Having just put a deposit down for a 2 bed apartment [90sq mtr] in Hurghada and want to use it for investment and occasional use. The sales 'blurb' quotes rental yields from 12 to 23 % but this wont be written into the contract!

I know the political and cultural risks but think the flats are good value at 40k pounds and judging by the amount of people who tell me they have been or are going to go to egypt there should be a good rental potential.

Has any one else bought in Egypt as it would be good to swap information?

Colleagues of mine don't see Egypt as a potential self-catering holiday market, as there are such good deals to be had on package holidays; e.g a week all inclusive in a 4 star hotel, including flights and transfers for not much more than the cost of a flight alone.

Radio
Is that not what they also said about Spain?

I bought in Egypt but ended up loosing an awful lot of money.

Found out much later on that it was a classic Pyramid scheme.

I'm starting to look at Egypt, in fact going for family hols in 2 weeks, so intend to have a scout round.

From my limited investigations I get the impression that Hurghada is an up and coming area, but investment in self contained resorts is recommended, where there is loads to do for the punters.

Been looking at the Sahl Hashsheesh resort specifically Ocean Breeze....but early days.


Good luck.

Nagalka,
Would be very interested to hear your findings upon your return,especially if you manage to get on site at Sahl.Why do you feel that Ocean Breeze may be a better option than El Andalous for example?

Haven't done my research yet - had a lengthy chat with an agent re Ocean Breeze that was all really - he basically described it as located on a self contained site with lots of amenities etc and in area that is up and coming.

I do keep hearing about the cheap 5* hotels - infact we are staying in a 5 star, think the flight cost is about 80%, hotel is pretty cheap, which I guess does not bode well for the self catering market.

Additionally, there are no cheap flights - infact the flights for us our damned expensive

That is exactly the problem. The flights to Egypt are expensive and getting more expensive.

teh Ocean Breeze and El Andalous appreciated by at least £15000 in the last year. Of course it is on the paper. Why do you want to pay the extra £15000 just because you started your research a bit late. There will be many other projects in Egypt, just need to keep an eye open...

Depends upon what you mean by expensive really.I can take a return flight from my local airport (Manchester)for less than 200 uk pounds all in.For a medium haul Red Sea destination,that seems pretty good value to me.Probably even cheaper from the South.

The abundance of cheap hotels will not deter the growth of the premium self catering sector- in fact quite the opposite.These supposed 5 star hotels are generally anything but that and the abysmal food,service,entertainment,poor attitude from staff etc present a fantastic opportunity for world class luxury resorts like Sahl Hasheesh to capitalise on this situation.

I am not convinced prices have gone up by as much as 15% just yet ,especially as there are a number of very good concessions available right now,including a 10% discount and a contribution to closing costs,though the reason someone would invest here after launch is simply because they would anticipate prices rising by 20% over the NEXT 12 months.There will be an increase of 7% in March.

And you can find holidays from Manchester for less than 200 Half Board/person.

Egypt's Red Sea is a diver or a young person destination. These people do not need luxury.

I think it is quite outrageous to believe that prices in Sahl Hasheesh will grom by another 20% anytime soon...

Catara,
For someone who only a few posts ago, provided some sound advice and displayed an impressive level of insight,your absence of vision surprises me.

With marinas,golf courses,and a host of other top quality leisure facilities being constructed,do you really think the only people who will be visiting the area will be youngsters and divers?-and these people will certainly be seeking luxury;both in terms of facilities,service AND accomodation.

Beachfront apartment accomodation will be strictly limited within Sahl and if anything,a 20% increase over the next 12 months at El Andalous will probably transpire to be a conservative projection.Time will tell.

Sure ,there will always be a market for the cheap package at the lower end though anyone opting for a deal like this needd to be fully prepared to spend more time on the hotel bog drinking Immodium than on the beach drinking cocktails!

El Andalous was offered for £26000 in June, now it is at least £41000. This is a 50% increase in 8 months. Do you want us to believe that it will cost £50000 in one year from now?

Do you know how long is the stretrch of the Read Sea? About 350km. There will be resort after resort all the way from Hurghada to Berenice. The only problem will be to find them at the beggining and not pay the premiums. ...

Anyone interested in considering the possibility of shared ownership here as opposed to sole?
It would appear to offer a very sensible strategy in that all costs(and risks )are dramatically reduced.
Sahl Hasheesh in particular is a very attractive destination and this mode of ownership is already extremely popular in the States.It is only a matter of time before it gains popularity in Europe and is increasingly becoming the focus of attention in the press as a workable solution to the often onerous purchase and ongoing maintenance costs of overseas ownership.
I would be very interested in the views of others in general terms but also with specific reference to Sahl Hasheesh.

I was wondering what happened with the Sahl Hasheesh ramping.

I am sure the Europeans will flock to Sahl Hasheesh, but only after they get bored with the likes of Saidia.

Have you been to Sahl Hasheesh and to Saidia Rondy? I have been to Saidia three times and until the new airport opens the journey depresses me. Sahl Hasheesh is the opposite; straight from the airport to Sahl and you cannot fail to be impressed with the speed and quality of what is being built there... I have already bought three apartments and I am going back this week with a view to another purchase. I bought in Palm Beach Piazza last year for 90,000 GBP, absolutely front line and the Developer sold it again for 130,000 GBP 10 months later. Thats pretty good in my book! java script:add_smilie(":rolleyes:","smid_10")

I have been to both. I do not ever plan to go back to Hurghada but to Saidia I shall go when the construction is finished (as a tourist, not an investor), will be a short flight from UK.

I do not see any reason to go to Egypt more than once every 5 years except if I were a die-hard diver. It is far and expensive to fly, unbearably hot over the summer and not so warm over the winter. If I want to see something similar to Egypt I shall fly to Dubai which offers quality.

Sorry, Egypt is not a good investment. MOrocco is an acceptable one because it is close and has a better climate.

I visited both sites within 2 weeks of each other and Sahl Hasheesh was quite simply in a different class altogether.The beach and sea are far superior -genuine sparkling clear turquoise/blue clear water akin to the Maldives as opposed Saidias murky greys.

Similairly,the architecture displays genuine flair at Sahl and the topography lends itself well to some very interesting and creative design possibilities as the land slopes upwards from the sea.This elevated topography will create superb views over the bay with its picturesque mountain backdrop.Regretably,in comparison Saidia is flat and uninteresting.
Regarding Rondy's comment that as Egypt was "far,expensive to fly to ,and unbearably hot in Summer" he would instead be going to......... Dubai !,well i thought my sides were going to split.
Could this possibly be the same Rondy that was rubbishing my posts and prediction back in Feb that prices at Sahl Hasheesh would rise by 20% over the next 12 months?
Seems i was wrong here after all-it has happened in 12 weeks not 12 months.

Dubai offers luxury and leisure. Egypt is an extremely poor country, which will never have money to build what Dubai is building. I would never buy in Dubai but I would go there if I want to have 40C.

Do whatever you want to do, I studied Egypt in full detail (way before you even thought of purchasing there) and it makes no sense to purchase there. Morocco at least can offer something for less money.There are very nice mountains near both Saidia and Atlantic Coast.

Hurghada has the worst air quality in all Red Coast area, if you had studied the market you could have purchased in better area in Egypt not where the magazines are telling you to purchase.

In what concerns the increase in prices, this is what Estate Agents wants you to believe not what really happens.

Hi, This is first posting, thought I would add my views!

Firstly I consider myself a seasoned investor. I still have a couple of UK buy to lets but, as a result of poor capital growth and low yields in recent years, I have been involved in overseas property investment for 4 years. Already been in and out of Middle East (Dubai) and Eastern Europe (Budapest) which have done well (15-20% pa capital growth) but for the last 2 years have invested heavily in El Gouna and Hurghada.

With regard to any overseas investment you need to consider why you do it and what you want out of it! On the back of a poorly performing company pension scheme and other traditional investments I have invested in overseas property to supplement my retirement plans and have a 5-7 year strategy. If Uk investments provide 4-7% return at the moment, I consider anything in excess of this to be good providing it is relatively secure and tax efficient.

In that respect, the "Red Sea Riviera" does it for me. My place in El Gouna has appreciated by circa 75% in 2 years, but the place (Amd I see Sahl Hasheesh to be similar when finished) is magnificent with Marina, Golf course (Further Marina and golf course currently under construction) and will retain its exclusive feel and appeal.

Hurghada is very different, 2 years ago I wouldn't have touched it with a bargepole (My mistake!) but 12 months ago recognised the redevelopment particularly in the Intercontinental, Touristic and El Kawser (Desert Pearl/Suleder areas. As a result I have filled my boots and bought 4 x 2/3 bedroom apartments at an average prive of £22k. This place has a good 2/3 years real growth in it (25/30% pa) Yes the place is cheap and yes, there are some cheap hotel deals about but property in general is great value. If you buy under £40k and want 25% capital growth for the next 2 years, you cannot miss! Factor in no CGT or income tax and this is as good as you can get as the present. rental yields won't make you rich because you will need to be cheap to compete with some deals but aim for a 5-8% yield and grab your capital growth in 3 years.

A seasoned ramper maybe. Hurghada is the most horrible place in the Red Sea area. if you had so good knowledge, you would have invested in Marsa Alam or Ain Soukhna or even Nabq Bay. Hurghada is only for alcoholic Russians and
cheap younsters who will thrash your apartments if you dare rent to them...

Perhaps there is no CGT or income tax in Egypt but anyone who is tax resident and domiciled in the UK will be subject to both these taxes in the UK. It is therefore very misleading to claim any investment is tax free.

See my earlier comment, I didn't fancy Hurghada at all on my first visit because I had only seen the "downtown" and Sakalla areas. Both very basic and quite rough, but extremely busy with divers and holidaymakers spending money. Your comments, to be honest, have a little relevance to these areas. The Intercontinental area is very different and, for those who cannot afford El Gouna and Sahl Hasheesh (different resorts, I know) a cheap base which will give you some good capital growth within 20 minutes of these more exclusive locations. Again, as per my earlier comments, the real win is capital growth for the next 2/3 years, not rental income. As for tenants, I have "cheap youngsters who will (occassionally!) thrash your apartments" in the UK. They rent my buy to lets in Leeds near the university. As an investment vehicle, you unfortunately have to accept some of this. Thats the name of the game with a pure investment buy to let whether it be Hurghada or Huddersfield. Not sure when you where last in Hurghada or whether you have seen the Intercontinental side but it is changing for the better. I'm not trying to do some sales pitch on the areas, but it has worked for me................... the money's already in the bank!

Yes, I know HUrghada well. I went last year with the intention of buying an apartment there for peanuts. BUt I was really not attracted by anything.

Anyway, for 10000 Pounds (the price of a 1 bedroom apt in HUrghada) one probably cannot ask too much. But, one the other hand, I want to buy somewhere where I have the pleasure to visit and Hurghada is not of that type.

Your comments noted. I am not claiming that an investment here is tax free. As we are aware as law abiding, tax paying UK residents, we would be liable to declare income and profit on any overseas investment. There are people however that, allegedly, have Egyptian bank accounts set up in various currencies (Sterling, US$, Euro's) have money paid into these accounts, use their visa cards on expenditure worldwide to have it settled at the end of the month from their Egyptian bank account. This is obviously unacceptable as the Revenue would miss out on their 40%!

Do I detect Sakalla or downtown here? Been there, done that, walked the dusty and dirty streets (walked over a dead dog!) and DIDN'T buy! There is however, a big demand for property this side from the tour companies to house their increasing numbers of reps in. As you are aware, you can buy a 2 bedroom place for less than £15k , get £200 a month rental and a 12 month let. A yield of 16% is incredible and probably twice the yield you will get on the Intercontinental side, capital growth alsowould be fairly modest compared to the tourist area. My concern would be resale opportunities. Locals cant buy, tour reps cant buy (they earn $700 per month) so your best chance is to a European "buy to let" investor who was in it for the medium term 5/7 years. Your requirement is for personal use with one eye on medium term capital growth. If the Red Sea coast is specifically where you want to be look at El Gouna or Sahl Hasheesh locally but you will need £100k. In the next 2 years Marsa Alam ( 250 miles South)is the next big thing, not been there but supposed to be a good bet and very nice.

I visited Marsa Alam, it is nice indeed but quite a bit out of the way.

I also visited in big detail the Intercontinental area and it is OK.

I agree , for 15K investment Egypt probably cannot be beaten and these 15K investment will do much better than the 100k investments.