Friday, Sep 11, 2009
The wasteful spending of an insane, and out-of-touch government
Mail: Minister uses Soham murders to justify placing one in four Britons on Big Brother child protection d
Not directly related but, this shows the minds who are running the UK. '...Parents could face a £5,000 fine for driving their children's friends to a sports event or Cub Scout meeting if they have not been vetted first by the massive new government agency....it will be the biggest vetting and clearing system in the world.'
They only need the agency because Labour are releasing the offenders early, because the prisons are full. Mismanagement or what?
Posted by hpwatcher @ 02:10 PM (1697 views) Add Comment
57 Comments
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1. paul said...
Oh this is patent rubbish, hpwatcher.
I guarantee by this time next week, this will have been forgotten. This is the Daily Wail being sensationalist and jumping to false conclusions to sell papers to 'Outraged Of Tunbridge Wells'.
2. james stephenson said...
I wouldn't put it past these would-be autocrats.
They have a program costing £400m to put CCTV in 20,000 homes of 'problem' children. This government is out of control.
3. alan said...
I posted off a complaint to my MP.
The heavy overhead will crush communities' football teams, youth clubs and scouting (to name a few). It will cost a packet. All this will be money that the country hasn't got. We will create a new "child protection" industry, just like the "race and diversity industry" which makes no profits and furthers political correctness.....
If wicked paedophiles want to infiltrate youth organisations, football teams and faith organisations, this won't stop them.
4. timmy t said...
I was llistening to this debate on 5 live this morning. Why can't we have a voluntary system? If the parents sign a disclaimer then any parent can be taxi, if they don't then somebody will have to volunteer to be CRB checked or the club has no transport - simple.
5. alan said...
Paul,
The Telegraph has a slightly more balanced view.
"Any formal agreement to ferry youngsters to and from the likes of Scouts, dance classes or local football matches, even if only once a month, will fall under the Government’s new Vetting and Barring Scheme. It means anyone who fails to register and have their backgrounds checked faces a fine of up to £5,000 and a criminal record".
This government is using it as an electoral ploy to "show it is caring". If it was it would run the country for the benefit of its people, not its snout in the trough friends.
As more and more government cash is poured down the drain, so the nation's debt will rise. As a regular contributor to the site, you know the impact of continually raising money with a reducing ability to pay back.
6. alan said...
timmy t,
"somebody will have to volunteer to be CRB checked or the club has no transport - simple".
It takes 4 or 5 cars to transport an U13 football team. At £90 a driver that's £360 - £450. I think you can just about wipe out most of the football clubs in the Essex league for that! And every other league in the country.
Don't you like football? ....or scouting,,,,or dancing classes....or karate
7. timmy t said...
Alan - yes I do - and I'd happily sign the disclaimer so my kids could go. Like I said - simple.
8. crash n burn said...
Sensationalist bull carp
9. uncle tom said...
Don't forget that Huntley went through the vetting system, but it failed to spot his previous offences..
..parents have a pretty good idea who can be trusted, without invoking the help of Big Brother..
10. the number cruncher said...
Right wing reactionary rubbish - I know a bit about this as my business works with children and all our staff are CRB checked
This is an improvement to the CRB system and a welcome one. Nothing wrong with protecting children and improving IT systems
11. hpwatcher said...
Oh this is patent rubbish, hpwatcher.
I guarantee by this time next week, this will have been forgotten. This is the Daily Wail being sensationalist and jumping to false conclusions to sell papers to 'Outraged Of Tunbridge Wells'.
Sadly not all rubbish. It's indicative of a goverment that is extremely irresponsible with tax payers money.
12. Smug Punter said...
did anyone hear that house prices up 0.8% this month, it was in the press recently
13. hpwatcher said...
Right wing reactionary rubbish - I know a bit about this as my business works with children and all our staff are CRB checked
This is an improvement to the CRB system and a welcome one. Nothing wrong with protecting children and improving IT systems
Completely missing the point......this is about the volunteers, and the scale of the governing body AND how much it will cost.
14. mark wadsworth said...
Ah yes, but think of all the jobs it will "create" in the surveillance community!
Think of all the people who lose their jobs because of 'false positives'!
Think of all the money the lawyers will be able to earn appealing against false positives!
Think of the climate of fear and suspicion they can engender, the lifeblood of an authoritarian big government!
What's not to like?
15. inflation is eating my savings said...
Huntley was a patsy, so one rumour goes (see below). It was a political cover up to avoid embarrassment with the US.
The girls were dug up yards form a US base, in the run up to the Iraq war. The US military have a dreadful reputation for doing bad things to local children, wherever they are.
http://codshit.com/wells-chapman.htm
16. need-a-crash said...
Well I'm priced out of the property market so I don't have to worry about having children!
17. mystie010 said...
inflation is eating my savings - I think that there might be a bit of a clue in the URL of this website as to how reliable it is. But I do love a good conspiracy theory :-)
18. mark wadsworth said...
@ Need a crash, you saying that with irony, but I did read an article on housebuilding recently (and the fact we don't build enough), where some miserable old NIMBY g1t left the first comment and said that it was a good thing that older people were rattling around in overpriced properties so that younger people couldn't have anywhere to start a family because the UK is overcrowded anyway and they ought to "wait their turn and save up a proper deposit first" etc etc.
19. matt_the_hat said...
Time to leave the GDR (Gordon's Democratic Republic)...
20. Chris said...
'They only need the agency because Labour are releasing the offenders early, because the prisons are full. Mismanagement or what?'
There is no mismanagement or incompetence here. Wadsworth and Uncle Tom are right. If your goal is to further the establishment of a full surveillance society you would use every excuse you can to bring it in. Nothing to do with being caring in order to win votes. Similarly as most people on here have realised the house price asset bubble was not an accident or mismanagement or incompetence but a deliberate creation. Until people realise exactly the type of people who are running the show they will be continually scammed.
21. cyril said...
There is some truth in what need-a-crash says @ 15. The birth rate is generally falling amongst working people and I think this has got something to do with housing affordability - but this is probably because people want a certain lifestyle to go with their family & they can't afford it.
I saw a programme on telly the other day about the Roma people (in Romania) and this one chap lived in a shed with his wife and kids - he had so many kids he had lost count of them, and he had no money. All a question of priorities really.
22. Cynicalsoothsayer said...
The lack of a decent sized house hasn't stopped me from sprogging, bairns seem to sleep quite happily in their moses basket/cot in the same room as us. One screaming doesn't wake the others. Another room really will seem like luxury when we get it eventually though...
23. down wave said...
If this is true, it is just another attempt be Nu Labour to induce more fear, to make us all more apathetic, to take our adult responsibillities away, to isolate adults from children. Ultimately, Nu Labour will billet all their civil servants in all of our homes to make sure we go to bed on time, get up on time, only have sex once a month, recycle everything properly, don't wast food, gas, electricity, water and to share the bath water. It will solve the housing problem and the economic situation. Just another power grab by low tone zip heads in parliment.
If NU Labour could set an example themselves by excersing 'propriety', 'ethics', 'steadfastness', 'prudence', 'truthfulnes', along with all the other virtues, then this Nation would have something to look up-to and model its self on.
24. little professor said...
From the ever-reliable Mailwatch:
"People with convictions for abusing children end up working with children due to poor vetting procedures.
“Something should be done!” thunder the papers.
Government does something.
“How dare the State do something! What about our precious liberties?!” thunder the papers."
25. smugdog said...
Not much HPC drama here I see. I have CRB. Do you?
26. hpwatcher said...
little professor said...
From the ever-reliable Mailwatch:
"People with convictions for abusing children end up working with children due to poor vetting procedures.
“Something should be done!” thunder the papers.
Government does something.
“How dare the State do something! What about our precious liberties?!” thunder the papers."
WOW - there is definitely a cool tee shirt design in there somewhere!
27. shipbuilder said...
Couldn't have put it better myself, lp. Ultimately, we get the government we deserve - who are the perpetuators of the fear culture? Look in the mirror.
Can anyone here claim to give their children as free a childhood as they had?
28. Vinrouge said...
It seems to me that the government is far more interested in the £90 fees which they can use to justify the enormous costs of the agency and NuLab's pet databases than any interest in child safety.
29. 51ck-6-51x said...
shipbuilder,
Yep, I have not spawned them into this cruel world ;p
30. down wave said...
24. shipbuilder
Yes, I can, but then they are now in their late 30's early forties. I would not want to be a child in today's UK.
31. shipbuilder said...
25. 51ck-6-51x said...
"shipbuilder,
Yep, I have not spawned them into this cruel world ;p"
lol......the horror.......the horror.......
32. devo said...
shipbuilder: Can anyone here claim to give their children as free a childhood as they had?
Yes.
Freer, if anything.
Certainly happier.
33. shipbuilder said...
28. devo said...
"Yes.
Freer, if anything.
Certainly happier."
An achievement that shouldn't be.
34. devo said...
shipbuilder: An achievement that shouldn't be
It isn't easy.
I put them first.
(That doesn't mean spending more money on them)
35. devo said...
Reconsiders...
"An achievement that shouldn't be"
Hmm.. as in remarkable or wrong?
36. shipbuilder said...
Is an achievement, but shouldn't have to be.
37. shipbuilder said...
Should the next generation be happier, or more profitable? How to measure 'progress'?
38. devo said...
"Is an achievement, but shouldn't have to be."
What is freedom?
Freedom is complex.
In this day and age, freedom from poverty ticks many boxes (forgive the cliché).
39. wiltshire said...
This country is fcuked.
All we seem to get nowadays is fear propaganda.
I suggest the masterplan is this, you keep the populace terrified of the big scary things they can't control (weather, terrorists, disease, economics) and you keep them terrified of the small stuff too (taxes, inflation, being caught speeding, being caught putting paper in their rubbish bin). Soon enough people are so pleased to get through the day and get home of an evening without their entire world falling apart that they don't even worry about what's going on outside their door. Other than hoping the local feral youths stay away from their home tonight.
If people can't do something as simple as put their rubbish out without worrying about the state jackboot up their backside I'm sure it discourages them from thinking about ever taking the state on in more direct ways.
Bit by bit we're losing everything to these Labour fascists.
40. devo said...
Happiness (fulfilment) is everything.
But for ourselves or for our offspring?
That's what I'm grappling with at present.
The latter is winning in my case.
41. devo said...
35. wiltshire said... I suggest the masterplan is this...
I think we're about to find out that there is no (man-made) masterplan.
42. shipbuilder said...
37. devo said...
"35. wiltshire said... I suggest the masterplan is this...
I think we're about to find out that there is no (man-made) masterplan."
Ever read 'Straw Dogs' by John Gray? I'm halfway through. Sobering thoughts indeed.
43. devo said...
Ever read 'Straw Dogs' by John Gray?
No, but I will.
Thanks.
44. the number cruncher said...
As a very proud and loving farther the greatest danger to my young children are too many cars on the road, or in my case huge tractors thundering past my house at 40mph. When I was a kid we used to play in the street.
Lets give our children their childhood back and put petrol up to £20 per gallon, make a car cost 30 grand minimum and make tractors slow again...
45. devo said...
Is a sense of consciousness unique to humans?
46. goweresque said...
I'm giving the Tories a couple of years to sort this sh1t out. If they don't and turn out to be LabourLite, I'm gone. Sell everything (and I've got plenty) & go somewhere in the world where humans are treated with respect, not like abused, insulted, over taxed, lied to and penalised for being a decent human being.
47. devo said...
40. the number cruncher said.. the greatest danger to my young children are too many cars on the road
Too true, but a very recent phenomenon (30 years?).
48. devo said...
@goweresque
Geographically the UK has a lot going for it. Hang in there ( but don't count on the current mainstream parties for the answers).
49. wiltshire said...
For my part I've moved from Harringay, to a small Wiltshire town, and I've made a serious attempt to wipe non-essential shopping out of my life (partly because I now earn about 50% of what I used to earn in London and partly because there's nothing to buy in the small town I live in and the small village I work in).
No disrespect to those in cities/big towns because of course each to their own but after 20 years in North London I now find the urban existence totally unnatural and uncomfortable (I even find a morning in Bath is too much!) and I love not shopping largely because it now feels like an act of revolution.
They're just little things that keep me feeling vaguely sane. But they do keep me feeling vaguely saner.
50. devo said...
I grew up in suburbia; I now live in the countryside. As a child, cars went past my house sub 20 mph. Now they pass at plus 70mph. Which is the safer environment for kids?
51. wiltshire said...
Well, obviously on the speeding car index I would say surburbia sounds better. The whole 'peace of mind' index is another matter of course.
I was thinking recently that for 99.999% of human existence 99.999% of humans haven't lived an urban existence. It's only my opinion of course but for me urban doesn't make sense any more. I believe it's unnatural for people to exist in such huge numbers in such small areas but it's expedient for the system which needs human fodder.
52. wiltshire said...
P.S. I'm not an expert (on anything), so apologies if my statistics are wrong.
53. devo said...
47. wiltshire said... it's unnatural for people to exist in such huge numbers in such small areas but it's expedient for the system which needs human fodder
This comment would be valid if put forward at any time from the birth of the Industrial Revolution to about 1990. Does it matter so much now, in the UK, in 2009? China and India however are a different matter.
54. The Owl Of Minerva said...
this really is totally bonkers , adolf hitler himself could not have got away with this . The weird thing is that our dear governing classes have got so out of touch with the populace that they seem to think this is a reasonable proposition. I want to go and crawl under a rock and weep for what they have done to our basically decent , caring and honourable country.
55. tenant super said...
My other half is Irish and we have agreed that we would almost certainly head to The Republic when the time comes to raise a family. The debt may be predicted to rise to 200% of GDP and we might be living on salted potatoes and cabbage, but Ireland reminds me of England 25 years ago when I was a kid playing outside . There is still a strong emphasis on extended family. In Portlaois (where we have friends), their small kids play on the streets with all the housemums keeping an eye on them. It isn't perfect with yobbish behaviour in the town centre but it is a big imporvement on where I live in London now.
Our friend in Portlaois can afford an average house and he programmes cash tills for a living. The government made all the same mistakes NuLab did during the Celtic Tiger boom, rampant HPI, out of control household debt... when a queue of women waiting at a Dublin store to buy a 4K euro handbag and one of them said to the TV crew, "This is a great day for Ireland", de Valera must have been turning in his grave.
But the Ireland is swallowing its bitter medicine. There is no attempt to prop up the bubble and the HPC continues unabated; public sector workers have had a pay cut and a pension levy has been applied.
There isn't the moral panic over paedophilia you see over here (though that may change with the publication of the Ryan report). Despite what we may be led to believe, there isn't a paedo lurking on every corner. The 'stranger danger' indoctination of children makes them socially isolated. We knew and chatted to all our neighbours as children including harmless old bachelor Ted who used to give us sweets but would definitely be labeled as a weirdo now. The passing of 'Sarah's law' has only exacerbated panic. Most of the people on the sex offenders register are not a danger to children. A person can be registered as a sex offender if he is 21 and has sex with a 15 year old (believing her to be older), such a character hardly poses a threat to children but he is another red dot on the local paedo map causing paranoid parents to keep their children indoors or in their tiny gardens.
All that said, the Mail is guilty of rank hypocrisy, since they were calling for 'Sarah's law' to be passed and something to be done about child abduction and murder (rates of which have not increased over the past decades). Well you can't have your cake and eat it!
56. clockslinger said...
This is a non issue. Get your kids to go to a local club so they can walk. Safe, green and prevents obesity better than getting taken to football training in Essex with wheels under your oversized ar5e (Alan @ 6). No sympathy for anyone who takes this as proof of "incompetent government" because it is what any government now does, namely keeping your attention focussed on the imaginary terrorist/paedophile (part of the modern "circus" bit of the old "bread and circusses"thing) whilst they get on with the real job of keeping big business happy. Pur-lease don't try to tell me it will be "different" with a conservative government! This one is the "looking after the kiddies" pitch again, which is exactly the stuff the Great British Public vote for and the crap that spins stories like this that the tabloids survive on.
Why did anyone post it on HPC? Just to get me going?
57. crunchy said...
LOL, The agenda carries on whilst many so, so very rational folks carry on rationalising and getting all confused.
Very sad, but for the few cold, clear thinkers and planners that think they are above the lord.
They must wallow in their power to work together towards an end whilst watching mere mortals bicker and quabble, remaining none the
wiser.
Too late, too late will be the cry when all that's gone has past you by.