2008 is now with us and yet again we read about English buyers having their house demolished because it was built on ' non urban land'

Very sad for all involved and the problems for some others are not yet over; it is a problem which will be sorted but in Spanish time...their country!
The new planning and building regulations make this history for everyone except those who may be caugh by scams which even happen in UK!!

But still we have no evidence of a price crash

The Spanish property market is just as complicated as our UK market

But lets just take the Costa market and demand from northern EU to buy !

Demand is and will always be there, but it needs people ' able to buy' and 'having the confidence' to buy and that depends on the growth of the EU economy
The ability to buy has never been better as , even with the credit crunch, the mortgages you can get from 'good ' banks in Spain has never been better
But a holiday/ part time/ retirement home purchase can always be delayed!
Slow market due to lack of hometown confidence in EU

Are there lots of owners forced to sell?

Relative to the number of owners, 'No'

Those who want to sell know they have to be realistic....touch like our own UK market!

As we get in to the '2008 overseas sales market' it is clear that:

The prices for the well located and good new developments are firm
Sellers of well located and good re sales who want to sell will be realistic and accept sensible offers, otherwise they will just wait

Yes, there are cheap buys and on some developments good offers, but the cheap buys are for the risk taking dealers as they are more often than not poor quality...... and for those developments with' say 100% mortgages' ....the offer reflects the quality of the development-not good!!

Anyone looking to buy for a 'life style ' reason will I'm sure in 2008 get a good buy in Spain provided they apply the same principles to buying in Spain as they do in UK

And in the years to come will look back and reflect that they made a good buy

Even buying selectively off plan will, in my view, be OK but be selective

Trying to get in and flip is just not a prospect in Spain anymore and never will be again...you will always have to complete on good developments

If you think Spain has problems and want to buy overseas then just wait for the problems with the so called ' emerging markets'!!!!

Everyone in EU wants the sun in all the seasons of the year when they can afford it and if that is ' what you want and can afford it ' then do it now and enjoy your life

Unless we have a ' mushroom cloud' over US , UK or EU [ or one or two other places on earth] long term EU property and Spain will always be popular.......the pent up demand medium to long term from non EU areas like the ' middle east [the Moors ruled Spain for 900 years and would like to buy it back!], India China etc ' will all want a touch of the 'Med' when they can afford it [ already buying our food!]

Reality is!
If you are buying for 'life style'and a touch investment, buy now in 2008

An agent....yes.....but also a buyer

Slow market 'yes' Crash 'No' and I suppose that applies to UK as well

Business slow at the mo, Bri?

I think the Spanish property market is 'Long and Wrong'

Do not agree Wallis
But agree for in and out dealers

So time to be selective and find what you want!

You talk as a dealer but for those out there who are life style buyers with a touch of investment 2008 will be OK

Better than all the UK city centre buy to let with guaranteed rentals which are all vacant!

Speaking of a "mushroom cloud", Almeria and Murcia looked like after a mushroom cloud around Christmas 2007. There was really nobody there, all the developments were in darkness and there was no sign of life almost anywhere.

It did not look like a popular place to be, let alone pay 100K+ Euro for an apartment...

Brian

I'm pretty much with you on this. In the end there will always be demand for aspirant commodities such as well built well located touristic property.

I've come to recognise there is a pessimistic bent with many forum users here. Just about all of them will not consider themselves pessimistic as is well documented in psychology circles, indeed nearly all of them will consider themselves 'realists'.

A pessimist will by definition always find want with the world and effectively yearn for a better place, something other than the world delivers.
Similarly the pessimist has an extrememly narrow bandwidth, often referred to as a 'reality tunnel'. So hooked are thye to thier pessimistic fix's that thier mind will filter in such a way as to superimpose any negative event onto the totality, hence why they feast on the relatively rare land grab events.

Very few of these bio computers (thats all an individual really is although most will never realise this) are able to attempt life in another reality tunnel so they simply wallow in pessimism until thier atoms disperse into other organisms and inorganic collection of atoms upon death of the biocomputer.

PEOPLE MAINLY ARE NOT INVESTORS:

This forum also attracts those for whom investment is a game of comparitive yields and so on. These biocomputers fail to recognise MOST people just are'nt that way. They simply buy a property abroad with a vague notion they might rent it out, possibly.
As such the average person does not run like a rat at every bump in the road. For most, life goes on, no worries and everything works out ok in the end.


I think you are not a fan of Morocco which is fair enough, my reality tunnel not so long ago was similar to yours in that I could not see beyond Spain.

Like this ´lifestyle´ investment you were flogging before Christmas!


http://www.theolivepress.es/2007/11/12/ama...truction-video/

You can have the ´lifestyle´renting without being ripped off!

Hi Catara,

I take it you didn´t enjoy your holiday then? I would be interested to know what you thought of San Jose? I personally had a great time over the other side of the mountain, but then I did spend time with the locals

MIS

Hi Mark,

I loved it in Spain, the area of Cabo di Gata is really extraordinary! And the weather was excellent, we could get some tan and enjoy.

I would go back anytime I have a chance.

BUt I was extremely unpleasantly surprised by the developments in MOjacar, Garrucha, Vera, Aguillas (Murcia). Apartments crammed everywhere and nobody in hundreds and hundredsd of developments.

Puerto Rey, Villaricos and San Juan are nice places.

We did not go to Almeria and Roquetas del Mar, next time we will definitily go.

San JOse is a magnific place, good sea food and friendly people (few foreigners).

I´m pleased you chose San Jose in the end rather than the other places you mentioned. I´m glad the weather was fairly good for you too - I was sunbathing with a large hangover Christmas Day!

I really do hope they can keep the Cabo de Gata free from development. Although the Junta was rightly slated for knocking down an old man's house, at least the conservation message seems to be getting through now and the monstrous hotel at Carbonaras will be coming down.

http://www.theolivepress.es/index.php?tag=cabo-de-gata

The last I heard was that the Spanish government are still negotiating re the Hotel and because of the huge compensation claim by the owners [ read somewhere that the claim is for 400 M € and government has offered 20 M € !] the end result may be that it will be finished
I also think that many local people want it because it brings jobs which are in short supply in the area
This may be just a rumour but I suspect the storey is not over yet!

Link?

In the UK I'd sooner buy a property that can be fully mortgaged than one where LTV restrictions would apply (or no lending would be given.) Being a surveyor you'll know the reasons why.

So my question is this: Why are developments offering 100% LTV in Spain generally of poor quality? As an outsider looking in I'd have expected the opposite to be true provided the 100% offer was provided by a reputable bank and the terms were not prohibitive / uncompetitive.

The short answer is ' go and have a look at them' do some research on the development and offer and you will see why!

Often poor location, poor quality build and difficulties in getting The Licence of First Habitation and no one wants to buy

The mortgage market in Spain is a touch conservative but moving slowly towards the products we have been used to in UK for some time

Brian, I forget but do you even live in Spain? Not that it's a prerequisite, but living in Spain myself I don't see any similarity between your comments and what's going on here and not for the first time.
Let's have a look at prices. The other day RPI data was released in the UK and I believe it came out at 8.4%. I think that is similar over here -every month food prices are rising as are fuel costs every month. Real inflation has been running at this rate for years, yet house prices in Spain have decreased since 2003. Absolute prices are lower than they were in an environment where inflation is having a noticeable impact. DO THE MATHS -that would tell you that REAL prices are down 20-30% already. & the problems from the US haven't fed through yet.
Markets are driven by sentiment, and sentiment is with the bears at the moment. There is no denying that. Apart from a few optimistic posts from estate agents the media is flooded by negative stories. There is no upside in the market in the short or medium term.
As for the current demolition horror stories, you say that it is a problem that will be sorted out in Spanish time. Let me tell you something, Spanish time is NEVER. Some people think that Spain will drag their housing market out of the stone age. To say that it to completely misunderstand the way that Spaniards do business. There is no reason to believe that they will modernize. True enough they sometimes catch and jail the local mayors, but they are inevitably replaced by someone equally corrupt.

I can't take anyone seriously that says "investment " and "Spanish property" in the same sentence. Pick up the FT, switch on Bloomberg, CNBC whichever media you pick -investment is about commodity markets -oil, gold, silver, agricultural markets, fertilizer stocks, the list goes on and on -it doesn't include housing.

Did you know that certain banks in the region have stopped offering mortgages on property on the CDS?

I have been involved in property as a dealer since 1965! and had experience first hand on all the economic problems you can think of!.......remember the ' 3 day working week'!
Property as a long term investment has a good record!
But!
The majority of nothern EU who buy a home in the Costas do so for life style reasons but they know that in the future they will have a reasonable long term investment
Some people in UK for the same reason buy caravans or chalets [ up to 1/2 M £ in Abersoch!] or buy boats for 1/2m £ which depreciate
Same money in a Spanish home well located will be a better buy

CDS was the first into overbuild as it was in the late 70's early 80's....but anyone who did buy looks back at a ' good buy'
That. sir' is the nature of 'property' it is tangible and give or take the ups/downs in EU economy a well located property is a good buy for Life Style

You make some good points but I do not agree with everything you say, check out this article about Spain - http://www.hiday.net/

It is all a supply demand issue. Spain has too many holiday properties for all of them to be regarded as investments. Only 48 million tourist visit spain each year. With 6 million plus holiday homes plus another 800,000 in the pipeline what is going to happen. You still have hotels to compete with too. The hard reality is you are lucky to get 4-5 weeks rental per year. This will not cover your mortgage cost at all. After 10 years going on holiday to your same property you want to sell it because you want something new, however by then everyone has seen the light. Property porn, porn in the sun and porn ladder have made us blind. It will be a long long way down. The spanish crash will go on for at least 5 years if not longer.

Spain is over, greedy property porn promoters have gone to new destinations to promote their message: Bulgaria, Turkey & Northern cyprus. Next will be the northern africa coast Morocco, Tunis, Algeria, Lybia, Egypt and the list goes on and on. With every new build they destroy the rental income of existing owners arround the med.

How many people have holiday investments that pay for itself, forget the capital growth that is all hype and will stagnate. i'll bet 95% of people loose money on their so called investments.

Here is an interesting thread in which a few people eloquently put the case for the bears

http://www.spanishpropertyinsight.com/foru...asc&start=0

It currently finishes

"Do not trust commission hungry sales people."

Wise words indeed

Sorry Brian R but from what I know and read about the property market in Spain you are talking absolute nonsense. To put this in context I'm from a small mountain village south of Valencia. When I went to school Franco was still in power and we had to sing the national anthem as the flag was raised each morning before going into class. Each class had a large photograph of Franco which my teacher insisted we salute before classes started.
Many of my school friends worked their family groves and almond and olive terraces until the building boom started. Many then moved into the building industry. I have friends that are or have been involved in just about all aspects of the property business in Spain. All, and I repeat ALL, describe the last 12 to 18 months as absolute carnage in the Spanish p[roperty market. It is an absolute disaster zone with huge numbers of empty, unsold properties and prices crashing - particularly on the Costas but in the interior as well. I have friends who own cement trucks that used deliver cement to building sites 3 times a day. They are now lucky to get asked to do 1 delivery a week now!!! It was recently reported in the FT and other newspapers in the UK and Spain (and no doubt in other European countries) that 50% of Estate Agents in Spain have been closed down. Hardly evidence of the mild, but safe to still buy and invest, downturn in the property market that you describe!!!! All the talk is about how many people already have lost jobs and how many more are going to lose jobs over the coming years. In terms of recovery, people inside and outside the property business are saying that it will take 10 to 15 years to recover and possibly longer. Why? Because of the massive amount of over building - the huge over supply that now exists in every nook and cranny of the Costas/tourist destinations (yep, fantastic investment territory - NOT!). The problem for Spain, at least in part, is that the UK and other countries are seeing their property markets dive into a crash which will take 10 or so years to feed through the system. At the end of that process Spain will still be suffering from a massive over supply problem making the recovery there much harder to achieve. And because of the poor quality building methods that have been useed to build as much as possible as quickly as possible many of the occupied and the unsold properties are going to be in a very bad state in 10 years time. I have been told time and again about the horrific methods that are being used by these huge property companies - the use of moulds to pour concrete into to create the long lines of terrace properties that have appeared all over the place - you know the type of property built in such a way that if they were in the UK insurance companies would refuse to provide cover for them. Walls are incredibly thin making them very cold in the winter and unbearably hot in the summer. Because of the deterioration that will inevitably happen to these properties owners will either have to spend huge amounts of money to sort out the problems or find that they will never be able to sell their property - this is beside having to compete in a market suffering from huge over-supply. Owners of resale properties have found it nigh impossible sell over the last few years - this will continue for the next 10 to 15 years at least. As for renting out a property - ye Gods, there is so much available it is a joke to try and make money or cover the mortgage.
Sorry Brian R but you are dishing out very bad advice!!!!!

Thanks for the link forestfire. I read through the whole of that blog and some very interesting POVs. The thing that stood out for me though, is no one mentioned the crash that is coming to the UK too!

My own personal preference is not to buy a new, or off plan property in the UK, and I would most certainly extend that to any other place I chose to buy ....give me old, character and established any day.

I agree with you winkie as concerns the UK. What surprised me when I moved to Spain was the amount of people that were only looking at new properties. I soon realised why -much of the housing built 5, 10, 20 years ago was so badly built that it is already in a mess structurally.

Some of the old properites have walls 2 feet thick, that keep you warm during the cold winter nights, and cool in the hot summer sun. Many do need a bit of updating and with permission if there is space a small extention can be added. If that property has been there and lived in for many years and is still standing the chances are it will continue to do so.

did you know you can get away (i.e. no p.p. reqd.) with a building a Naya (fully covered terrace) up to 30%* off the house size


* something like that - I could check if necessary

here's some pics of a naya for example -

Link Removed

I only copied and pasted the first 30 hyper links, for the rest or you take my word or do the search yourselves in that website.


-65.73% 212500 620000 superficie:109m2 eur/m2: 1949 Málaga - Mijas / RIVIERA. ATICO VISTAS AL MAR Y NEGOCIABLE. http://www.segundamano.es/vi/7638061.htm?ca=28_s&st=s

-65.61% 186000 540910 superficie:96m2 eur/m2: 1937 Toledo - Yuncos / YUNCOS http://www.segundamano.es/vi/8632155.htm?ca=28_s&st=s

-65.45% 190000 550000 superficie:96m2 eur/m2: 1979 Málaga - Mijas / RIVIERA DEL SOL 2 HABS.1 BAÑO, GARAJE, PIS Málaga - http://www.segundamano.es/vi/9318607.htm?ca=28_s&st=s

-64.64% 142386 402678 superficie:70m2 eur/m2: 2034 Sevilla - Dos Hermanas / LAS TORRES http://www.segundamano.es/vi/9950811.htm?ca=28_s&st=s


-63.77% 145000 400200 superficie:85m2 eur/m2: 1706 Málaga - Mijas / CALAHONDA.APTO.MUY ESPACIOSO, NEGOCIABLE. http://www.segundamano.es/vi/7693626.htm?ca=28_s&st=s


-61.87% 197100 516870 superficie:100m2 eur/m2: 1971 Valencia/València - Pobla de Vallbona (la) / PUEBLO http://www.segundamano.es/vi/7461567.htm?ca=28_s&st=s

-60.38% 210000 530000 superficie:91m2 eur/m2: 2307 Málaga - Benalmádena / TORREQUEBRADA, LISTO PARA VIVIR Y NE http://www.segundamano.es/vi/7229856.htm?ca=28_s&st=s

-58.78% 115000 279000 superficie:70m2 eur/m2: 1643 AV.PRAT DE LA RIBA / HISENDA - CASC ANTIC http://www.segundamano.es/vi/9464660.htm?ca=28_s&st=s

-58.33% 154761 371425 superficie:70m2 eur/m2: 2211 Cantabria - Laredo / CASCO ANTIGUO http://www.segundamano.es/vi/7947029.htm?ca=28_s&st=s

-57.07% 141680 330000 superficie:100m2 eur/m2: 1417 Valencia/València - Pobla de Vallbona (la) / PUEBLO http://www.segundamano.es/vi/7461576.htm?ca=28_s&st=s

-56.42% 136830 314000 superficie:116m2 eur/m2: 1179 Valencia/València - La Cruz Cubierta / LA TORRE http://www.segundamano.es/vi/7677428.htm?ca=28_s&st=s

-55.95% 185000 420000 superficie:120m2 eur/m2: 1542 Málaga - Mijas / chollo a estrenar con super terrazas http://www.segundamano.es/vi/9239635.htm?ca=28_s&st=s

-55.01% 219100 487000 superficie:174m2 eur/m2: 1259 Málaga - Benalmádena / BENELMEDENA. PISO TRANQUILO Y NEGOCI http://www.segundamano.es/vi/7636957.htm?ca=28_s&st=s

-54.07% 186313 405683 superficie:95m2 eur/m2: 1961 Murcia - Murcia centro http://www.segundamano.es/vi/7036399.htm?ca=28_s&st=s

-53.75% 185000 400000 superficie:120m2 eur/m2: 1542 Málaga - Mijas / piso a estrenar de 2 habs. 2 baños con ter http://www.segundamano.es/vi/9239624.htm?ca=28_s&st=s

-53.39% 147084 315572 superficie:100m2 eur/m2: 1471 Valencia/València - Pobla de Vallbona (la) / POBLA DE VALLBONA http://www.segundamano.es/vi/7461569.htm?ca=28_s&st=s

-50.77% 168124 341484 superficie:79m2 eur/m2: 2128 Valencia/València - La Luz / OLIVERETA http://www.segundamano.es/vi/7681979.htm?ca=28_s&st=s

-50.52% 189000 382000 superficie:80m2 eur/m2: 2362 Málaga - Mijas / FUENGIROLA. MIJAS GOLF UN CHOLLO NEGOCIABL http://www.segundamano.es/vi/9428494.htm?ca=28_s&st=s

-49.60% 189000 375000 superficie:105m2 eur/m2: 1800 Málaga - Torrox / MAGNIFICO PISO 3 DORMITORIOS 2 BAÑOS A 50 http://www.segundamano.es/vi/9555458.htm?ca=28_s&st=s

-48.84% 220000 430000 superficie:71m2 eur/m2: 3098 Valencia/València - Tres Forques / del Cid http://www.segundamano.es/vi/7760755.htm?ca=28_s&st=s

-48.31% 138000 267000 superficie:75m2 eur/m2: 1840 BORDETA - CAPPONT http://www.segundamano.es/vi/9497210.htm?ca=28_s&st=s

-47.69% 181000 346000 superficie:85m2 eur/m2: 2129 Rosas - Canillejas http://www.segundamano.es/vi/9577422.htm?ca=28_s&st=s

-46.15% 210000 390000 superficie:83m2 eur/m2: 2530 Málaga - Mijas / MIJAS PUEBLO. PINTORESCO Y NEGOCIABLE.... http://www.segundamano.es/vi/7241950.htm?ca=28_s&st=s

-46.15% 168000 312000 superficie:90m2 eur/m2: 1866 Sevilla - Mairena del Aljarafe / BARRADA DE LEPANTO http://www.segundamano.es/vi/7626777.htm?ca=28_s&st=s

-45.53% 126000 231300 superficie:96m2 eur/m2: 1312 Murcia - A estrenar, 1 dormitorio con terraza de 20 m2 http://www.segundamano.es/vi/9754664.htm?ca=28_s&st=s

-45.04% 144000 262000 superficie:73m2 eur/m2: 1972 Málaga - Torremolinos / MADAME BOVARY http://www.segundamano.es/vi/7805817.htm?ca=28_s&st=s

-43.98% 198328 354000 superficie:71m2 eur/m2: 2793 Málaga - Benalmádena / ARROYO DE LA MIEL. NUEVO. ESTILO MOD

-43.61% 188900 335000 superficie:90m2 eur/m2: 2099 Salamanca - UNIFAMILIAR DE 142 m2 EN CENTRO DE MIRANDA DE AZAN http://www.segundamano.es/vi/7245617.htm?ca=28_s&st=s

-43.48% 210000 371549 superficie:97m2 eur/m2: 2165 Málaga - Mijas / RIVIERA DEL SOL. AMPLIO Y A ESTRENAR. NEGO http://www.segundamano.es/vi/9882696.htm?ca=28_s&st=s

-43.32% 157000 277000 superficie:85m2 eur/m2: 1847 BORDETA - CAPPONT http://www.segundamano.es/vi/7241993.htm?ca=28_s&st=s

-43.25% 133490 235236 superficie:80m2 eur/m2: 1668 Valencia/València - Llíria / LIRIA

-42.26% 190550 330000 superficie:90m2 eur/m2: 2117 Valencia/València - Pobla de Vallbona (la) / BASCULA

-40.91% 156263 264445 superficie:80m2 eur/m2: 1953 Murcia - Rincon de seca casa huerta

-40.91% 156263 264445 superficie:80m2 eur/m2: 1953 Murcia - Rincon de seca casa huerta

-40.89% 146000 247000 superficie:90m2 eur/m2: 1622 Valencia/València - Vilamarxant / A ESTRENAR

-40.07% 163000 272000 superficie:114m2 eur/m2: 1430 Valencia/València - Turís / Promoción en Turis

-39.90% 199281 331576 superficie:70m2 eur/m2: 2846 Remedios / Plaza de Góngora - Triana

-39.90% 129217 215000 superficie:77m2 eur/m2: 1678 Granada - Gabias (las) / LAS GABIAS

-39.77% 186966 310441 superficie:92m2 eur/m2: 2032 Valencia/València - Vilamarxant / VILAMARXANT

-39.69% 193000 320000 superficie:75m2 eur/m2: 2573 Las Palmas - Arucas / Arucas centro

-39.39% 200000 330000 superficie:70m2 eur/m2: 2857 Girona - Palamós / SANT JOAN

-39.32% 179000 295000 superficie:110m2 eur/m2: 1627 Málaga - Mijas / calahonda espectacular. NEGOCIABLE

-39.25% 154760 254760 superficie:100m2 eur/m2: 1547 Orense/Ourense - Ourense / Universidad

-39.19% 90000 148000 superficie:72m2 eur/m2: 1250 Valencia/València - Xirivella / Arte Mayor de la Seda

-38.23% 115200 186500 superficie:72m2 eur/m2: 1600 Valencia/València - La Cruz Cubierta / LA TORRE

-37.75% 155000 249000 superficie:70m2 eur/m2: 2214 Málaga - Mijas / RIVIERA DEL SOL. UN ENCANTO NEGOCIABLE.

-37.73% 161900 260000 superficie:80m2 eur/m2: 2023 Valencia/València - Tres Forques / Archena

-37.25% 154000 245400 superficie:100m2 eur/m2: 1540 Baleares/Illes Balears - Santa Margalida / can picafort

-37.03% 132805 210900 superficie:83m2 eur/m2: 1600 Murcia - Pedanías de Murcia / SANGONERA LA VERDE

-36.46% 171889 270500 superficie:75m2 eur/m2: 2292 Valencia/València - Pobla de Vallbona (la) / POBLA DE VALLBONA

-36.14% 102172 160000 superficie:74m2 eur/m2: 1381 Ingenio - Nueva Construcción

-35.53% 147000 228000 superficie:90m2 eur/m2: 1633 Las Palmas - San Bartolomé de Tirajana / San Fernando de Maspal

-35.09% 103374 159268 superficie:90m2 eur/m2: 1148 Murcia - Unión (la) / La Iglesia

-34.25% 96000 146000 superficie:80m2 eur/m2: 1200 La Coruña/A Coruña - Ferrol / Caranza

-34.21% 150255 228385 superficie:70m2 eur/m2: 2146 Guipúzcoa/Gipuzkoa - Mendaro / garagarza

-34.15% 186000 282475 superficie:82m2 eur/m2: 2268 Miraflores / A - Bailén

-33.89% 99160 150000 superficie:75m2 eur/m2: 1322 Valencia/València - Alzira / PISO CON REFORMAS/ZONA STOS PATRONOS

-33.82% 124707 188448 superficie:89m2 eur/m2: 1401 Murcia - Santiago El Mayor / RONDA SUR

-33.80% 135250 204300 superficie:80m2 eur/m2: 1690 Lleida - Cervera / Mayor

-33.78% 178800 270000 superficie:70m2 eur/m2: 2554 Zaragoza - San José / Torrero / La Paz / Oviedo

-33.50% 133000 200000 superficie:106m2 eur/m2: 1255 La Coruña/A Coruña - Urbanizacion ICARIA. Piso 95 metros utiles

-32.80% 168000 250000 superficie:80m2 eur/m2: 2100 Valencia/València - La Luz / Tres Forques

-32.35% 115000 170000 superficie:97m2 eur/m2: 1185 Sta. Cruz de Tenerife - Piso en torviscas alto

-32.26% 126000 186000 superficie:100m2 eur/m2: 1260 Pontevedra - Piso con vistas a la ria de arosa

-29.90% 105500 150500 superficie:94m2 eur/m2: 1122 Alicante/Alacant - Pilar de la Horadada / Torre de la Horadada

-29.79% 165000 235000 superficie:102m2 eur/m2: 1617 Málaga - Alhaurín El Grande / ALHAURIN SUPERCHOLLAZO 3HABS.

-29.50% 126900 180000 superficie:70m2 eur/m2: 1813 Valencia/València - Mislata / Madre Rafols

-29.15% 179702 253627 superficie:80m2 eur/m2: 2246 Cantabria - Apartamento en brazomar 29.9 mill

-28.68% 189000 265000 superficie:83m2 eur/m2: 2277 Málaga - Estepona / CERCA DE MARBELLA. CHOLLO Y NEGOCIABLE

-28.62% 93000 130285 superficie:80m2 eur/m2: 1162 Alicante/Alacant - Villajoyosa/vila Joiosa (la) / Ciudad de Castellón

-28.57% 200000 280000 superficie:90m2 eur/m2: 2222 zona playa - Piso estepona centro

-28.57% 150000 210000 superficie:90m2 eur/m2: 1666 Madrid - Piso cuatro dormitorios alcala henares

-28.18% 114192 159000 superficie:85m2 eur/m2: 1343 Las Palmas - Santa Lucía de Tirajana / Canarias

-27.78% 182000 252000 superficie:78m2 eur/m2: 2333 Madrid - Villamantilla duplex

-27.75% 186490 258100 superficie:75m2 eur/m2: 2486 Valencia/València - San José / Artes y Oficios

-26.96% 186264 255000 superficie:89m2 eur/m2: 2093 Valencia/València - Llíria / LIRIA

-26.86% 135424 185150 superficie:84m2 eur/m2: 1612 Toledo - Ocaña / Zona Fuente Grande

-26.79% 205000 280000 superficie:129m2 eur/m2: 1589 Málaga - Mijas / CALAHONDA. SUPER ACOGEDOR Y NEGOCIABLE....

-26.67% 110000 150000 superficie:80m2 eur/m2: 1375 Alicante/Alacant - Piso en San Vicente, Avenida Ancha de Castelar

-26.61% 138200 188300 superficie:70m2 eur/m2: 1974 Valencia/València - Carcaixent / AVENIDAS

-25.73% 179000 241000 superficie:75m2 eur/m2: 2386 Málaga - Alhaurín El Grande / ALHAURIN 2 HABS. OPORTUNIDAD

-25.31% 202420 271000 superficie:80m2 eur/m2: 2530 Valencia/València - Pobla de Vallbona (la) / VICARI CAMARENA

-24.96% 126000 167900 superficie:70m2 eur/m2: 1800 Tarragona - Alcanar / Ronda

-24.72% 115192 153021 superficie:70m2 eur/m2: 1645 Murcia - Unión (la) / Calle Mendez Nuñez

-24.42% 215763 285480 superficie:100m2 eur/m2: 2157 Cantabria - Centro piso amueblado de 100 metros

-24.29% 93500 123500 superficie:70m2 eur/m2: 1336 Valencia/València - Meliana / Meliana/

-24.29% 187300 247400 superficie:100m2 eur/m2: 1873 Barcelona - Esparreguera / centro

-24.26% 135000 178249 superficie:90m2 eur/m2: 1500 Valencia/València - Catarroja / catarroja

-24.19% 141240 186313 superficie:115m2 eur/m2: 1228 Sta. Cruz de Tenerife - Piso Estrenar,Zona Concorde,Garaje,Trastero

-23.81% 160000 210000 superficie:112m2 eur/m2: 1428 Valencia/València - Paterna / 1º de Mayo

-23.69% 190000 249000 superficie:70m2 eur/m2: 2714 Barcelona - Piso zona centro granollers. 3 habitaciones

-23.64% 168000 220000 superficie:70m2 eur/m2: 2400 Málaga - Benalmádena / ARROYO DE LA MIEL CENTRO

-23.64% 126000 165000 superficie:85m2 eur/m2: 1482 Toledo - Maqueda / CENTRO URBANO

-23.33% 138000 180000 superficie:75m2 eur/m2: 1840 Valencia/València - Marchalenes / Villanueva de Castellón

-23.26% 99000 129000 superficie:75m2 eur/m2: 1320 Valencia/València - Sagunto/sagunt / bisbe miedes

-22.93% 154150 200000 superficie:86m2 eur/m2: 1792 Valencia/València - Aldaia / NUEVO INSTITUTO

-22.42% 128000 165000 superficie:75m2 eur/m2: 1706 Baleares/Illes Balears - Apartamento en Puerto de Alcudia

-22.37% 191903 247200 superficie:78m2 eur/m2: 2460 Salamanca - Camino de las Aguas / CAMINO DE LAS AGUAS

-22.16% 130000 167000 superficie:113m2 eur/m2: 1150 Jaén - Torredonjimeno resd. con piscina

-22.14% 126350 162279 superficie:75m2 eur/m2: 1684 Toledo - Ventas de Retamosa (las) / ¿QUIERES UN PISO NUEVO

-21.96% 199000 255000 superficie:108m2 eur/m2: 1842 Valencia/València - Piso nuevo amueblado e impecable en Alcácer

-21.91% 159300 204000 superficie:112m2 eur/m2: 1422 Valencia/València - Xirivella / Estacion vieja

-21.48% 201000 256000 superficie:82m2 eur/m2: 2451 Valencia/València - Chiva / EL BOSQUE

-21.45% 216000 275000 superficie:70m2 eur/m2: 3085 Madrid - Collado Villalba / Residencial

-21.26% 150000 190500 superficie:70m2 eur/m2: 2143 Valencia/València - Náquera / OBRA NUEVA

-21.17% 180000 228345 superficie:80m2 eur/m2: 2250 C. Manacor / Aragón - Aragón

-21.08% 117197 148500 superficie:85m2 eur/m2: 1379 Ávila - Sotillo de la Adrada / CALLE

-21.05% 180000 228000 superficie:105m2 eur/m2: 1714 Baleares/Illes Balears - Piso palma centro 3 habt:

-20.80% 179000 226000 superficie:74m2 eur/m2: 2419 Valencia/València - Marchalenes / POBLA DEL DUC

-20.46% 196000 246415 superficie:124m2 eur/m2: 1581 Valencia/València - Rafelbuñol/rafelbunyol / rafel buñol

-20.44% 218000 274000 superficie:102m2 eur/m2: 2137 Málaga - Mijas / BENALAMADENA. ESPECTACULAR Y NEGOCIABLE...

-20.42% 220000 276465 superficie:90m2 eur/m2: 2444 La Cañada / VALTERNA - Paterna

-20.37% 215000 270000 superficie:120m2 eur/m2: 1792 Almería - El Parador, piso de 127 m2

-20.30% 207211 260000 superficie:73m2 eur/m2: 2838 Valencia/València - La Luz / TRES CRUCES

-20.13% 216000 270455 superficie:95m2 eur/m2: 2273 Málaga - Estepona Piso céntrico junto a la playa

-20.12% 189318 237000 superficie:100m2 eur/m2: 1893 Las Palmas - Palmas de Gran Canaria (las) / Alcaravaneras

-20.09% 105400 131900 superficie:74m2 eur/m2: 1424 Granada - Atarfe / PORTICOS DE GANIVET

-20.00% 200000 250000 superficie:120m2 eur/m2: 1667 Murcia - San Pedro del Pinatar / Lo Pagan

-20.00% 140000 175000 superficie:80m2 eur/m2: 1750 Alicante/Alacant - 4º piso alicante (amueblado ) Avda.Novelda

-19.69% 179900 224000 superficie:97m2 eur/m2: 1854 Valencia/València - Massalfassar / Massalafassar

-19.52% 169000 210000 superficie:80m2 eur/m2: 2112 Málaga - Rincón de la Victoria Cala del Moral Serramar

-19.51% 165000 205000 superficie:100m2 eur/m2: 1650 Málaga - Apartamento 2 dormitorios Riviera del Sol

-19.46% 192500 239000 superficie:70m2 eur/m2: 2750 Málaga - Cruz de Humilladero / Hipercor/ Teatinos

-19.44% 174300 216350 superficie:85m2 eur/m2: 2050 Cantabria - Laredo / RUA

-19.24% 110000 136205 superficie:75m2 eur/m2: 1466 Sevilla - Dos Hermanas / CANTELY

-19.23% 126212 156263 superficie:100m2 eur/m2: 1262 Salamanca - Castellanos de Moriscos / S. CRISTOBAL de la CUEST

-19.12% 127162 157215 superficie:110m2 eur/m2: 1156 Valencia/València - Massalfassar / MASSALFASSAR

-19.05% 102172 126212 superficie:90m2 eur/m2: 1135 La Coruña/A Coruña - Carballo / Zona Iglesario

-18.75% 165326 203479 superficie:80m2 eur/m2: 2066 Sevilla - Macarena / PINO MONTANO. CORRALES.

-18.75% 156263 192323 superficie:95m2 eur/m2: 1645 Murcia - Ronda sur apartamento

-18.73% 118000 145193 superficie:87m2 eur/m2: 1356 Soria - Soria / Casco Antiguo

-18.57% 114000 140000 superficie:70m2 eur/m2: 1628 Alicante/Alacant - Particular a 30 mts padre espla

-18.25% 215000 263000 superficie:110m2 eur/m2: 1954 Málaga - Torremolinos / Benalmádena

-18.18% 108183 132223 superficie:75m2 eur/m2: 1442 Barcelona - GANGA, Atico precioso en Súria

-18.18% 108182 132222 superficie:90m2 eur/m2: 1202 Alicante/Alacant - Campoamor / cerda

-18.10% 172000 210000 superficie:80m2 eur/m2: 2150 Tarragona - Reus / PAISOS CATALANS

-18.06% 113000 137900 superficie:80m2 eur/m2: 1412 Sta. Cruz de Tenerife - Pisos en construcción en CABO BLANCO

-18.05% 190000 231860 superficie:90m2 eur/m2: 2111 Valencia/València - Alboraya / Alboraya/ Zona Pl. Carmen

-18.04% 133000 162275 superficie:70m2 eur/m2: 1900 Valencia/València - Carcaixent / GERMANIES

-17.96% 217400 265000 superficie:75m2 eur/m2: 2898 Barcelona - Esparreguera / CARRETERA

-17.74% 150000 182340 superficie:78m2 eur/m2: 1923 Málaga - Mijas / Cerros del Águila

-17.65% 84142 102172 superficie:70m2 eur/m2: 1202 Córdoba - Posadas / POSADAS

-17.65% 126000 153000 superficie:75m2 eur/m2: 1680 - Vecindario piso a estrenar 126.000.

-17.60% 156000 189318 superficie:95m2 eur/m2: 1642 Valencia/València - Benimaclet / benimaclet

-17.51% 198319 240404 superficie:91m2 eur/m2: 2179 Tarragona - Vendrell (el) / CENTRO

-17.39% 114000 138000 superficie:70m2 eur/m2: 1628 Granada - Zaidín / zaidín

-17.27% 215500 260500 superficie:70m2 eur/m2: 3078 S'Aranjassa / SON FERRIOL - Son Ferriol

-17.23% 137731 166400 superficie:72m2 eur/m2: 1913 Cádiz - Jerez de la Frontera / Centro

-17.08% 199000 240000 superficie:70m2 eur/m2: 2842 Sevilla - Piso en avenida de las ciencias

-17.07% 170000 205000 superficie:80m2 eur/m2: 2125 Alicante/Alacant - Piso a 70 mts PLAYA

-17.07% 170000 205000 superficie:70m2 eur/m2: 2428 Madrid - El vellon

-17.05% 180000 217000 superficie:70m2 eur/m2: 2571 Valencia/València - La Malvarrosa / SANCHEZ COELLO

-16.92% 167000 201000 superficie:98m2 eur/m2: 1704 Granada - Gójar / Centro

-16.81% 150000 180303 superficie:90m2 eur/m2: 1666 Zaragoza - Piso en utebo

-16.73% 216500 260000 superficie:80m2 eur/m2: 2706 Oliver - ENLACES

-16.67% 200000 240000 superficie:90m2 eur/m2: 2222 Málaga - Benalmádena / espectecular villa adosada.....choll

-16.67% 200000 240000 superficie:100m2 eur/m2: 2000 Málaga - Fuengirola / FUENGIROLA CHOLLO. FULL EQUIP. 200000

-16.67% 150253 180308 superficie:74m2 eur/m2: 2030 Valencia/València - Albuixech / Albuixech/ Zona Estacion de Tren

-16.67% 135228 162273 superficie:97m2 eur/m2: 1394 Cruce de Arinaga - Piso Nueva Construcción

-16.67% 130000 156000 superficie:90m2 eur/m2: 1444 Baleares/Illes Balears - Inca / REYES CATÓLICOS

-16.67% 125000 150000 superficie:71m2 eur/m2: 1760 Castellón/Castelló - Apartamento en Nules

-16.67% 114192 137030 superficie:70m2 eur/m2: 1631 Las Palmas - Santa Lucía de Tirajana / canarias

-16.67% 105177 126213 superficie:80m2 eur/m2: 1315 Las Palmas - AGAETE Piso a estrenar próxima entrega

-16.52% 192000 230000 superficie:125m2 eur/m2: 1536 Málaga - Fuengirola / TORREBLANCA.BAJO DE 125 M2 Y NEGOCIAB

-16.46% 198334 237400 superficie:150m2 eur/m2: 1322 Garaje - Dúplex a estrenar en Tablero del Conde

-16.34% 181000 216364 superficie:70m2 eur/m2: 2585 Roquetes - Canyelles

-16.33% 205000 245000 superficie:100m2 eur/m2: 2050 Málaga - Fuengirola / MIRAMAR

-16.28% 216365 258435 superficie:80m2 eur/m2: 2704 AV.DEL SEGRE / RAMBAL FARRAN/BAIXAD - RAMBLA FERRAN

-16.28% 108000 129000 superficie:70m2 eur/m2: 1543 Las Palmas - Piso en vecindario

-16.19% 209000 249370 superficie:116m2 eur/m2: 1802 Murcia - Carmen (El) / terrazas del sol

-16.17% 131020 156300 superficie:82m2 eur/m2: 1598 Murcia - Cartagena / PLAZA DE ESPAÑA

-16.08% 120203 143230 superficie:90m2 eur/m2: 1335 Tarragona - Vimbodí / CENTRO

-16.07% 141240 168280 superficie:77m2 eur/m2: 1834 Sta. Cruz de Tenerife - Piso Estrenar,Zona Concorde,Garaje,Trastero

-16.00% 210000 250000 superficie:115m2 eur/m2: 1826 Valencia/València - VICENTICA LA SERRANA muy bien cuidado

-16.00% 126212 150253 superficie:80m2 eur/m2: 1577 Cantabria - Centro de castro 19.9 mill

-16.00% 126000 150000 superficie:75m2 eur/m2: 1680 Alicante/Alacant - Piso de 10 años en los angeles

-16.00% 126000 150000 superficie:100m2 eur/m2: 1260 Alicante/Alacant - Piso de 3 dormitorio, antes 4

-15.98% 184000 219000 superficie:111m2 eur/m2: 1658 Valencia/València - Gandia / PLAYA

-15.91% 185000 220000 superficie:65m2 eur/m2: 2846 Madrid - Alto Exremadura

-15.79% 160000 190000 superficie:75m2 eur/m2: 2133 La Coruña/A Coruña - Pontedeume / RICARDO SANCHEZ

-15.78% 189500 225000 superficie:100m2 eur/m2: 1895 Baleares/Illes Balears - Nueva planta baja de 125 m2 en Son Servera

-15.72% 126000 149500 superficie:70m2 eur/m2: 1800 Alicante/Alacant - Dénia / Els Poblets

-15.68% 199000 236000 superficie:115m2 eur/m2: 1730 Málaga - Mijas / RIVIERA, ULTIMOS APARTAMENTOS, REBAJADOS

-15.56% 114193 135228 superficie:70m2 eur/m2: 1631 Toledo - Fuensalida / PISO DE OBRA NUEVA ENTREGA INMEDIATA

-15.45% 136190 161071 superficie:70m2 eur/m2: 1945 Valencia/València - Xirivella / Zona Avd. La Paz

-15.41% 160730 190000 superficie:103m2 eur/m2: 1560 Las Palmas - Las Palmas,piso 103m

-15.41% 152000 179700 superficie:12m2 eur/m2: 12656 Cádiz - Piso obra nueva rebajado mas que con la promotora

-15.40% 159900 189000 superficie:77m2 eur/m2: 2076 Valencia/València - Massalfassar / Massalfassar

-15.38% 198334 234395 superficie:111m2 eur/m2: 1787 Sta. Cruz de Tenerife - Santa Cruz de Tenerife / CENTRO

-15.26% 198300 234000 superficie:85m2 eur/m2: 2333 Málaga - Piso seminuevo de dos dormitorios con patio

-15.22% 117000 138000 superficie:70m2 eur/m2: 1671 Alicante/Alacant - Campoamor / OLOZOAGA

-15.15% 215000 253387 superficie:95m2 eur/m2: 2263 Barcelona - Sant Celoni / La Batlloria

-15.15% 196000 231000 superficie:145m2 eur/m2: 1352 Málaga - Mijas / las lagunas

-15.15% 196000 231000 superficie:145m2 eur/m2: 1352 Málaga - Mijas / las lagunas

-15.14% 171000 201500 superficie:75m2 eur/m2: 2280 Zaragoza - San José / Torrero / La Paz / Cuarte

-15.00% 102000 120000 superficie:85m2 eur/m2: 1200 Valencia/València - Requena / REQUENA

-15.00% 102000 120000 superficie:70m2 eur/m2: 1457 Vidal / ¡OPORTUNIDAD! Junto Ctra. de L - Pizarrales

-14.97% 149900 176300 superficie:105m2 eur/m2: 1427 Valencia/València - Náquera / Fuente del Oro

-14.95% 135228 159000 superficie:119m2 eur/m2: 1136 Las Palmas - Piso de 3 HB en Av.1º de Mayo,Vecindario

-14.90% 175300 206000 superficie:100m2 eur/m2: 1753 ZONA RIU - RAMBLA ARAGO

-14.90% 168500 198000 superficie:115m2 eur/m2: 1465 Murcia - Cartagena / LOS DOLORES

-14.86% 204344 240000 superficie:75m2 eur/m2: 2724 Alicante/Alacant - Playa San Juan / Playa San Juan. Zona Historiador

Please delete.

That link is a long waste of time Drakan.
They are all ads placed by inmobiliarias.
eg 2 bed flat in Murcia or somewhere in region of Valencia down from 420,000 € to 150,000€ etc.
It was never 420K - anybody who has ever looked at any property ads in Spain will know that.

I haven't had the time to analyse them one by one. I can't vouch if some prices are irrealistic or not. What I do know is that they are coming down and having being doing so for 2 or 3 years now. Not by 40% but by more than 10% I'd say. Property prices in Spain are overvalued by at least 30%.

Newspaper articles are also written by estate agents ?

-20% resale

http://cl.invertia.com/noticias/noticia.as...4222&idtel=

-30% resale/off-plan

http://lavozdemarbella.com/marbella/000021..._ha_bajado.html

There is no bigger blind in life that the one who refusest to see what is happening.

I don't disagree with your theory that prices are falling, and i'm not blind.
I wouldn't mind some links to EAs quoting the new prices.
Just as in the main forum, links which are inaccurate should be pointed out by other forum members and not used/ abused.

Copied this from Coastrider [ Costa Blanca Newspaper] ;-

House prices in Elche continue to rise
The average price of a new house, expressed per square metre, in Elche increased by 10.1% over 2007. This is double the national rate in Spain over the last year of 5.1% according to the Society of Appraisers. In fact Elche prices have outstripped the three capitals of the Valencian region where the average increase was 7.9%. At the end of 2007 the average price of a square metre of a dwelling was €1,662 as opposed to €1,510 in December 2006.
Compared to the quarterly increases a more moderate trend is revealed as the last quarter of 2007 prices, per square metre, rose by only 1.6% compared to the previous quarter. In monetary terms, in the second trimester of 2007 a square metre of housing was €1,636, rising by only €26 to reach the year-end high of €1,662. This is better news for sellers, agents and promoters as the near-by town of Santa Pola saw house prices drop by an average of 3.1% over the same period.
There are only 21 cities in Spain that have shown a significant increase in house prices in the 100,000 or more residents category and only three that have better figures than Elche. These are, two in the Community of Madrid, Alcorcón and Fuenlabrada plus the Sevillian city of Dos Hermanas boasting price increases over the last quarter of 1.7%, 1.8% and 1.6% respectively on the average price of a new house.

Sounds very similar to what we read in the UK press about our market but no crash at present!

What point do you see in quoting a freebie local rag funded by advertising?

I see what you mean, yes I believe you are right. I owe you an apology Frank, sorry I stand corrected.

It would seem that prices are skewed so as to appear there has been a great reduction in price. Some dodgy trick pulled by the rea who posts the ad.

Is this your source of information Brian, the coastrider ? A weekly foreign newspaper where all the REA pay to place their ads.

Do you honestly want to make us believe that you think prices have gone up by more than 10% in 2007 in Spain or parts of Spain such as Elche ?

As a chartered surveyor working in Spain you should know -for a fact- that early in 2007 the Bank of Spain instructed that all property valuations had to be done realistically which immediately translated in 20-30% reductions of Spanish appraisals.

This is a fact.

I find it hard to believe that yourself being a professional chartered surveyor working in Spain can possibly think or post in a public forum that prices went up last year in Spain, let alone by 10%.

Do you think that 40.000 (forty thousand) real estate agencies shut down in Spain last year out of sheer boredom in a bull market such as the one you are portraying ?

http://www.elpais.com/videos/economia/4000...lpepueco_1/Ves/

The headline of this article from El País, probably Spain's most important and respected newspaper along with El Mundo:

"La crisis obliga a cerrar 40.000 agencias inmobiliarias en un año" no need to translate what the word "crisis" means.

http://www.elpais.com/articulo/economia/cr...elpepieco_3/Tes


Brian I can only imagine you have some very heavy vested interest posting this type of misleading information and you lose all credibility in doing so. I know dozens of surveyors and not one of them would say that property prices went up last year in Spain, not even by 1%.

I think you and me are working and living in different countries, mine is Spain I'm not sure which one is yours.

Just posting a quote from the 'Spanish Society of Appraisers' which should be of interest to anyone who has plans to change their life style and look to buy in Spain in 2008
Anyone who is sensible who wants to buy in Spain in 2008 [ and there are lots out there] will get a good deal but I suppose you could say the same in UK
During the boom years nearly every expat became an Estate Agent for Spain, now like UK it will be the professionals who will provide the service...in any case the expat estate agents have only ever handled a very small % of sales in Spain [ not surprising most of the buyers in Spain are Spanish even on the Costas and they tend to use Spanish agents ]
If you think Spain has it problems then look out for buy to let flats in UK,[ big problems coming here] and the so called emerging markets where people [ investors!] buy without any protection and in some cases non residents are not even allowed to own freeholds...so big problems here also
Always will be a big demand for northern EU people to own a place on the Costas [ and the Spanish]...its the effective demand that matters......ability to buy!
Interest rates are on the way down & down....3/4% reduction in US today and we will see much lower rates in EU this year
With the mortgages now available the prospect of being able to buy gets easier and easier
Caja Madrid, Spain's second largest savings Bank [ like our building societies] has just posted record profits for 2007, recurring net profit rose by 40% to 1.44billion € and no big provisions
Of course they expect a slow down in mortgages for 2008 but not a crash...Caja Madrid are a good business and you can expect that they will push to maintain and increase their market share in 2008 with aggressive products!
Forget about the guys wanting ' investments' and to 'flip' the people buying for life style/ holiday who do it right will if they do so in 2008 look back on a good deal
I know the flip guys in Spain are having problems, but they were always going to!!

http://www.rte.ie/business/2008/0117/spain.html

"Half of Spain's estate agencies closed in 2007

Thursday, 17 January 2008 13:10

Half of Spain's estate agencies closed their doors last year amid a sharp downturn in the sector, according to figures from the nation's main estate agents' association API.
Of the roughly 80,000 estate agencies that existed at the beginning of 2007, only 40,000 have survived the slump in sales, the figures show. "

Oh dear BrianR, oh dear.
You must be truly desperate to be trying to drum up business on this website.

This one seems to have generated some heat!

I think it is safe to say property pries have not risen in Spain in the last 12 months.

That doesnt meant to say there is a crash. Property is not worth what we hope it is or what an agent tells us it is or even what the market tells us it should be.

It is worth exactly what a purchaser is willing to pay. No more:no less.

So if we have bought with our hearts and not our heads; paid too much in the hopes of making fortunes from a safe investment; been suckered into the new hotspot; we have probably lost some money.

If however we bought with our heads, drove a hard bargain, used other peoples money for the financing and invested in a solid area; we are ok. Not making tlelphone numbers in returns but not looking to dive from the fortieth floor either.

There are more and more people on the planet every day and less and less room. Property continues to be an excellent ongoing investment, when bought wisely, in Spain or anywhere else.

wherestheview - I assume that your posting is supposed to be read as a comical version of what a desperate Estate Agent in Spain would say to members of the puiblic in the hope of trying to pull the wool over their eyes and make them believe that despite the dramatic falling prices of property in Spain + the huge amounts of property that can't sell (so worth nothing going by the wisdom you cite of 'a property is only worth what someone is prepared to pay for it') + 50% of Estate Agents going out of business in the last 12 months or so - buying a property in Spain is a sensible idea.

Your posting brings to mind the image of the American cop standing outside the firework factory that is blazing away with fireworks going off all the place saying to the crowd - 'move along, nothing to see here, move along now'.

wherestheview sums it up well both for past buys and in 2008
Good time to buy in right locations and potentail buyers can take advantage of any offers available on good developments and sensible prices for re sales
In reality there are few depressed sales about and those that are in general are picked up by the Spanish dealers [ just like in UK]
If someone has the money/ finance and wants to buy a holiday home or just relocate in UK or Spain now is just as good a time as any
Eg for Spain I can arrange for anyone serious about buying to go on a free trip to see the Polaris World Resorts in Spain on 16th Feb...have to hurry mind you as numbers for this offer are limited
Not suggesting that this is suitable for dealers but for ' life style'buyers

Brian

Change the record, you're fooling no one.

Buying in Spain now, is as close to financial suicide as you can get.

Prices are falling, but the depreciation of the £ has pushed them back up again by 15%!

There is nothing but bad news coming out of Spain.

For most of the ex-pats (whose income will be primarily from the UK) are seeing cost-of-living increases of over 25%, (when Spanish inflation and sterling depreciation are taken into consideration for day-to-day items.

This is not BS, I live in Spain and get paid in £ and it is hurting. I would be sh***ing myself if I had a mortgage here.

Britons will not be buying in Spain for years to come.

50% of Estate Agents have closed down on the costas.

The banks are cutting down on the LTV on mortgages and reducing their valuations.

As soon as you buy in Spain, with the outrageous purchase costs, you are already in a hole for 10%, acceptable in a rising market, madness in a falling one.

Add into the mix, the corruption, land-grabs, demolitions, and developers going bust....the only answer you have to that. is ......"lifestyle choice"

No one is denying that most British people would prefer to be home owners, but you can still have the Spanish lifestyle by renting.

There is so much choice, very inexpensive and no worries about illegal builds, lying solicitors, cheating agents, thieving developers or bulldozers at your front gate!

You can rent brand new luxury 2-bed properties for €600 per month!

Anyone who buys in Spain now (unless money is no object) will have a millstone around their necks for the next 10-15 years

"As good a time as any"...well what about in 5 years time, when prices have halved?

"Polaris World".....oh dear...have a read about that crowd

http://www.spanishpropertyinsight.com/foru...opic.php?t=2873

http://www.spanishpropertyinsight.com/foru...opic.php?t=2878

http://www.globalpropertyguide.com/Europe/Spain

When you buy into Spain, you are buying the way of life. Like most places buying for investment, forget it for the time being.

Not much comment on Spain recently, so thought I'd add some current stats.

New building permits to build have fallen 50% ytd - so doesn't look like the builders think they can sell new houses....
Permits are on course for 320,000 this yr, vs average 680,000 in recent years. Consumer spending is tanking, car sales are down 11.5% YoY. The average time to sell has increased from 9-12months to 18-20 months. Unemployment is rising, the Govt surplus (do you remember what that is, we had one before we started spending like dervishes with little or nothing to show for it) is shrinking rapidly.

Still see the long-term picture as encouraging?

All part of the economic sequence of the property downturn which is a consequence of the credit crunch and the adjustments that will follow.....seen it all several times before since I started in the property business in 1965

Long term the EU economy is robust and Spain's is as good as any of the others and better than us, as they have a surplus allowing them to increase public infrastructure spend to stimulate the economy
So the main property market in Spain will re adjust just like UK and in due course move forward

There is a huge demand from northern europeans for a holiday home on the Med or to retire there, just at the moment this effective demand which is discretionary, is at best now just ticking over

But there are some locations and developments where prices are firm, not a lot have to sell nor are many of these life style buyers overgeared -The Spanish Banks show signs of adopting a more modern approach to those who are

No one worries about the 'flip dealers'.....if you are a dealer then you should be able to look after yourself!!!!

Those who do want to sell and are bringing the cash back to UK can be sensible and have the benefit of a good exchange rate and adjust what they will accept

If you are a life style buyer, there are still some good deals about which when compared with , say buying a caravan or holiday cottage in UK , are very cost effective...eg 2 bed maisonette Orihuela Costa circa £ 81,250 and with the 7% IVA [ VAT] it comes in at £86,937...add the buying cost circa 3% on price and the total is £89,375......probably get you a furniture pack as well

Now when will it start to come back.......from previous experience my estimate is that we should see a gradual move back to normal early 2010

So should you buy now?
Well often best to buy at or near the bottom of a cycle

Another example:

Polaris World Resorts offer buyers lots of facilities and in due course the option to play on 9 golf courses.
A 2 bed maisonette with solarium at Indalo de Alhama is from circa £93,593...add on 10% for IVA and cost takes you to £102,952
If you buy now you will have to pay a total of 40% within say 9 months [£41,181] at todays rate
Ready in circa 2 years which takes you to 2010
Our General Election will be over with more confidence about and If you have any confidence in our UK economy there is a good chance of a better rate

As a life style buyer you will then start to get all the benefits
Now at Condalo de Alhama all the facilities will not be finished but a lot will.......so lets say you have 5 years family or life style use and want to move on - all facilities built
This takes you tp 2015........now does anyone , even on HPCF, really beleive that you will loose money!!!!
Use this money to buy a caravan, boat then you certainly will!!!
In the meantime have fun!!!

So from this perspective now is as good as any time to buy for life style reasons

If you want Spain now....then look at re sales but make sure the spec is good
Up to now many asking prices were 'un real' even when the market was good so just take the same attitude you would in UK.....make an offer........remember that the mind set of most English owners is the price they wanted last year. So they can take a drop of 15% and still have the same £ they were expecting.....so this is your starting point!!!
Just an agents view.....and a buyers......so I suppose bound to be a touch optimistic....but I hope a touch of reality....life is for living now [ well at my age it is!!]

These are long business cycles, they have momentum, and turning a cycle is difficult but it is happening, so creating an upturn is not a simple matter. Economic growth is now slowing, and at the predicted rate implies employment destruction. The surplus is there for the Govt, but it is rapidly diminished, almost gone on 2008 estimates, and will continue to deteriorate rapidly from here as consumer spending falls, construction activity declines, unemployment rises. The economic outperformance vs Europe is at an end. Credit quality is fast deteriorating, analysts now predict the excess provisions held to cover default will be exhausted this year, so bank tightening is just getting worse. Unemployment is rising. And as for the argument that some areas are unaffected, may be true for now, but this is a matter of timing. As other areas get cheaper and the disparity grows, so the pressure feeds through, in just the same way as prices ripple upwards but in reverse.

You don't need to buy until it is obvious it has turned up, until then you have downside risk only. The argument to buy seems to be summed up as buy now because it is cheaper than it was at the peak.

And the Brit second home thing is heavily dependent on the budget airlines, which look like they are getting into real trouble. What is the outlook for overseas demand when the cost of travel rockets and/or becomes restricted.