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interestrateripoff
http://www.guardian.co.uk/business/2008/ju....protest.shares

QUOTE
KARACHI, July 17 - Hundreds of angry investors, upset by plunging Pakistani share prices, smashed windows of Karachi Stock Exchange and scuffles broke out during a protest to demand a temporary closure of the market.

"We are looking at the situation and there is no question of suspending the market," said Razi-ur-Rahman, chairman of Securities and Exchange Commission of Pakistan (SECP), as staff cleared broken glass from the trading hall floor.

A slump in investor confidence accelerated on Thursday, as stocks fell over 4% and the rupee dropped by 1.3% by midday due to fears of political uncertainty and dire economic challenges, including a double-digit inflation rate.

The Karachi Stock Exchange (KSE) benchmark 100-share index was down 4.13%, or 433.51 points, to 10,058.37 at 11:33 a.m local time. Volume was 30m shares and losers led gainers 204 to 14.

The KSE-index is down 14% since Monday after the relaxation of curbs on daily movements that had been tightened in late June to halt a precipitate fall in values.

From Monday, daily circuit breakers reverted to 5% up or down, having been amended to 1% down or 10% up in late June, a move that stifled trading volume.


Unfortunately it appears the traders got away unhurt. I wonder if this will inspire copy cat attacks around?

Would a good stoning be too good for Brown/Darling?
JohnnyB
This is definitely the funniest story of the day.

There is going to be lots more of this. Many poor people in the developing world had pumped all their savings into stocks and shares, and they are angry. Frankly I think they should quit their moaning, it was their naive decision to invest in the first place.
steve99
Running round foaming at the mouth with a sharp knife in your hand is normal over there. Perhaps we should adapt it to our current changing circumstances.
Extradry Martini
QUOTE (JohnnyB @ Jul 17 2008, 01:15 PM) *
This is definitely the funniest story of the day.

So other people's misfortunes amuse you? Come on, this is the real world here...
X-QUORK
What's Urdu for Caveat Emptor?
thecrashingisles
QUOTE (X-QUORK @ Jul 17 2008, 01:22 PM) *
What's Urdu for Caveat Emptor?


Buyer be armed.
JohnnyB
QUOTE (Extradry Martini @ Jul 17 2008, 01:21 PM) *
So other people's misfortunes amuse you? Come on, this is the real world here...


Yes, other people's misfortunes do amuse me, especially when caused by their own stupidity and incompetence. If you want to invest in the stock market, it pays to make sure you know what the hell you are doing. I don't know enough about it, so I don't invest in it.
poorman
Interesting - they banned shorting on 23 June. Now this...just shows you how manic the markets are! huh.gif
leftiebeard
We're going to see more of this I'm afraid in Pakistan, India and S.Africa to name but 3. Too much too soon, with little understanding of market dynamics beyond the elites in these countries. Regulation though must be better than we have in UK. rolleyes.gif
Red Kharma
The correct response to a 4% drop in the index is of course a polite, yet stern, letter of rebuke to one's broker. They'll get the hang of it.

Having said that perhaps we have it all wrong. A public stoning or two may focus the minds down in the city.
Bloo Loo
QUOTE (JohnnyB @ Jul 17 2008, 01:29 PM) *
Yes, other people's misfortunes do amuse me, especially when caused by their own stupidity and incompetence. snip


Now THAT all depends on what the amatuers were PROMISED by the city boys. ph34r.gif
interestrateripoff
QUOTE (Red Kharma @ Jul 17 2008, 01:34 PM) *
The correct response to a 4% drop in the index is of course a polite, yet stern, letter of rebuke to one's broker. They'll get the hang of it.

Having said that perhaps we have it all wrong. A public stoning or two may focus the minds down in the city.


It would certainly be interesting to see if Brokers would be more truthful if they feared a good stoning from upset investors when they lost money.
Extradry Martini
QUOTE (JohnnyB @ Jul 17 2008, 01:29 PM) *
Yes, other people's misfortunes do amuse me, especially when caused by their own stupidity and incompetence. If you want to invest in the stock market, it pays to make sure you know what the hell you are doing. I don't know enough about it, so I don't invest in it.

Smug arrogance. What makes you think this is caused by "stupidity and incompetence"?
JohnnyB
QUOTE (Extradry Martini @ Jul 17 2008, 01:45 PM) *
Smug arrogance. What makes you think this is caused by "stupidity and incompetence"?


Well, it's plainly obvious that stock market are volatile, that company values are highly subjective, and that it's actually very easy to lose money buying shares. People should accept responsibility for their own bad investment decisions.
Extradry Martini
QUOTE (JohnnyB @ Jul 17 2008, 01:49 PM) *
Well, it's plainly obvious that stock market are volatile, that company values are highly subjective, and that it's actually very easy to lose money buying shares. People should accept responsibility for their own bad investment decisions.

OK, so by extension two things:

1. No one should ever buy (or sell for that matter) stocks.

2. If someone dies because they cross the road without looking, you would also find that funny.
JohnnyB
QUOTE (Extradry Martini @ Jul 17 2008, 01:52 PM) *
OK, so by extension two things:

1. No one should ever buy (or sell for that matter) stocks.

2. If someone dies because they cross the road without looking, you would also find that funny.


1. I don't have a problem with people buying stocks, but they can't throw their toys out the pram if they lose money. If they want to make that kind of decision then they should perform due dilligence checks, and prepare themselves for the event that it might have been a bad decision.

2. I frequently end up clipping people with the handlebars on my bike because they tried to cross the road without looking. If they got hit by a bus instead of my bike then i'd just consider it natural selection, thinning down the number of complete retards in the world, which is no bad thing.

Stop trying to over-simplify in an attempt to give yourself some sort of moral high ground.
X-QUORK
QUOTE (Extradry Martini @ Jul 17 2008, 01:52 PM) *
If someone dies because they cross the road without looking, you would also find that funny.


What? Have you been to pub or something?

How does claiming that people are stupid for making a duff investment and finding it amusing equate to laughing at somebody being killed?

Tut tut EDM...you're not your usual rational self this lunchtime.
Agentimmo
Assuming the brokers had the usual disclaimer "The value of stocks can go down as well as up....." then I don't understand what the Pakastani's are protesting about. The stock market is a rich man's casino. You win some, you lose some. sad.gif
interestrateripoff
Perhaps they are under the illusion that stock prices can only every go up, a bit like the housing market really.
Extradry Martini
QUOTE (JohnnyB @ Jul 17 2008, 01:56 PM) *
1. I don't have a problem with people buying stocks, but they can't throw their toys out the pram if they lose money. If they want to make that kind of decision then they should perform due dilligence checks, and prepare themselves for the event that it might have been a bad decision.

2. I frequently end up clipping people with the handlebars on my bike because they tried to cross the road without looking. If they got hit by a bus instead of my bike then i'd just consider it natural selection, thinning down the number of complete retards in the world, which is no bad thing.

Stop trying to over-simplify in an attempt to give yourself some sort of moral high ground.

I'm not. We know nothing about these investors, yet you find their predicament amusing. We don't know what or how they invested - they may well have invested as the result of professional advice, or have given their money to "experts" to invest. That would be a more logical reason why they were throwing stones at the stock exchange, and why the "experts" are blaming the government. It's you who is over-simplifying things I think.
DissipatedYouthIsValuable
Just back from an after lunch stroll and stoning a few brokers.

Marvellously satisfying. Better than being on a rugby tour.

These hairy Jihadists have the right idea you know.

Bloody "Myles here. Paragon look rather good!" Thompkinson.

Big lump of quartz to the left temple.

Try picking up the phone and talking now you Germyn Streeted ponce.

Just as well you went for the "dark claret" jacket lining.

I'm going to stone nanny for weaning me off the breast too early, once I've had an ale and a pipe.

Stiff letters and committees? I've achieved much more with a stone in just half an hour.

Good thing about stones, you can use them over and over without paying any more money.....

Exeunt.
Extradry Martini
QUOTE (X-QUORK @ Jul 17 2008, 01:58 PM) *
What? Have you been to pub or something?

How does claiming that people are stupid for making a duff investment and finding it amusing equate to laughing at somebody being killed?

Tut tut EDM...you're not your usual rational self this lunchtime.

No, he himself said that he finds it amusing when people suffer as a result of their own mistakes.
Minos
QUOTE (JohnnyB @ Jul 17 2008, 01:56 PM) *
1. I don't have a problem with people buying stocks, but they can't throw their toys out the pram if they lose money. If they want to make that kind of decision then they should perform due dilligence checks, and prepare themselves for the event that it might have been a bad decision.

2. I frequently end up clipping people with the handlebars on my bike because they tried to cross the road without looking. If they got hit by a bus instead of my bike then i'd just consider it natural selection, thinning down the number of complete retards in the world, which is no bad thing.

Stop trying to over-simplify in an attempt to give yourself some sort of moral high ground.

How do you know you aren't a retard?
JohnnyB
QUOTE (Extradry Martini @ Jul 17 2008, 02:04 PM) *
I'm not. We know nothing about these investors, yet you find their predicament amusing. We don't know what or how they invested - they may well have invested as the result of professional advice, or have given their money to "experts" to invest. That would be a more logical reason why they were throwing stones at the stock exchange, and why the "experts" are blaming the government. It's you who is over-simplifying things I think.

They may have sought 'expert' advice but the 'expert' didn't put a gun to their heads and make them buy stocks. They chose to buy them and they bear the risks associated with that. I realise that brokers make money selling stocks, so i'm not going to take their word for what is or isn't a good investment, i'll do my own research and bear my own responsibility.

The same with BTL investors, I don't think they can really go boohooing to the Govt because they made a crap decision based on a foolish mantra that property prices always go up. Those that were idiots and believed the so called experts have no one but themselves to blame and I will laugh at them all the way to the Bankruptcy hearing.
JohnnyB
QUOTE (Minos @ Jul 17 2008, 02:07 PM) *
How do you know you aren't a retard?


I don't cross the road without looking, that's a good start.
X-QUORK
QUOTE (Extradry Martini @ Jul 17 2008, 02:06 PM) *
No, he himself said that he finds it amusing when people suffer as a result of their own mistakes.


Hmmm...but you changed the context of his amusement from something quite reasonable to something clearly distasteful i.e. laughing at a fatal accident. Rampant extrapolation at best.

Anyway, I'll leave him to fight his own fight.
Jadoube
QUOTE (JohnnyB @ Jul 17 2008, 01:56 PM) *
2. I frequently end up clipping people with the handlebars on my bike because they tried to cross the road without looking. If they got hit by a bus instead of my bike then i'd just consider it natural selection, thinning down the number of complete retards in the world, which is no bad thing.



If I recall recent non-financial news

1. You can kill folk with a bike, you don't need a bus
2. You will be jailed for it, not for life unfortunately
3. Expecting follk to get out of your (selfish) way harms your defence.
JohnnyB
QUOTE (Jadoube @ Jul 17 2008, 02:14 PM) *
If I recall recent non-financial news

1. You can kill folk with a bike, you don't need a bus
2. You will be jailed for it, not for life unfortunately
3. Expecting follk to get out of your (selfish) way harms your defence.


That guy was riding on the pavement, which makes it a totally different case, I don't ride on the pavement because we have plenty of road to ride on. I've hit plenty of people because they meander across to the edge of the pavement, and then seem to think they can just walk into the road. A bike travelling at speed can't stop nearly as quickly as a car, so by walking infront of me they have less chance of avoiding a collision.
Jadoube
QUOTE (X-QUORK @ Jul 17 2008, 02:12 PM) *
Hmmm...but you changed the context of his amusement from something quite reasonable to something clearly distasteful i.e. laughing at a fatal accident. Rampant extrapolation at best.


If I read it correctly he was suggesting pleasure/amusement at a fatal accident.
JohnnyB
QUOTE (Jadoube @ Jul 17 2008, 02:17 PM) *
If I read it correctly he was suggesting pleasure/amusement at a fatal accident.


Not pleasure, just natural selection my friend. I wouldn't go down to their funeral laughing my head off about it, but at the same time I see little reason to show any sympathy, except perhaps for the driver who hit them, as they are the one that has to live with the consequences of someone else's stupid decision.
DissipatedYouthIsValuable
QUOTE (Jadoube @ Jul 17 2008, 02:17 PM) *
If I read it correctly he was suggesting pleasure/amusement at a fatal accident.


Almost as bad as attending a bukkake featuring a quadriplegic.
thecrashingisles
Can we get back on topic please? Right, no one is to stone anyone until I blow this whistle! Do you understand?! Even, and I want to make this absolutely clear, even if they do say 'failed rights issue'!
Minos
QUOTE (JohnnyB @ Jul 17 2008, 02:19 PM) *
Not pleasure, just natural selection my friend. I wouldn't go down to their funeral laughing my head off about it, but at the same time I see little reason to show any sympathy, except perhaps for the driver who hit them, as they are the one that has to live with the consequences of someone else's stupid decision.

You're a right little nazi aren't you.
Sadman
fight, fight, fight... biggrin.gif
Red Kharma
Perhaps the natural selection here isn't the punters who have lost money on their stocks, it is the people who recommended them getting a stoning. "Crime Passionel" applied to finance. I rather like it.
JohnnyB
QUOTE (Minos @ Jul 17 2008, 02:22 PM) *
You're a right little nazi aren't you.


So what, are you saying that is someone put their hand in a lawnmower, maining themselves horribly, then you'd be like !oh, poor you, you should get compensation from that lawnmover company for making something so dangerous. Huggzzzzzzz."

Stuff like that is the whole problem with this country, if you make a dumb decision, then you have to accept the consequences. However, we seem to be going down a path where no one should ever be to blame for their own situation, which breeds irresponsibile behaviour.
DissipatedYouthIsValuable
QUOTE (JohnnyB @ Jul 17 2008, 02:27 PM) *
So what, are you saying that is someone put their hand in a lawnmower, maining themselves horribly, then you'd be like !oh, poor you, you should get compensation from that lawnmover company for making something so dangerous. Huggzzzzzzz."

Stuff like that is the whole problem with this country, if you make a dumb decision, then you have to accept the consequences. However, we seem to be going down a path where no one should ever be to blame for their own situation, which breeds irresponsibile behaviour.


Exactly. If I paint my ***** orange, flavour it with carrot and put it in a donkey's mouth and the donkey bites it off, do you expect me to sue the donkey?
No. A man has to take the loss and put it down to a misadventure d'amour.

I despair at the lack of morality today, I really do.
wickywackywoo
QUOTE (Extradry Martini @ Jul 17 2008, 01:45 PM) *
Smug arrogance. What makes you think this is caused by "stupidity and incompetence"?


Because of the way they are now behaving?
Minos
QUOTE (DissipatedYouthIsValuable @ Jul 17 2008, 02:30 PM) *
Exactly. If I paint my ***** orange, flavour it with carrot and put it in a donkey's mouth and the donkey bites it off, do you expect me to sue the donkey?
No. A man has to take the loss and put it down to a misadventure d'amour.

I despair at the lack of morality today, I really do.

There's no way you can make something that small look like a carrot.
wickywackywoo
QUOTE (Extradry Martini @ Jul 17 2008, 01:52 PM) *
OK, so by extension two things:

1. No one should ever buy (or sell for that matter) stocks.

2. If someone dies because they cross the road without looking, you would also find that funny.


Depends on who is was surely. Gordon Brown getting run over would be hilarious, especially if it was by a steam roller.
DissipatedYouthIsValuable
QUOTE (Minos @ Jul 17 2008, 02:33 PM) *
There's no way you can make something that small look like a carrot.


Trouble with donkey oral, you can generally only do it once.

But, by God, does it bring you off.
JohnnyB
QUOTE (wickywackywoo @ Jul 17 2008, 02:33 PM) *
Depends on who is was surely. Gordon Brown getting run over would be hilarious, especially if it was by a steam roller.


Hmmmm.... a steamroller going down the parliamentary lunch queue. The perfect tool for a revolution.
A.steve
QUOTE (Red Kharma @ Jul 17 2008, 02:26 PM) *
Perhaps the natural selection here isn't the punters who have lost money on their stocks, it is the people who recommended them getting a stoning. "Crime Passionel" applied to finance. I rather like it.


That would be my thinking. The idea that "it is only money" only applies where your victim is relatively rich... if you wipe out a poor person's life savings by deception, there are likely to be consequences beyond them saying "Oh, well, I should have known better."

It seems very wild-west to me... it rhymes with the sort of stories that remain from early western financial institutions (banks; stock markets - etc.) I imagine that it is remarkably easy to misguide someone who's life experiences resemble subsistence.
right_freds_dead
QUOTE (thecrashingisles @ Jul 17 2008, 02:22 PM) *
Can we get back on topic please? Right, no one is to stone anyone until I blow this whistle! Do you understand?! Even, and I want to make this absolutely clear, even if they do say 'failed rights issue'!



laugh.gif

your only making it worse for yourself.

worse ? how can it be worse ?
'failed rights issue'! 'failed rights issue'! 'failed rights issue'!
Frank Mason
But surely it is God's will to cause this turbulence in the markets. Who are they to question in?

Il ham du l'illah and inshallah and all that.

Would be funny if they stoned the traders etc Could catch on all over the world.

Peas be with you

Frank
tricksters
2. I frequently end up clipping people with the handlebars on my bike........
============================================================================

Hilarious! How frequently? Every day? Sounds like your reactions and bicycle skills aren't what they might be. Do you wobble a lot? Have you thought about some little stabilisers? Definately a retard but thanks for the entertainment.
X-QUORK
QUOTE (Frank Mason @ Jul 17 2008, 02:44 PM) *
But surely it is God's will to cause this turbulence in the markets.


No, it's only God's will when things are going your way.
JohnnyB
QUOTE (tricksters @ Jul 17 2008, 02:47 PM) *
2. I frequently end up clipping people with the handlebars on my bike........
============================================================================

Hilarious! How frequently? Every day? Sounds like your reactions and bicycle skills aren't what they might be. Do you wobble a lot? Have you thought about some little stabilisers? Definately a retard but thanks for the entertainment.


Or perhaps its because people in London seem to think they can cross the road anywhere and at any time. I'm just giving them a genrle reminder that such behaiour could get them seriously hurt.
UnsureFTB
seem to recall Pakistani investors did exactly same thing last year but also set part of the stock exchange on fire!
JohnnyB
QUOTE (UnsureFTB @ Jul 17 2008, 02:51 PM) *
seem to recall Pakistani investors did exactly same thing last year but also set part of the stock exchange on fire!


They should consider setting up a 'green zone' around the exchange
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