Tuesday, May 27, 2008
Well - More Good News For GB,
MSN: Is the Uk Govt Going Bust?
People are seeing through the lies and deceit now! The UK has been sold down the river. Inflation, crime , debt, employment, NHS, prisons, immigartion. You name it, all messed up by Labour.
Posted by waitingfor hpc @ 10:41 AM (1267 views) Add Comment
18 Comments
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1. paul said...
I do believe John Stepek's been promoted to (a?) Deputy Editor ... ?
2. cornishman said...
PFI has to come in somewhere too.
All those schools and hospitals that we, the people, owned outright and are now having to rent from the private sector for the next ?? years.
MEW on a grand scale and not reflected in the PSBR.
3. hpwatcher said...
''People are seeing through the lies and deceit now! The UK has been sold down the river. Inflation, crime , debt, employment, NHS, prisons, immigartion. You name it, all messed up by Labour.''
I cannot agree more. Labour have got some really nutty and unworkable notions. Their obsession with human rights & spin have prevented them from taking tough decisions.
Labour will always be the party of tax and spend. Time to get rid of em'.
4. hpwatcher said...
''...Why the government can't spend us out of a recession....''
The Labour party will also be bust...wrecked by self serving politicians whose only interest is screwing the expenses.
5. mark wadsworth said...
As it happens, the Labour Party IS bankrupt, they just don't like to talk about it.
Having been dissed for posting o/t before, why don't we just add 'boom and bust in house prices' to Labour's list of crimes?
6. landofconfusion said...
> The UK has been sold down the river. Inflation, crime , debt, employment, NHS, prisons, immigartion. You name it, all messed up by Labour.
Yes but ID cards will save us all.
7. waitingfor hpc said...
Good to see that got us going - always hard to wake up at work after the extra day off!
Went away for the weekend - everywhere was quiet, I think the recession is kicking in now.
Now ... where was the best place to stand on the titanic when it was going down?? .... up the front and go first? or at the back and watch it all happening??
mmm.... maybe the in the liferaft? ... do we have one?
8. shipbuilder said...
I have to play the devil's advocate again here - do you REALLY believe that things will get back to normal and be hunky dory with the Tories back in? Or is it possible that the fundamental problems with our economy and society are a bit more deep rooted? We need to start taking the blinkers off - what will the Tories do differently?
Will they ask for public scrutiny of MP expenses?
Will they refuse MP pay cuts?
Would they have regulated the financial industry more over the last 10 years?
Would they have prevented sub-prime in the US?
Would they have discouraged household spending and debt?
Would they have kept interest rates higher?
Would they have given 'independence' to the BofE?
Would they have discouraged BTL and reckless lending by the banks?
Would they have moved towards a service based economy, or back to manufacturing?
Would there be less business-style targets for the NHS or schools?
We need to look beyond the tired and traditional and expect more of our politicians.
9. mark wadsworth said...
@ Waiting for "maybe the in the liferaft? ... do we have one?"
The situation we are in is best summarised as "UP sh1t creek without a paddle. Or a life jacket. Or even a boat"
@ Shipbuilder, no of course the Tories wouldn't have been much better, but they wouldn't have been quite as bad. Hence why I have given up on the Big Three parties (and BNP and Greens are beyond the pale AFAICS).
10. landofconfusion said...
> 8. shipbuilder said...
>
> do you REALLY believe that things will get back to normal and be hunky dory with the Tories back in?
No of course not. They will probably act just like Liebour did when they go in and blame 'them' for the problems which follow.
Still, they should be at least a little more financially prudent. Hopefully.
11. last_days_of_disco said...
Everyone would have been better off with the Tories in power. Its simple. They don't fettish the poor, they are on the side of anyone who is willing to work damn hard and be smart. Its not pretty or fun for everyone, but it works.
12. Landofconfusion said...
> 11. last_days_of_disco said...
>
> Everyone would have been better off with the Tories in power.
While I don't agree with this (in some ways they are dangerously similar to Liebour) their track record of of maintaining a relatively stable economy is by far preferable to the economic armageddon which Liebour has now left us with.
That and their chancellor seems to actually have a clue about economics.
13. bidin'matime said...
Sadly, the last thing that politicians, whether in power or seeking power, want to tell the public is just how bad things are. For those in power it’s obvious, but those seeking power? – well, right now the Tories don’t want to sound like the ‘nasty party’ again by telling people that they must save more and spend less (or encouraging them to do so through the tax system).
So things need to get really bad before people are prepared to elect a party tough enough to put things right. A war? Famine? How bad does it need to get? The last generation to live through a war (after centuries of war, on and off) are now dying out – all that is left is a load of molly-coddled softies, who think hardship is not being able to get a signal on their mobile phone…
When you see the real hardship suffered by many people in the world today, it’s frightening to think how thin the veneer between our existence and theirs.
14. planning4acrash said...
Shipbuilder and Mark Wadsworth. In response, remember that the left/right paradigm are two sides of the same coin. The finance farce that redistributes our wealth to bankers and central government, whatever the state of the economy is the problem, and taxpayers, and recipients of public services should not be the ones to suffer via a right wing government.
The tradgedy of the right wing is, that, the tax payer suffers for the "fruits" of the unethical banking process that caused the bust in the first place. The bankers caused a financial crisis, but instead of them suffering, they get a multi-hundred billion bail out whilst the public have to put up with lower public services to pay for the assault on our way of life. The solution is not to cut taxes, or cut services, it is to end the fiat money system, to institute a 100% gold standard, where prices are affordable, where government need not borrow to fund services, where credit cycles are eliminated and boom and bust cease to exist.
Note Mark, that you cannot be truly Conservative without a Gold Standard, because most of the welfare state is simply compensating from the damaged caused by the credit cycle. People could afford healthcare without inflation, they could avoid the need for housing benefit without house price inflation, less would need employment benefit if the boom and bust cycles were ended and, given that a gold standard would be borderless, without variations in exchange rates accross borders, manufacturers would not need to deal with the destructive results of fluctuating exchange rates.
The right wing is a bad place to be for the public during a recession. The call from the right is for tax cuts and reduced public services. Now, don't get me wrong, we are taxed too highly, but, not because of a failure of the state, or capitalism, per sae, it is a failure of monetary policy. We cannot sustain high public services because of our fiat money system that is inducing the crash via the increased money supply, inflation, and rediculous interest charges being paid by government to banks, who are printing money for them, which government could print for themselves for free, or recieve via tax, if the fiat money system did not make public services unafordable via tax alone via the inflation it causes.
What we need is a Libertarian, like Ron Paul, who can force us from the corrupt central bank system onto a Gold Standard, without boom and bust, without immoral interest charges payable by government and the public simply to pay banks for the "services" of manufacturing money from nowhere, without the benefit of knowing that the money created will retain any value, given that no control is made at all over money supply, given that the government only control a thin range of inflation, CPI, which is deliberately massaged to facilitate exponential growth in the money supply.
15. cornishman said...
@ bidin'
"all that is left is a load of molly-coddled softies, who think hardship is not being able to get a signal on their mobile phone…"
Nice one! LOL !!!!!
16. landofconfusion said...
> 12. bidin'matime said...
>
> When you see the real hardship suffered by many people in the world today, it’s frightening to think how thin the veneer between our existence and theirs.
Bang on.
17. landofconfusion said...
> 13. planning4acrash said...
>
> a Gold Standard, because most of the welfare state is simply compensating from the damaged caused by the credit cycle.
All the people I know (and have had the misfortune to meet) would most likely still be out of work if there was a gold standard / absence of a credit cycle. They are (usually) on benefits because (a) It's an easy way of getting money, and (b) Because they can get away with it.
Fix those two and your problem goes away.
> The right wing is a bad place to be for the public during a recession.
IMO the Right Wing is a bad place to be at any time. During the boom years they over spend into a deficit and during the bust years they allow inflation to get out of control by favoring the wealthy.
> We cannot sustain high public services because of our fiat money system that is inducing the crash via the increased money supply
That's one of the reasons. Another one is turning public services from service oriented organisations into profit oriented organisations. Tell me, where does the profit go?
18. Planning4acrash said...
landofconfusion:
> a Gold Standard, because most of the welfare state is simply compensating from the damaged caused by the credit cycle. - All the people I know (and have had the misfortune to meet) would most likely still be out of work if there was a gold standard / absence of a credit cycle. They are (usually) on benefits because (a) It's an easy way of getting money, and (b) Because they can get away with it. - Fix those two and your problem goes away.
--------- Thrift, hard work and savings are disencentivised by inflation. If consumer prices were not so high, then the money earned on a wage would go much further, if savings were more stable, then people could look forward and save. Without boom and bust and inflation, industry would provide a better option for those on benefits. Of course, that is not the case for everybody, but I would contend that it would deal with the 80%, who will choose liberty when it is presented to them.
"Another one is turning public services from service oriented organisations into profit oriented organisations. Tell me, where does the profit go?"
------ That was not the process, the process was, allowing banks to buy private assets, basically MEWing on a big scale, so that we, the public, have to pay banks interest charges for the benefit of holding onto assets we previously owned outright. The banks couldn't care less whether the corporations are profitting from these joint ventures, so long as the public and the companies taking out the loans are paying tax, ehem, interest charges to the financiers. It is basically a glorified and legitimised protection raquet.