lotus eater

I agree. Labour, and especially Brown, did everything to keep themselves in power. They are not the altruistic social democrat party they once were and I hope people will see Brown for the opportunist he really is. I can't believe the amount of debt we've racked up and how many jobless people are not being helped into work. What are all these young adults and teenagers with kids I see wandering around Brighton living on........very adequate benefits at the expense of the working suckers? Many of these jobless are his electorate, if they could be bothered to vote.

".piecemeal..". I was brought up in the so called 'worse housing' near the sea in the 1950s-60s There were many families living there rather than itinerant, benefit claiming occupiers that inhabit the area now. In fact, St Margarets House is in the footprint of where I went to school and Churchill Square where my father had a shop and we lived above. I can understand why many families are outpriced by Brighton n Hove and that's because most of the buyers are coming from London London is now awful to live in- I lived there 35 years and was pleased to move back There are many, like me, who have realised high prices on their London properties and just want to get away - Brighton n Hove offer the best alternative outside of the Captital

Interesting panel. Can't wait to see the sparks fly between Melanie Phillips v George Galloway.

That property was never worth more than £650,000 anyway. Tongdean Lane is nothing like Tongdean Ave or Road. The Brighton side of Dyke Road Ave has always been cheaper than the Hove side. I don't know why but the data suggests this.

...and she didn't get where she is via the secondary state system. Because of the demise of many good Grammar schools, Mr Lotus Eater & I nearly bankrupted ourselves sending her and her brother to good independent secondary schools.

Because IMHO that system works best, doesn't cost anything and sorts out the academic from the non academic. The non academic can then be trained in a trade or take the arts route or if they are late developers, can achieve later. How many times do I have to repeat myself. My daughter didn't get into a Grammar school at 11, which was upsetting for her at the time, but she is just about to qualify as a solicitorafter having taken a science degree . The fact that she failed to get into an academic school probably gave her more incentive to achieve.

If you look at my earlier post, I say it was 'probably' easier to get into a Grammar School in Sussex , which includes Brighton & Hove, Worthing, Eastbourne etc. Children in rural Sussex travelled to the nearest town that had a Grammar School, which happens now with Comprehensives. You seem to keep trying to reinforce your point of view without actually reading what I post. If a child was capable, (read academically able) they would have got into a Grammar school. Capable could mean capable of cooking, good motor skills or sport...tha't not the same as academically capable. Also in my earlier post I say Comprehensives' with 'streaming' (unlike your excrutiating grammer 'streamlining' which has a completely different meaning) should work but don't as the the benchmark is much lower. In an academically selective school the general level of attainment is much higher. That is also why children from top Comprehensive school streams do not get into the best universities. More 'working class' children (like me) were in Grammar schools and able to achieve. There were at least a third of pupils in my class that had free school meals and subsidised uniforms. Hope the above illustrates my answer i.e without Grammar schools there can be no academic meritocracy.

...nor can you prove it wasn't proportional. Having lived both in Brighton and London with children, it was certainly easier to get into a Grammar school in Sussex. The competition in London is phenominal.

What about Woodingdean (borders of) or roads off Elm Grove, are they that expensive?

Nowhere I've mentioned is THAT far from Brighton n Hove. You should try crossing London to a good local school (which I had to do with my 2), then Shoreham/Peacehaven is not a long journey. I have a friend here in Hove whose son goes to a school in Lewes, although he's now 15. Whereabouts in Brighton does your child go to school and what's your budget? I'll try to locate a reasonably priced area for you.

I agree, the prices are unlike anywhere else on the Soath Coast. I don't think Brighton & Hove prices will ever get back to the early 90s sort of level as we're now a 'city' and more young people find it desirable to live here. Most under 40s seem to be moving to Shoreham, Peacehaven, Worthing etc as they just can't afford a decent place here. I was shocked at how similar are the prices here to good areas in London. Have you tried looking further out like above?

IMO I would jump in now before the good weather and interest rates go up. If we have a change of government in the Spring, that might make people feel more optimistic and that combined with better weather will push the prices up. There are still some sellers desperate to sell (job losses couldn't sell last year) so bargains to be had...worth looking and negotiating. We bought last Spring, although Mr Lotus Eater wanted to wait until Oct 09...glad we didn't.

Yes, primary evidence. I was here during that time. There were Hove County (Girls' & Boys') Varndean (Girls' & Boys') Brighton & Hove High School and Brighton & Hove Grammar School for Boys (now BHSVIC) =6. I've seen the benefits of Grammars and disaster and social engineering of Comprehensives here. My friends at Secondary Moderns did just as well as friends from Grammars.

You should check your posts before you quote things as facts. In the 1960s there were at least 6 Grammar schools in Brighton and Hove for boys and girls and the same pro rata in Sussex and London. In order to get into a Grammar school, there was a minimum pass mark and any child from a primary school could sit the exam, regardless of ability. There was no luck in the process. The exam was mainly based on reasoning to assess IQ, which couldn't be taught or tutored. Some children who managed to get to Grammar school levelled out and didn't achieve their potential whilst some who went to Secondary Moderns were able to study later if they had the ability and drive. The same is true today and if anything the Comprehensive system has failed which, in theory, should work, but hasn't. The Chinese model is probably the best:- see earlier post 2178 by Tired of Waiting. It encapsulates everything I'm trying to say.

Doesn't the site UpmyStreet have details of local schools etc?

I don't think i've argued against competition. The fact I'm in favour of Grammar schools confirms my point. Just because a child is non academic, why do you say they are worthless. What's wrong with learning a trade, which they were encouraged to do in Secondary Modern schools. Plumbers, electricians, builders etc are highly valued trades and just as worthwhile as lawyers or doctors. One group is not [/b]better ] than the other, just different. The problem now is that we are trying to push all children through the academic route, regardless of their ability, therefore making them feel worthless when they fail to get into a decent uni.. Why would a child be on the 'scrap heap' ? If a child 'failed' at school, there are many opportunities for further adult education, if and when a person feels they would like to study. I know many people who left school without even an O Level- for many reasons- and they have studied something later on, even acheiving a degree.

I also know someone who failed his 11+ (had bad day, not mature enough or whatever) and managed to get into Grammar School at 13. His is now a Physics professor at a Russell Group uni. Mr Live & Let Buy, there is competition sitting SATs at primary school, there is competition at 11 into Secondary at 14 and again at 18+ into university. It's no wonder therapists are doing so well: young :people can't cope with competition and disappoinment in their lives. You can be stuck with bad teachers throughtout your school life, notwithstanding what school, but it is up to the chiid to make the best of it and find inner resources to achieve. In fact, I believe a disadvantaged education can sometimes bring out that inner drive and ambition, but only if it's there in the first place. Can't make a silk purse out of a sow's ear- IMO

The problem with that system was/is that children perform/ed according to the lowest common denominator. At selective schools- whether State or independent- the optimum/benchmark level is higher and children actually attain at a higher level if of average IQ. Certainly the brightest children in non-selective schools always do well. At my daughter's uni (she read Chemical Physics) she had a friend who had come from a comprehensive who achieved the same A Levels. Yet this Comprehensive educated friend did much better at the course and was extremely bright. Analogy: "cream rises to the top" always applies. However, if you are above average IQ, a Grammar school or selecyive education is more effective. IMHO.

Children were able to retake (although at a more advanced level) the Grammar school entrance exam again at 13...it was called the 13+. So they did have another chance. In life, there is always some form of competition. I nearly always came last in races, as I was a useless runner. Should they stop competative sports because some people are not able to win? I remember in the '80sat my daughter's primary school, the supply teacher refused to give her pupils their marks from their spelling tests, as she didn't want to upset them if they didn't do too well...crazy. The Head didn't believe in learning tables by rote as they had to understand the 'concept of multiplication first'. This put me right off State education and we put her straight into a good independent secondary school. She took off educationally, was calmer and happier and never looked back.

What solution do you suggest? Whatever level of educaton or work life you compare, there is always an element of competition. I'm a product of the Grammer School and my parents were asylum seekers who couldn't afford a private education for me or my sister. Because I had a half decent education, I was able to afford to send my 2 children to good independent schools with the prospect of good jobs. I really resent this inverse snobbery that resents educational meritocracy and wants everyone to be 'equal'.

Oh ,ovely. Mr LE and I were there last year...stunning. We celebrated New Year near Milford Sound. Hope you enjoy yourself and get away from this basket case of a country.

Wrong. Nick Clegg publically stated on the Andrew Marr Show about 3 weeks ago that in the event of a Hung Parliament, he would ally his party with the party that had the majority of the votes..i.e Conservative. He can't back track now.

Not much selling round my way. There are still 3 houses for sale in The Droveway, which are very overpriced. One house had 3 offers fall through because of the awful traffic along that road, not helped by a Tesco Express, Mowden school and a short cut into Brighton.

A pathetic answer. Did you hear John Bercow at today's PMQs tell Broon to answer the government's postion re NHS rather than knock the opposition. Pleased to hear the Speaker rein in Gordon and put him in his place for once.

But I'm nowhere near Hove Park- which I don't find very appealing. I'm off Dyke Road and now have all the cars parking on our grass verges since the new Dyke Road parking scheme came into being.