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B B C Radio London 94.9 10.08.08


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#31 Catflap

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Posted 13 August 2008 - 06:48 PM

In the interest of sharing, I myself am amazed at both the froth and hysteria that is given to house prices when they were rising and now that they are falling. I have bought 3 houses since 2005 and sold one. My decisions were made for both personal reasons to live in my own house and investment reasons. My decisions on all the properties were to always do a lot of research, buy as cheap as possible and add value to the property. All decisions were made to allow me to make money when I bought (this is possible as a lot of professionals know) and fix rates for as long as possible to avoid any problems in a downturn. All markets go up, down and sideways and I am not interested in forecasting how much or when, rather to look after my investments and keep making more (whether that be houses or shares or whatever).

This makes me a B2L Landlord and for that I do not apologise. Being 30 years old I had a choice in 2005 to complain, sit on the sidelines or make the best of what is a difficult to be young with a young family. I have made my decisions and due to sensible property investment using the advice of actual professional property investors (not inside track!!!) I am well covered to whether any storm. It's probably the same mentality that's let me start and run my own business and now live abroad 70% of the year by a beach and enjoy seeing my children grow up.

Voila. Happy Teaboy (girl!) I am.



AWOOGA

Your gain is some young families loss - you are a property speculator of the worst kind, the type that is responsible for all this mess. :angry:


Oh dear. Discussing things on internet forums is a little like arguing with a bunch of 5 year olds. I've had a bit of free time but now I'm going to be busy again so no more posts for me to entertain you.

The site has dangerous advice but its not for me to rally and show the truth. The worst I've found is FPlanner - STR in 2002 and now an expert on the housing market. Please FP - you have no place to be commenting on an industry you know nothing about. Your a complete farce with no credibility.

Others here with over 5000 posts , Firstly stop posting and join the real human world. Secondly it does not make you wise to have a lot of posts. I see no advice worth following on here. Most big posters are I suspect also angry and old. One who's name escapes me (Elizabeth is it) blaming the rising market on her not being able to buy a house. She then admits she's 55 years old. Think that shows what an ar*e she is.

I'll be off to the beach, bricking it :rolleyes: I don't think ! Enjoy your rented accommodation and your sad 9-5 lives. x



AWOOGA

You sound like a complete bitch as well - do you have any REAL friends?


For the record I have taken 100K out over the last 3 years and invested this in other ways. I have two remaining properties that are both 50% LTV and make +850 cashflow a month overall from the rent. That for the record is a success from an original 15K investment. Choosing properties carefully, buying at a good price and adding lots of value is all I did. Its not rocket science but it seemd to work out well.

Being still young I have lots still to learn but have quickly learnt there are lots of people who will happily tell you how to do things, but rarely have the success behind them. Still if you or anyone else is still willing to explain why STRing in 2002 is a good idea I'll be happy to listen. Until now I just get met with abuse on this site for asking the question - hence why the personal attacks back !!



AWOOOGA

SO obviously a troll - bought in 2005 and made ALL that money?? :lol: .... we are already back to 2004 prices in REAL terms and falling fast!! :rolleyes:

Going down big style - what a nasty piece of work. Not going too well is it? ;)

Edited by CATFLAP, 13 August 2008 - 06:50 PM.


#32 Flatdog

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Posted 13 August 2008 - 07:12 PM

If anyone is at all interested in feeding back on the recent broadcasts - See S WHitely top of page 2 - I for one would be glad of it.



Can't see 'S Whitely' on the main board....page 2?...not sure where to look!


IMO your comments in recent interviews have been clear, pointed and well....just plain sensible.
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#33 Happy Teaboy

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Posted 13 August 2008 - 10:03 PM

AWOOOGA

SO obviously a troll - bought in 2005 and made ALL that money?? :lol: .... we are already back to 2004 prices in REAL terms and falling fast!! :rolleyes:

Going down big style - what a nasty piece of work. Not going too well is it? ;)
[/quote]


Yes since 2005 that is what I made. It's not a lie, it's not a boast - it's just fact. I don't need to show off or lie to a complete bunch of strangers on an internet site. As a girlie I can get all the attention I want by just wiggling my **** in a pub ;)

Fixed rates for 3 years more and large LTV ratios help shelter from going down "big time" I hope. There is of course always that risk - we cannot predict the future.
Your other rude comments just show how angry you are. Why the anger... did you too STR in 2002?

And its on this point I'm still stuck on
... Individuals that STRed in 2001 and 2002, are today the spokesman and other loud voices for a house price crash. I say this perhaps looks like vested interest and suggests their personal decision hugely influences the noise they make today. To me its completely farcical. They tried to profit from the housing market and it didn't pay off from them. They then turn their anger on anything from B2Letters to Kirsty Allsop. Seems they need someone to blame for their mind numbing & risky decision!!!! Does anyone agree / disagree / have any comment on this ...?

I'd understand if a bunch of FTBuyers unable to buy were the spokespersons.. Remember I too was a FTB in 2005 and felt a little angry having to take such a risk and large mortgage (6* from Lloyds as already mentioned on another post I made) just to buy a derelict p*ss pit for a first house. But the anger didn't last as I realised you have to make the best of what's thrown at you... hence why no regrets or feeling i'm a nasty piece of work now. You make your own luck as they say.... however I would still understand if FTBuyers were the ones directing this call for a crash...but the STRers !!! please someone answer and help me understand...

#34 Bruce Banner

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Posted 14 August 2008 - 12:38 AM

The above posts by HT must qualify for an award as the most childish goading posts of the week so far.
.



----------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Lest there be any doubt.

No I believe prices will fall and am astounded that a so called Conservative led government could act in such a stupid way. As you can see from today, there are 2,000 HtB applicants and it has been on MSM none stop all day and they make up about 3.5% of a typical months mortgages.

BTL is a good potential way to bankruptcy and yes sometimes I make points to hopefully make people think.


#35 Killer Bunny

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Posted 14 August 2008 - 08:11 AM

Can't see 'S Whitely' on page 2?...not sure where to look!

Just the top of this page on this thread.

In 1931 they did not know yet that they were in The Great Depression
Cap'n, you cannae change the laws of... Economics!
"If they raise rates we're toast. If they don't its BECAUSE we're toast" Pundit: Sky News March 2011
"That which is unsustainable will not sustain" Milton Friedman


#36 Happy Teaboy

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Posted 14 August 2008 - 11:10 AM

The above posts by HT must qualify for an award as the most childish goading posts of the week so far.


No sensible answer on the simple question I guess proves the point. Shame, it seems youre silence speaks louder than words FP and others.

#37 Bosh

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Posted 14 August 2008 - 12:14 PM

I'll be off to the beach, bricking it :rolleyes: I don't think ! Enjoy your rented accommodation and your sad 9-5 lives. x


I remember a Troll recently (Clareinspain??) I think... that kept stating after each debate "Right I`m off to the beach" calling everyone suckers and losers :blink: She would always be back online minutes later

For what it is worth I have spoken to FP on a few occasions and actually met the man recently and would like to add that he appears to be a genuine decent fellow and seems to be doing very well for himself. Who is to say that any decision he made, when and for whatever reason was the wrong decision.
Personally I have no real issues with people who BTL or STR and will only reserve personal insults to those who attack me or my family.
I think it is daft to say you hate someone because they chose a certain course to better themselves. Those that read the market and were also a bit lucky deserve good fortune and those that were just naive and greedy will be burned completely.
Many who BTL never for once considered there responsibilties as LL`s and deserve to fry but some who took the responsibilty seriously and managed the buisness fairly with consideration for tennants rights and not solely on profits deserve a fair crack.

Happy Teaboy, good luck to you and good luck in your decisions in life but try and lay off the personal attacks. I think you have the abilty to create great debate, tone down the gloating and understand we do not know very much about anyone who posts on this forum including FP.

Bosh
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#38 Si1

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Posted 14 August 2008 - 12:32 PM

No sensible answer on the simple question I guess proves the point. Shame, it seems youre silence speaks louder than words FP and others.


Youre (sic) words speak louder than words. For the wrong reasons. Still entertaining. Why so angry?

Edited by Si1, 14 August 2008 - 12:36 PM.


#39 Catflap

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Posted 15 August 2008 - 12:31 AM

Your other rude comments just show how angry you are. Why the anger... did you too STR in 2002?


No, I got priced out. I'm only angry at people like yourself - your attitude to others that you know nothing about quite frankly stinks.



And its on this point I'm still stuck on
... Individuals that STRed in 2001 and 2002, are today the spokesman and other loud voices for a house price crash. I say this perhaps looks like vested interest and suggests their personal decision hugely influences the noise they make today. To me its completely farcical. They tried to profit from the housing market and it didn't pay off from them. They then turn their anger on anything from B2Letters to Kirsty Allsop. Seems they need someone to blame for their mind numbing & risky decision!!!! Does anyone agree / disagree / have any comment on this ...?


Completely wrong again and assuming too much - what makes you think someone that has already lived through and seen/experienced the previous housing crash was necessarily trying to make money?. With house prices at already at high income multiples in 2001 and 2002 then many would have thought a crash was imminent and wanted to exit the market to protect their own or their families wealth knowing what had happened in the last 80's to early 90's where many people had years of negative equity or lost their homes through rising interest rates.

Just because someone STR'ed in 2001/2002 doesn't make them someone that was trying to profit from property - if that was their aim then they would have stayed in the market until 2007 ffs!!!. Some people took a cautious approach and exited a market that should have risen no further, but a cut in interest rates to 3.5% in 2003 coupled with interest only mortgages, lying to get a mortgage (self-certifying false earnings) and the BTL speculative fever not seen before just drove the market even higher.

It's wasn't normal people that drove the market into a bubble, it was greedy and dishonest people yet again. People who would do anything to get rich quick at someone elses expense, namely the first-time-buyers. Anyone who either found themselves intentionally or unintentionally priced-out is going to feel a little angry that the situation was allowed to develope yet again and was aided and abetted by property ramping programmes, bent mortgage brokers and lenders like Northern Rock who were only willing to dish out the cheap money at silly multiples to people who couldn't to keep up with the repayments once rates started to rise.

Anyway, I'm quite bored with this now - why not go and do something useful with your life and your community.

Edited by CATFLAP, 15 August 2008 - 12:36 AM.


#40 Happy Teaboy

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Posted 15 August 2008 - 09:04 AM

No, I got priced out. I'm only angry at people like yourself - your attitude to others that you know nothing about quite frankly stinks.




Completely wrong again and assuming too much - what makes you think someone that has already lived through and seen/experienced the previous housing crash was necessarily trying to make money?. With house prices at already at high income multiples in 2001 and 2002 then many would have thought a crash was imminent and wanted to exit the market to protect their own or their families wealth knowing what had happened in the last 80's to early 90's where many people had years of negative equity or lost their homes through rising interest rates.

Just because someone STR'ed in 2001/2002 doesn't make them someone that was trying to profit from property - if that was their aim then they would have stayed in the market until 2007 ffs!!!. Some people took a cautious approach and exited a market that should have risen no further, but a cut in interest rates to 3.5% in 2003 coupled with interest only mortgages, lying to get a mortgage (self-certifying false earnings) and the BTL speculative fever not seen before just drove the market even higher.

It's wasn't normal people that drove the market into a bubble, it was greedy and dishonest people yet again. People who would do anything to get rich quick at someone elses expense, namely the first-time-buyers. Anyone who either found themselves intentionally or unintentionally priced-out is going to feel a little angry that the situation was allowed to develope yet again and was aided and abetted by property ramping programmes, bent mortgage brokers and lenders like Northern Rock who were only willing to dish out the cheap money at silly multiples to people who couldn't to keep up with the repayments once rates started to rise.

Anyway, I'm quite bored with this now - why not go and do something useful with your life and your community.


Thanks for answering.
Just goes to show although many people thought a crash was imminent in 2002, it didn't come. Other factors took hold of events. However much analysis and people telling you us know what will happen it just doesn't always play out like that ! Something I'm trying to keep in mind this time with the all noise telling me a crash will see prices 50% down. The same way I tried to ignore everyone telling me the house market would only ever go up. I protected myself when buying in 2005-2007.
I'm learning to ignore the personal remarks now thanks. I could be the one saving you in hospital one day ! (that could be something useful for you maybe!). Like you say I've learnt now to comment on others personally I know nothing about.

#41 Killer Bunny

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Posted 15 August 2008 - 10:13 AM

Anyone who bought in 2005 and did not sell by 2007 took a MASSIVE risk. Indeed, prices will be abck to 2005 levels by the spring, if not before. They will be at 2004 levels by late 2009. Thus, whoever bought in 2005 and increased their mortgages is about to realise their folly.

Mortgage rates on BTL have risen dramatically and rents have at best stayed static, fallen mainly.

There may be good equity still but the prices have not risen yet there is big debt on falling assets. Also, rents only just cover total costs - mortgage, LA, repairs etc

Any property (generalisation) bought in 2005 will fall > 25% by the bottom. But the mortgage will not. Neither will the rent rise.

Not so smart.

As for me, I only publicly warned about HPs since 2004 and in the media since 2006.

In 1931 they did not know yet that they were in The Great Depression
Cap'n, you cannae change the laws of... Economics!
"If they raise rates we're toast. If they don't its BECAUSE we're toast" Pundit: Sky News March 2011
"That which is unsustainable will not sustain" Milton Friedman


#42 dryrot

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Posted 15 August 2008 - 12:04 PM

[deleted]
It's probably the same mentality that's let me start and run my own business and now live abroad 70% of the year by a beach and enjoy seeing my children grow up.

OMFG! You're not in Amway, I hope? No offence, but you sound just like a brainwashed, soon-to-be-bankrupt Ambot!
Fionnuala Earley, chief economist, www.nationwide.co.uk, 31/10/07: “Homeowners may well need to content themselves with less spectacular returns on their houses over the next decade.”

#43 Si1

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Posted 15 August 2008 - 01:42 PM

Anyone who bought in 2005 and did not sell by 2007 took a MASSIVE risk. Indeed, prices will be abck to 2005 levels by the spring, if not before. They will be at 2004 levels by late 2009. Thus, whoever bought in 2005 and increased their mortgages is about to realise their folly.

Mortgage rates on BTL have risen dramatically and rents have at best stayed static, fallen mainly.

There may be good equity still but the prices have not risen yet there is big debt on falling assets. Also, rents only just cover total costs - mortgage, LA, repairs etc

Any property (generalisation) bought in 2005 will fall > 25% by the bottom. But the mortgage will not. Neither will the rent rise.

Not so smart.

As for me, I only publicly warned about HPs since 2004 and in the media since 2006.


the most bullish - or at least bullish with an economic justification - forum member (on the old FT forum) in 2002/3 was a chap named Hoog, a financial analyst, I believe. Even he, with his BTL investments, described property then as a 'hold' and not a 'buy', as it seemed expensive even then.

#44 Happy Teaboy

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Posted 15 August 2008 - 01:53 PM

Anyone who bought in 2005 and did not sell by 2007 took a MASSIVE risk. Indeed, prices will be abck to 2005 levels by the spring, if not before. They will be at 2004 levels by late 2009. Thus, whoever bought in 2005 and increased their mortgages is about to realise their folly.

Mortgage rates on BTL have risen dramatically and rents have at best stayed static, fallen mainly.

There may be good equity still but the prices have not risen yet there is big debt on falling assets. Also, rents only just cover total costs - mortgage, LA, repairs etc

Any property (generalisation) bought in 2005 will fall > 25% by the bottom. But the mortgage will not. Neither will the rent rise.

Not so smart.

As for me, I only publicly warned about HPs since 2004 and in the media since 2006.


Thanks for posting back. I disagree with all of the above in the same way I disagreed with all bullish viewpoints in the last 3 years 2005- 2008. I heard rents would only rise, interest rates would stay low, houses will always go up etc, etc. I placed no credibility on their statements and I place no credibility on your forecasts. (this is not personal so don't start yelling)

For me noone knows what's going to happen, people only guess. Its therefore best to dismiss all forecasts as guesses and say to yourself - markets go up, down and sideways - always prepare for the worst and focus your energy on buying well.
This allows me to be completely impartial to what the masses are doing.

For example - my friend and his wife (FTBers) are just in the process of buying a house in SW London now. With NOONE wanting to buy as so much hysteria out there, I think my friend will buy today at a better price than anyone looking to buy at the end of the downturn.
Your above post forecasts prices to have dropped 25% by the bottom. That, I think, can be achieved easily now if you find the right seller. I'm not advocating everyone to go and buy - just wanted to add a different point of view.

#45 eric pebble

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Posted 15 August 2008 - 03:11 PM

Put yourself in my shoes: I am actually visible. Perhaps the only poster who is NOT anonymous. .../

Hey FP! Keep on truckin' mate -- keep up the EXCELLENT work - Someone PREPARED to stand tall and tell it as it is........ All good luck to you mate!

One thing, FP: -- Some may think I am obsessed about Liar Loans/Mortgage Fraud - and they'd be right. So what?! :P :D

Anyway -- What is your line on Liar Loans? What do you think should be done to stop them?

PLUS -- The MOST IMPORTANT thing to remember about Liar Loans, imo, is that THEY SKEW THE MARKET "PRICE" upwards - EVEN IF ONLY SOME PEOPLE USE THEM:

i.e. Wherever a Liar Loan is taken out to make a purchase - be it a village, a street, a town, a city etc. -- IT HAS A PROFOUND EFFECT ON THE LOCAL MARKET --

BECAUSE - AS THE EAs USE LOCAL PRICES RECENTLY PAID FOR PROPERTIES AS A COMPARISON WHEN THEY RE-SET ALL THE LOCAL PRICES -- AND -- WHEN Mr Lying-Cheat comes along to ANY given locality and USES his DISHONESTLY OBTAINED [Liar] Loan -- and pays OVER THE ODDS FOR THAT PROPERTY. THEN - OVERNIGHT -- THAT "PRICE" HE PAYS BECOMES THE NORM -- AND EVERYONE ELSE HAS TO MATCH THIS PRICE TO BUY LOCALLY AND FURTHER AFAR!.........

THIS IS THE SECRET WEAPON THE HYPERS, FRAUDSTERS AND VI's HAVE BEEN USING FOR THE LAST 7-9 YEARS+..........

THIS IS ONE HUGE REASON FOR MASSIVE HYPES IN HOUSE "PRICES"..............



I admit it is not the ONLY reason for HPI -- but it is a VERY MAJOR DRIVER of HPI........... No?

Your views FP? Would you be prepared to try and get a discussion about this on air?

If anyone has watched this --- http://video.google....=...75&hl=en-GB

and this -- http://video.news.sk...270508_0900.flv

AND WOW!!!!!!! THE IMPLICATIONS ARE SEISMIC!!!!!!!! WHY IS THIS STILL GOING ON!?!?!?

Edited by eric pebble, 15 August 2008 - 05:32 PM.

What the media today are still not telling us in full - for some reason the lid is being kept on the whole story:
HERE IN THE UK: THE UK SUB-PRIME CATASTROPHE - IT IS NOT ONLY IN AMERICA!! THE UK LIAR LOAN INDUSTRY - Source of FICTITIOUS "MONEY", and the principle driver of the House "Price" Pyramid/Ponzi Scam & Bubble, the "Credit Crunch" - and an unacknowledged major part of and cause of the ensuing Worldwide Financial Crash.
---------------------
The following was reported in a superb documentary in late 2003 - This is now over 10 years ago!! Since then shamefully little has been done here in the UK by journalists/broadcasters to dig down deep on this story - a vast elephant in the room: Why? If you're a serious journalist - here's your story - start investigating - it is the biggest financial scandal of all time:

THE ARTICLES BELOW ARE FROM AS FAR BACK AS 2003!!

Mortgage customers 'urged to lie' - All this was way back in 2003 by the way!!
Housebuyers are being encouraged to break the law in order to obtain huge mortgages, the BBC has discovered. Brokers, and even banking staff, have been telling buyers to lie about their incomes to get bigger and bigger loans. And these underhand tactics could also be the reason why house prices have gone on rising for so long.
CLICK HERE - http://news.bbc.co.u...ess/3222053.stm

"Could you believe that a bank would invite customers to defraud it? It may sound incredible, but that is what some of Britain's biggest mortgage lenders have in effect been doing."
CLICK HERE - http://news.bbc.co.u...ess/3478635.stm

The BBC Money Programme uncovers massive mortgage fraud [2003!]: BBC TWO's The Money Programme has revealed a huge mortgage fraud with brokers from some of Britain's biggest estate agents and financial advice groups advising customers to break the law and lie about their incomes to get massively bigger mortgages. And it shows how the illicit cash raised by this method has been pouring into the housing market, boosting prices and leaving many people risking financial ruin.
CLICK HERE http://www.bbc.co.uk..._mortgage.shtml

AND READ THIS: - http://www.housepric...howtopic=152508
-----------------------------
WATCH THE VIDEO OF THE 2003/4 DOCUMENTARY HERE: -
Click on parts 2 & 3 as you go along watching this video.
------------------------------
AND WATCH THE LATEST VIDEO OF LIAR LOANS STILL IN ACTION HERE in 2008 - http://news.sky.com/.../20080641317257




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