. So for instance, you need to have a job offer in place before coming to the UK, whether it be a low or high skilled job, a minimum salary depending on the position, guaranteed hours, command of the English language if necessary, but then remove the burden of proof that currently exists where employers need to prove no other British or EU worker can perform the job (for non-EU candidates). One of things that's really irritated me about this whole situation is the faux empathy I'm seeing from some (not all) remain voters. This idea that the EU was the only person protecting the less fortunate, and that without them the government with just make the situation worse. You have a vote, if you are so concerned vote for a politician that won't screw them over. But then there is the excuse that all politicians are horrible and nothing can change (this seems to be the crux of the disagreement. Leave voters believe they can steer their own ship, Remain voters have no faith and think they need the EU need to do if for them.) Well, we all have a choice of whether we are willing to pay slightly more for a product or service made in the UK by a company that offers fair wages and good working conditions, just as we can choose to pay extra for something made in Africa or South America with a fair trade sticker on it. If we are in the corporate sector we can choose where we build our companies, where we invest, if we pay fair wages and offer good working conditions, if we are willing to train unskilled workers. The average person can go and volunteer with the Career & Enterprise Company where they advise schools on what sort of career training they should be doing to steer students in realistic directions based on their geographic area and ensure they are learning the skills they need to succeed. They can even run for office. The idea that the ordinary person can't do anything (or shouldn't have to do anything - god forbid we get our hands dirty) and our fate is 100% in the hands of the current less than desirable government is bizarre to me.

I don't have an EU passport and have never needed a visa to enter any Schengen country. Just a passport stamp. And I promise the non-EU line isn't as bad as everyone makes it seem

This. I'm 29. American, but went to an "elite" UK institution. The reactions of my friends on social media have been shocking. It's the thing to do to be liberal. (I voted for Bernie Sanders. I'm definitely liberal) In theory, open arms, a global society, blah blah blah is a good thing. In practice it's very hard to implement without someone being negatively affected. They see it as the moral/enlightened/cultured choice. Maybe it is. I don't know. But having the opportunity to make your life decisions based on what is more cultured is a luxury for the privileged few. They are blind to this. Many, many people have to make their choices based on what puts food on the table or what gets them through the week rather than some enlightened ideals. The other thing I've noticed is that they seem to not realise that just because the EU is working for them doesn't mean it's working for everyone (this is obvious in the way they fathom any rational reason why someone would vote leave. It MUST be the person is just uneducated/xenophobic). One of the things that surprised me the most was that none of my classmates during my Masters (who were mostly very wealthy Brits/Europeans/Asians) had ever worked a day in their lives other than the occasional investment banking internship. Their job was to focus on studying while their parents covered all their expenses. The North Americans were a different story. Maybe it's because the cost of higher education in the US is so high, but the majority of students, even the wealthy, that I knew at my American undergraduate school worked summer jobs, part time jobs, jobs during high school, etc. And they were not glamorous internships. They were retail, food service, landscaping, construction. As a result, I knew plenty of people with lower incomes or on benefits. It's a lot harder to be blind to the struggle of others when you're not isolated in a little bubble. I would be curious to know though how many Brits actually take advantage of the opportunity to live and work in Europe. They desperately defended it with their Remain votes, but I don't think a single of the British London elite I've met have ever actually lived/work abroad. At least not for an extended period of time. Unsurprisingly the only people I've seen taking a pragmatic approach on the result are the London residents I know from Russia, Canada, Australia and other countries outside the EU.

I've been following this forum for awhile, but this is my first post! I worked/studied in London for several years but am currently in the US (my native country). I'll be moving to the Southeast this year so have been watching the housing market closely (how I found this forum). As someone watching this all unfold from the outside I'm amazed at hysteria from remainers about how the UK is "irrelevant" to the rest of the world outside the EU. I think a lot of people are forgetting that there a plenty of countries in the EU watching how this all plays out because they might be considering their own exit plans. There is also the fact that US and Russia like being world powers. They don't want a United States of Europe. If Brussels chooses this moment to try to exert its power by punishing the UK, it will not go unnoticed. The UK has a lot more bargaining power in this situation than the Remain voters think.