[Leonard Hatred]

You know that bit in Get Carter where one architect says to the other, "I have an awful feeling we're not going to get our fees for this job"? Well, I've sort of had one of those moments myself tonight.

BBC's Midlands Today had a report about spiralling raw material costs and their effects on small-scale manufacturers. The situation is that their customers are telling them that they've got to cut costs, while at the same time, material costs have shot up around 40%. So, if you are a manufacturer faced with this situation and you're trying to keep costs down, who are you going to employ - someone who has to pay £180,000 to put a roof over their head, or someone who has to pay £60,000? Well, people of Britain, I've got news - it ain't gonna be you.

With the cost of doing business in Britain so high, I've come to the inevitable conclusion that manufacturing in Britain, and thus our main method of wealth creation, is doomed. You can forget about asking for wage rises to cover the rapidly rising cost of living, because in today's global economy, even record oil prices are a minor irritation compared to the titanic cost of employing somebody in Britain. You'd have to be truly insane to employ anybody here.

So what's the replacement - public sector non-jobs? Haven't we got enough of these already? And just who is going to pay the enormous amounts of tax to fund these positions? OK, what about banking and finance? Don't make me laugh. They've already scammed us all out of billions and long since made off with the proceeds. Perhaps there would be a few jobs created on the production teams of daytime property porn programmes, where the only qualification required seems to be the ability to parrot stock phrases such as "house prices will not fall. It's different this time. It's different this time. It's different this time."

I was hoping that it wouldn't be a catastrophe, but I have a bad feeling that this is going to be a very nasty and very painful recession. You begged and screamed for measures to keep house prices high and you got your wish. Now, we're hopelessly uncompetitive and the rest of the world is laughing at us.

You blew it. Well done, I hope you're truly pleased with yourselves.

Oh, and don't forget - you could have avoided this.

I'm sorry that this has been a rant, but I just needed to get it out.

[Prof]

I`ve been saying/thinking this for ages, high UK house prices = uncompetitive economy. Looks like others will finally begin to see this. Well, they may not put 2 and 2 together, but they will see the effects of 10 years of "investment" in property, instead of business and enterprise.

I feel that something bad is happening in the UK, worse than even I thought.

[beans on toast]

Its not just jobs that are affected, but the social family unit is being destroyed. High property prices have forced both partners to work all hours, just to pay off the mortgage and this is going to have a detrimental effect on any kids caught up in this situation.

Why didn't anybody in Govt flag this up as a potential disaster. Gordon Brown has been the biggest disaster for this country and the effects will last a whole generation.

[Not Long Now]

Sir Talbot Avenger, on Jun 18 2008, 07:21 PM, said:

You know that bit in Get Carter where one architect says to the other, "I have an awful feeling we're not going to get our fees for this job"? Well, I've sort of had one of those moments myself tonight.

BBC's Midlands Today had a report about spiralling raw material costs and their effects on small-scale manufacturers. The situation is that their customers are telling them that they've got to cut costs, while at the same time, material costs have shot up around 40%. So, if you are a manufacturer faced with this situation and you're trying to keep costs down, who are you going to employ - someone who has to pay £180,000 to put a roof over their head, or someone who has to pay £60,000? Well, people of Britain, I've got news - it ain't gonna be you.

With the cost of doing business in Britain so high, I've come to the inevitable conclusion that manufacturing in Britain, and thus our main method of wealth creation, is doomed. You can forget about asking for wage rises to cover the rapidly rising cost of living, because in today's global economy, even record oil prices are a minor irritation compared to the titanic cost of employing somebody in Britain. You'd have to be truly insane to employ anybody here.

So what's the replacement - public sector non-jobs? Haven't we got enough of these already? And just who is going to pay the enormous amounts of tax to fund these positions? OK, what about banking and finance? Don't make me laugh. They've already scammed us all out of billions and long since made off with the proceeds. Perhaps there would be a few jobs created on the production teams of daytime property porn programmes, where the only qualification required seems to be the ability to parrot stock phrases such as "house prices will not fall. It's different this time. It's different this time. It's different this time."

I was hoping that it wouldn't be a catastrophe, but I have a bad feeling that this is going to be a very nasty and very painful recession. You begged and screamed for measures to keep house prices high and you got your wish. Now, we're hopelessly uncompetitive and the rest of the world is laughing at us.

You blew it. Well done, I hope you're truly pleased with yourselves.

Oh, and don't forget - you could have avoided this.

I'm sorry that this has been a rant, but I just needed to get it out.

Great post.

My initial concern, when house prices started to fall, was that rates would be slashed again, to try and re-inflate the boom.

However, I forgot that this has all been done time and time again before.

Regrettably, now is pay back time. They can't get themselves out of the mess this time. We are royally screwed.

[cockrobin]

"Ruined"!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

[Ipodjunky]

beans on toast, on Jun 18 2008, 07:28 PM, said:

Why didn't anybody in Govt flag this up as a potential disaster.

Haha like they care about us. Their employers the banks were making far too much money from it. The banks are now socialising their losses (taking our taxes) while privatising their profits as per usual.

This post has been edited by Ipodjunky: 18 June 2008 - 06:37 PM

[dissident junk]

To be honest, I think it is pretty done for as well. The last ten years of Labour, and to some extent some of the 60s generation who ended up in positions of cultural power, has broken the backbone of the country so that there's no longer a core to fall back on.

Britain is embarassing. It is dirty, expensive, has a low quality of life, and has managed to create an entire swathe of an underclass who can hardly speak, let alone read or write. We have execution-style murders on the streets adn next to no civic life left.

I drive through my area and see boarded up civic halls, cinemas, drill halls, central halls. Our pubs are closing down. I look at old photos, we used to have galas, parades, a recreation parks with boating and rides back at the turn of the century. We used to have branch lines, even the poorest lived in 2-up 2-downs, and local bands and dances and libraries.

What has happened to us?

[Injin]

dissident junk, on Jun 18 2008, 07:43 PM, said:

To be honest, I think it is pretty done for as well. The last ten years of Labour, and to some extent some of the 60s generation who ended up in positions of cultural power, has broken the backbone of the country so that there's no longer a core to fall back on.

Britain is embarassing. It is dirty, expensive, has a low quality of life, and has managed to create an entire swathe of an underclass who can hardly speak, let alone read or write. We have execution-style murders on the streets adn next to no civic life left.

I drive through my area and see boarded up civic halls, cinemas, drill halls, central halls. Our pubs are closing down. I look at old photos, we used to have galas, parades, a recreation parks with boating and rides back at the turn of the century. We used to have branch lines, even the poorest lived in 2-up 2-downs, and local bands and dances and libraries.

What has happened to us?

Fiat ******ing money.

[Not Long Now]

dissident junk, on Jun 18 2008, 07:43 PM, said:

To be honest, I think it is pretty done for as well. The last ten years of Labour, and to some extent some of the 60s generation who ended up in positions of cultural power, has broken the backbone of the country so that there's no longer a core to fall back on.

...this Labour lot have seemed to think that by creating thousands of worthless, low paid, expendible jobs in call centres and other such industries, they are adding value to the economy.

Its going to be interesting to see what everyone is doing for a living in 5 years.

[oracle]

Well we have been here before.

we have 2 choices.

1)invent our way out of this mess.....rather difficult now that respective governments have been dumbing down the education
system for generations.


2)succumb to slash and burn......get embroiled in a nuclear conflict with russia and start again with a blank(but glow-in-the-dark) canvas,much like germany post ww2.

The US seems to be looking at option 2.

[crunchy]

Sir Talbot Avenger, cracking post.

All this talk of wage inflation, borrocks, it can't happen!

As a small business owner, and talking to many other small business owners, the scale of this 'slow down' is becoming very apparent. Forget wage inflation, hello unemployment.

We have been well and truly fecked

[fearandloathing]

Talbot my man, that is an exceptional post.

Nail on the friggin' head.

[tinker]

Before the boom, I'd walk past these terraced houses near me - £30-40k, then they were £80k, then they topped £100k. I just thought this was insane. This is not a good thing. Economically it made no sense.

Debt laden people have to work harder (so much for the leisure economy we were promised), earn more just to pay those debts. Two income households became the norm, meaning family life would suffer... latch-key kids, less quality time 'en famille'. Stress, competition, illusionary wealth which translated into more debt. Greed, false values, a decline in 'niceness' (humanity).

On the back of HPI we became a high cost society, uncompetitive and in the event of hard times likely to unable to produce our way out of trouble, i.e., create real wealth.

We invested in housing and a credit fuelled consumer binge; Germany invested in high-end engineering and prosper. Even France and Norway are competitive enough to build these big cruise liners - skills that we had once upon a time.

What has been done to this country is nothing short of tragic. We have fallen down the league in so many areas, pretending to be better than we are (education for example), and have been shafted and deceived by the governing elite, the spivs and the hangers on with their snouts in the trough.

The housing crash that will take down the economy - because Alistair, we don't have sound fundamentals AND you (well Gordon did) made HOUSING THE ECONOMY, muppets. Unfortunately, we are so poorly placed to weather the storm.

Could the UK become a third world county in a couple of generations, as we decline and other wealth generating nations prosper?

The only hope is that there are people who have wised up and a spreading the word... like here and in the blogshere. Never was there a need for a revolution and real change.

[huw]

Sir Talbot Avenger, on Jun 18 2008, 07:21 PM, said:

So, if you are a manufacturer faced with this situation and you're trying to keep costs down, who are you going to employ - someone who has to pay £180,000 to put a roof over their head, or someone who has to pay £60,000?

Neither, I'd employ someone prepared to live in a tar-paper shack along with 10 other members of his extended family.

(Not really, but I hope you see my point. This is globalisation.)

[The Masked Tulip]

Do you remember that public service advert from the 1970s with roles of tin soldiers and an elegant voice-over talking about British history... "the thin red line has often been tested but never broken..."

A nation of Shakespeare, Byron, Churchill, Spitfire Pilots, Wilberforce et al... and now Krusty, alchopops, chavs, City spivs, hoodies, Brown, Darling, Blears, the other clone drone female cabinet ministers! You're right, we're done for!!!

So much for building Jerusalem here