Jump to content


Photo
* * * - - 2 votes

French Property - Price Increases For 2008


  • Please log in to reply
207 replies to this topic

#16 amoflaherty

amoflaherty

    HPC Newbie

  • New Members
  • Pip
  • 27 posts

Posted 30 March 2008 - 02:20 PM

Going over this week to view four. The Agent tells me that nothing is selling ( must take the time of year into account) and to start my offers around 25% less. This is a massive change in sentiment as far as the French are concerned.
Things must be bad over there and it appears that inflation is killing them.


Hi - curious to know how your viewing trip went. Can you post any analysis on state of the market from your trip experience - which region did you visit ?

#17 whiterabbit

whiterabbit

    HPC Veteran

  • New Members
  • PipPipPipPip
  • 1,221 posts

Posted 08 April 2008 - 11:31 AM

I just got back from the Luberon near Apt. Went to vist about 10 houses for sale with my buying agent. Many had been on the market a year, most were empty. I was told to offer 20% off asking and all vendors would jump at an offer 10% below asking. I am still going to hold off as I think in another 6 months they will be dropping considerably more.

#18 wadisgod

wadisgod

    HPC Poster

  • Members
  • PipPip
  • 132 posts
  • Location:North London
  • About Me: Keep fit.<br /><br /> Stella Artois.<br /><br /> Financial independence.<br /><br /> Buying a bigger house than I have just sold for less money.<br /><br /> Pulling the legs of any one who will take the bait.<br /><br />Crystal Palace (now you can take the piss out of me)

Posted 08 April 2008 - 06:39 PM

I just got back from the Luberon near Apt. Went to vist about 10 houses for sale with my buying agent. Many had been on the market a year, most were empty. I was told to offer 20% off asking and all vendors would jump at an offer 10% below asking. I am still going to hold off as I think in another 6 months they will be dropping considerably more.




Thanks for that

#19 whiterabbit

whiterabbit

    HPC Veteran

  • New Members
  • PipPipPipPip
  • 1,221 posts

Posted 09 April 2008 - 12:23 PM

On reflection now I am over my let lag (am in the US) a couple of other things worth mentioning:

Most newer villa resales (1995-2000) were terrible quality and way over priced in my mind. On average 400k euros for 120 sq meters with no view etc. Plus of course high purchase taxes. The highest asking were of course greedy English sellers.

All needed work and my wife and I would rather not buy at all than pay those prices for nothing special. You could easily put in another 50k plus for a decent kitchen etc (maybe we are too spolit from living in the US the last few years).

The decent historic houses were better but much more expensive 800k plus and needing work but are still probably a safer bet for a very long term hold.

Rental bookings are way down and many houses have no renters yet for this season.

Conclusion: Do not buy there right now and if you want to move there rent. While you are renting you can get a real idea of the market and potential opportunities. Also my feeling is the Euro will weaken in the medium and long term.

#20 amoflaherty

amoflaherty

    HPC Newbie

  • New Members
  • Pip
  • 27 posts

Posted 09 April 2008 - 02:50 PM

On reflection now I am over my let lag (am in the US) a couple of other things worth mentioning:

Most newer villa resales (1995-2000) were terrible quality and way over priced in my mind. On average 400k euros for 120 sq meters with no view etc. Plus of course high purchase taxes. The highest asking were of course greedy English sellers.

All needed work and my wife and I would rather not buy at all than pay those prices for nothing special. You could easily put in another 50k plus for a decent kitchen etc (maybe we are too spolit from living in the US the last few years).

The decent historic houses were better but much more expensive 800k plus and needing work but are still probably a safer bet for a very long term hold.

Rental bookings are way down and many houses have no renters yet for this season.

Conclusion: Do not buy there right now and if you want to move there rent. While you are renting you can get a real idea of the market and potential opportunities. Also my feeling is the Euro will weaken in the medium and long term.


Agree. We are planning to relocate to SW France in early 2009 and have concluded that we will just rent for first year and see how the EURO/GBP and French property markets do. It will be a chance to really research the area in all 4 seasons before we commit to buying in France. Luckily we sold up in UK last summer so we don't have any UK property to worry about.

#21 Heading South

Heading South

    HPC Poster

  • Members
  • PipPip
  • 130 posts

Posted 13 April 2008 - 07:51 AM

Reports of prices falling in Dordogne according to this article in the Times...

http://business.time...icle3732209.ece

#22 claireinspain

claireinspain

    Annoying Troll

  • Trolls
  • PipPipPip
  • 409 posts

Posted 14 April 2008 - 07:57 PM

Not just the SW but this agent now has hundreds of unsold and reduced properties:

http://www.frenchest...tly-reduced.php

They really made me laugh when they put on their front page recently that interest rate cuts in the UK made it cheaper than ever to borrow and then buy in France. They obviously didnt consider the effect it would have on the euro-pound!!!!

#23 Heading South

Heading South

    HPC Poster

  • Members
  • PipPip
  • 130 posts

Posted 18 April 2008 - 12:04 PM

Not just the SW but this agent now has hundreds of unsold and reduced properties:

http://www.frenchest...tly-reduced.php

They really made me laugh when they put on their front page recently that interest rate cuts in the UK made it cheaper than ever to borrow and then buy in France. They obviously didnt consider the effect it would have on the euro-pound!!!!



Interesting that one of properties advertised actually mentions the fall in the value of Sterling versus the Euro as part justification for reducing the asking price. Perhaps if the vendors quoted the price in Sterling they might get more interest since it remove, from the sellers mind, some concerns over forex fluctuations. But not all - anyone moving out there with a UK source of income (eg pension) is going to find living costs much more expensive. Coupled with the negative changes to health care for non French residents and the difficulty in selling a UK property to raise funds, France will, I believe, lose its attractiveness for many buyers.

#24 PennyPound

PennyPound

    HPC Newbie

  • New Members
  • Pip
  • 22 posts

Posted 19 April 2008 - 10:57 AM

We bought a detached house in the Perpignan area (South East France) 2.5 years ago. We recently improved it significantly by spending over 30,000 An agency has valued it recently for less that we originallybought it!. We plan to keep it and retire there, so we don't really mind.
Our neighbours, who are french, had their house valued 50,000 less that a smaller house in the neighbourhood who was sold a few monts ago, after having been in the market for amost a year. Our neighbours think that the agencies give now low valuations a they get desperate to shift houses. They wouldn't mind selling it at a lower price, but they think that other homeowners are in denial and would not reduce their selling prices to a more realistic level. Hence they will not be able to afford buying another one.

Penny Pound

#25 wadisgod

wadisgod

    HPC Poster

  • Members
  • PipPip
  • 132 posts
  • Location:North London
  • About Me: Keep fit.<br /><br /> Stella Artois.<br /><br /> Financial independence.<br /><br /> Buying a bigger house than I have just sold for less money.<br /><br /> Pulling the legs of any one who will take the bait.<br /><br />Crystal Palace (now you can take the piss out of me)

Posted 20 April 2008 - 09:14 AM

My friend lives near Annecy and is convinced that prices are still rising!

Ant one got ant information on that area?

#26 amoflaherty

amoflaherty

    HPC Newbie

  • New Members
  • Pip
  • 27 posts

Posted 22 April 2008 - 01:13 PM

We bought a detached house in the Perpignan area (South East France) 2.5 years ago. We recently improved it significantly by spending over 30,000 An agency has valued it recently for less that we originallybought it!. We plan to keep it and retire there, so we don't really mind.
Our neighbours, who are french, had their house valued 50,000 less that a smaller house in the neighbourhood who was sold a few monts ago, after having been in the market for amost a year. Our neighbours think that the agencies give now low valuations a they get desperate to shift houses. They wouldn't mind selling it at a lower price, but they think that other homeowners are in denial and would not reduce their selling prices to a more realistic level. Hence they will not be able to afford buying another one.

Penny Pound


I can't say that I am surprised if you are talking about dept 66 (pyrenees orientales). It is a lovely area with beach and mountains etc. We looked there approx 2 years ago and were shocked by the prices - very over inflated and clearly priced for foreign buyers. We were dealing with agency beautifulsouth - just had a look now at their website and property from 2 years ago still for sale. The denial phase will pass once foreign buyers stop paying over the odds and reality sets in - the strength of the EURO I think will quicken this reality check especially for UK buyers/sellers.

#27 whiterabbit

whiterabbit

    HPC Veteran

  • New Members
  • PipPipPipPip
  • 1,221 posts

Posted 22 April 2008 - 05:31 PM

My friend lives near Annecy and is convinced that prices are still rising!

Ant one got ant information on that area?


I was just there, its a more solid area and market. Plenty of jobs and close to Geneva and Lyon helps keep things stable, Not sure about increasing though more like static.

#28 wadisgod

wadisgod

    HPC Poster

  • Members
  • PipPip
  • 132 posts
  • Location:North London
  • About Me: Keep fit.<br /><br /> Stella Artois.<br /><br /> Financial independence.<br /><br /> Buying a bigger house than I have just sold for less money.<br /><br /> Pulling the legs of any one who will take the bait.<br /><br />Crystal Palace (now you can take the piss out of me)

Posted 23 April 2008 - 04:13 PM

I was just there, its a more solid area and market. Plenty of jobs and close to Geneva and Lyon helps keep things stable, Not sure about increasing though more like static.



thanks for that

#29 freemarket

freemarket

    HPC Newbie

  • New Members
  • Pip
  • 2 posts

Posted 30 April 2008 - 07:41 PM

I had been considering retiring to France and have been looking around Perpignan for over a year - prefer Sorede or surrounding foothills.

A local agent told me that prices fell around 4% in 2006 and in 2007. In recent visits it is clear there is a lot of flexibility on all properties - agents are talking of 10% off asking price deals falling through because of lack of mortgages. This implies an immediate price flexibilty of c10% on most properties.

I have to admit there is a lot of rubbish property in France - old sheds extended poorly with the aim of selling to a Brit with no brain - such properties are to be avoided!

There are many properties still around which were advertised over a year ago - so selling is a diffiult job and prices are too high. I suspect the over supply of villas and the price collapse in Spain is making Spain a relatively attractive alternative - maybe this is causing a gradual drawn-out decline?
I am also aware of new markets opening up - Croatia, Turkey, North and West Africa for example, as well as the Middle East - especially the Middle East makes South of France a poor cousin. So France gets left in between the super rich and the relatively poor.

I also wonder if people are having difficulty servicing holiday homes bought with Euro loans out of pay packets which are less secure. The cost has gone up and the expected capital gains in Euro terms are being depleted by price falls and although offset by the falling, the gains must be diminishing as well as Euro prices fall.

I am being advised there are fewer UK buyers going to France - but those who have retired there, stay there.

house prices are falling everywhere!

#30 librarising

librarising

    HPC Newbie

  • New Members
  • Pip
  • 2 posts

Posted 07 May 2008 - 12:07 PM

Interesting thread. It seems the world is waiting to see how far prices will fall, including even the phlegmatic (property-wise) French.

Here's my experience in case you're interested:

We bought a flat in Nice three and a half years ago. Asking prices have appreciated about 40% since then, and remain steady. Nice is both a working city and a holiday destination with little room to expand, and prices have been pretty high there long-term.

In the last few months I have noticed many more properties appearing in agents' ads. Like about a four-fold increase. This may partly be simply because agents are feeling nervous (if not desperate) and so are working harder - a feature of the French property market is that properties for sale appear in many agents' adverts, as I think there's to some extent a free-for-all once a property is advertised. They get 4-5% on sales! Flats in Nice have in the time I've been looking generally tended to stay on the market for a good while before sale, but I've seen a few that have been up for six months or more, and new ones keep appearing.

So Nice is worth watching as a traditionally quite steady market under some downward pressure. It will be interesting to see how far prices eventually yield to this.

Rents in Nice by the way are quite high relative to non-Riviera locations... but are low relative to prices, and have not risen with the price rises I have mentioned. 800 euros a month will get you a quite nice spacious two-bed flat in Nice, just as it did four years ago - I wonder if this suggests some bubble qualities in prices? (for such a flat, typically about 280K euros is being asked now). Wages are not that high in Nice, though, and many lets are to students, which I think tends to keep rents steady.

Our flat is let but we actually intend to live there eventually; I wouldn't recommend Nice as a buy-to-let opportunity at current prices. But then of course you'd have to be brave/foolish to buy any property anywhere just at the moment unless forced to by circumstances.

Edited by librarising, 07 May 2008 - 12:13 PM.





0 user(s) are reading this topic

0 members, 0 guests, 0 anonymous users