[dogbox]

Martello, on Dec 14 2004, 11:35 AM, said:

Yep, that's right. That's the dream and most of the population have bought into it like moths round a candle.

High property prices casts enormous gloom over millions of people's lives every day as they struggle on doing crappy jobs for crappy pay to pay a huge mortgage.

I agree marshmallow. Life can be a gloomy grind but why critise those trying to escape this?

You can even totally opt out . I met a chap with 12 kids this summer. They have no TV, no designer clothes. They play games, make things and are virtually sell sufficient when it comes to veg and eggs etc.

Hats off to these people. I think this more basic/real way of life will become more popular now.

[zzg113]

Quote

I met a chap with 12 kids this summer. They have no TV, no designer clothes. They play games, make things and are virtually sell sufficient when it comes to veg and eggs etc.

Had he not heard of condoms?


How does he put food on the table? How does he pay his rent? Does he work?

[dom]

dogbox, on Dec 14 2004, 12:46 PM, said:

Hats off to these people. I think this more basic/real way of life will become more popular now.

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

Dogbox, No one can afford the 'down to earth' myth. The countryside is owned by the ultra rich or dole scum calling themselves 'farmers' who think the tax payer should support their falling business even though they are sat on thousands in equity.

[non-FTBer]

I can understand how the brainwashed public has been duped into this belief in property as an investment (always goes up??) and a retirement fund. Most of them never use their minds and actually think.

Following on from the discussion around schools on another thread this morning, I tihnk it is amazing that people do not actually think. After all of that state (or private) education they still can't think for themselves.... probably the same muppets who watch a few adverts between halves of Coronation Street and then go and buy everthing they see.... what a sad world.

I find it morally reprehensible that anyone cashes in on anothers misfortune, although most people do it unwittingly as they do not consider the wider consequences of their actions. Most baby boomers who are now trying to sell their homes and cash in do not realise that new money is not printed to pay for it... it going to come form somewhere.

And as for lazy, scrounging, layabout and workshy scumbags (not including people who have genuine short term difficulties finding work and the genuinely disabled) I don't know how they can live with themselves.

[dom]

non-FTBer, on Dec 14 2004, 01:10 PM, said:

And as for lazy, scrounging, layabout and workshy scumbags (not including people who have genuine short term difficulties finding work and the genuinely disabled) I don't know how they can live with themselves.           
<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

They only do it because they can and it will only get worse as the incentive to work diminishes.

[CrashedOutAndBurned]

Dogbox is the worse of the worse of the tories. The 'I climbed the ladder from my council estate' and now I want to kick it away in case anyone else tries to follow me up.

I've always been skeptical of the welfare state, as it seemed to mutate away from the vision demanded by workers into a way to keep an army of potential labour, starved of opportunties and fed on crumbs with which to threaten those workers thinking of demanding a fair wage.

Still, we're far better off with it than without it. Would dogbox be where he is without starting from a platfom of state-funded housing? Maybe if if everyone had complained about 'parasites getting cheap houses off my back' he'd have grown up in a squallid room in a tenement and his plan to 'get ahead' may have ended up trampled in the gutter.

Today council tennents are the lucky poor - lottery-like windfalls from the right to buy, and reasonably spacious housing while many families are crammed into single rooms in B&Bs, shunted around. We're heading for a new Dickensian era.

[BayAreaBear]

non-FTBer, on Dec 14 2004, 05:10 AM, said:

I find it morally reprehensible that anyone cashes in on anothers misfortune, although most people do it unwittingly as they do not consider the wider consequences of their actions. Most baby boomers who are now trying to sell their homes and cash in do not realise that new money is not printed to pay for it... it going to come form somewhere.

Quite wrong. New money IS printed to pay for it. That is exactly the problem.

[Bear Goggles]

CrashedOutAndBurned, on Dec 14 2004, 12:29 PM, said:

Today council tennents are the lucky poor - lottery-like windfalls from the right to buy, and reasonably spacious housing while many families are crammed into single rooms in B&Bs, shunted around. We're heading for a new Dickensian era.
<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

Right to buy is a scandal for todays younger generation.

Take a load of social housing built by the baby boomers' parents in the post war reconstruction years, then sell it at a reduced price and raise the expectations of a generation and create a money for nothing society. Then create a nation of private slumlords for the new generation of poor and fund them with benefits from all of the hard working people of this country who actually produce something.

Progress?

[zzg113]

http://www.timesonli...1402810,00.html


And Labour intend to make it worse.

[Gunner Robert Buie]

Dog Box
"Its sad for kids of benefit junkies who themselves get handout dependant. "

better than them breaking into your house whilst your at work

"I grew up on a council estate and made the decision along with my 3 brothers to end the cycle."

Congratulations. Just because you managed to do it doesn't mean that everyone can. Would you have escaped the cycle if you lived in a cardboard box?

"Others with exactly the same life chances as me decided to lounge around on benefits and make claim after claim for trips on pavements."

American Randy Barnes holds the record for longest men's shot put. On May 20, 1990, he achieved a distance of 23.12 m (75 ft 10.25 in), in Los Angeles, California, USA. The other highlight of his career is winning gold at the 1996 Atlanta Olympics, with a throw of 70 ft 11.25in more than two feet beyond his nearest competitor. My challenge to you DogBox is to repeat this man's achievement. Come on you have "exactly the same life chance". Come back to me then.


"If you really want to help people - start to see things as they really are."

I might be wrong but in your world there are winners and losers. You win because you are smart or made the effort and deserve all you have. Conversely you lose because you are stupid or lazy.


"I know a severly disabled lady with serebal paulsy. She draws no state benefits and she works full time. "

Good on her.

"Yet at the same time people with 'panick attacks' and slightly painful backs lounge around on benefit."

Ever hurt your back? I wouldn't wish it on anyone



"Oh, and property prices will not crash, there is no such thing as this phantom 'unsustainable bubble'."

Place a bet at the bookies. You seem so certain put your house on it.

[Sparkie]

Bear Goggles, on Dec 14 2004, 10:50 AM, said:

Morning,

It's really boring when bulls spend their time calling everyone else a doom mongers. What's doom mongerish about wanting the end of an unsustainable bubble?

I'll tell you what doom is:

A whole generation of people not being able to afford housing.
Rising bankruptcies and personal debt.
The degradation of university standards and academic funding.
A winner takes all society with widening inequality.
Landlords and EAs getting paid more than doctors or scientists.
A society where we care more about our own greed than our physical and mental health.

Thats doom - and I don't see how increasing house prices are going to do anything but increase the speed at which we head towards this situation.

A house price crash is desparately needed, and probably already underway - Be happy 
<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

All this under a LABOUR goverment Just think if Thatcher was still head girl, what Britain 2005 would be like

[zzg113]

Quote

better than them breaking into your house whilst your at work

Not really. They're stealing from you either way.

Quote

Would you have escaped the cycle if you lived in a cardboard box?

And this is supposed to mean what exactly?

Quote

American Randy Barnes holds the record for longest men's shot put. On May 20, 1990, he achieved a distance of 23.12 m (75 ft 10.25 in), in Los Angeles, California, USA. The other highlight of his career is winning gold at the 1996 Atlanta Olympics, with a throw of 70 ft 11.25in more than two feet beyond his nearest competitor.

Who gives a shit?

[Gunner Robert Buie]

Sorry but I haven't quiet got the nack for using the quote thingy....


me
better than them breaking into your house whilst your at work

zzg113
Not really. They're stealing from you either way.

my reply
one way is more socially acceptable.

me
Would you have escaped the cycle if you lived in a cardboard box?

zzg113
And this is supposed to mean what exactly

Starting from an estate receiving assistance is somewhat easier than starting from having to beg for food and look for a safe place to sleep. Not saying that escaping from the cycle of "handouts" is easy. Not by a long shot.

me
American Randy Barnes holds the record for longest men's shot put. On May 20, 1990, he achieved a distance of 23.12 m (75 ft 10.25 in), in Los Angeles, California, USA. The other highlight of his career is winning gold at the 1996 Atlanta Olympics, with a throw of 70 ft 11.25in more than two feet beyond his nearest competitor.

zzg113
Who gives a shit?

reply
Randy's mum and dad My point was that you need to compare apples with apples. Some people have more courage than others, some people have more intelligence. we are all different. To say "i made it therefore anyone can" sells yourself short.


Sure the "i dragged myself out of the gutter and made it" story's are great. I read peoples biographies all the time and I find them inspirational. I just don't buy into the i made it through hard work and if yuo don't make it it's because you are lazy. Good on you if you made it. Just don't kick the people who didn't That's my rant and my opinion. If you have different one that's cool with me.