[RedMercury]

gravity always wins, on Dec 27 2007, 08:04 PM, said:

top three reasons for NOT going

Gun proliferation
Lack of culture
and its full of Americans

Sort that out and I'd be there in a flash

By and large I've found the Americans that I work with to be highly intelligent cultured individuals. I certainly don't think the USA has a monopoly on idiots (although I've met my fair share of cretins here). I think it is a big mistake to analyse the country as one big lump. It's a fookin huge place with a massive variance of people and attitudes. Personally I prefer the East and West coasts. The Americans I know refer to the rest of it as "fly-over country".

Gun proliferation is always going to be a hot potato. I actually went to the range on xmas eve with my father and brother who are visiting, for the first time ever. I can see how people can get carried away with their guns, but to apply the British attitude on weapons to America is wrong; It is a part of their culture and they're for the most part brought up shooting and respecting firearms. There were kids in there of 7 shooting handguns(!). Of course if Britain were to repeal its firearm laws there would be bloody murder in the streets with every chav left right and centre with a gun, so I'm happy that Britain does have a ban. FWIW I came out of that range with a big grin on my face (as I'd scored the most ), but there's no way I'd ever have one in the house.

[RedMercury]

nmarks, on Dec 27 2007, 08:12 PM, said:

I might come back if Charlie Brooker is made President, though. That'd be a laugh.

Seconded.

[16bit]

The Masked Tulip, on Dec 27 2007, 06:41 PM, said:

It is a big decision. I am scared to do it for all sorts of reasons. I am scared if I go somewhere else and something happens to me that no one will know but, in truth, that is no different from here.

It is indeed a big decision that needs to be thought through very carefully. I have a friend who went to live in Canada in 2004, thinking it would be easy to adapt and adjust to a different life. It was not to be. Basically he found it hard to get a job, didn't know anyone in Toronto or anywhere else in Canada, and found it difficult to socialise and fit in with their way of life. He returned to the UK in 2005 before sinking into deep depression. He was on antidepressents for much of 2005 and 2006 before moving to Bulgaria towards the end of last year. He bought an old house there as a renovation project, but once again he found himself with no job or friends so returned to the UK. Needless to say, he is now clinically depressed once more.

It might sound harsh, but the reality for most is that there is a very good chance that a life abroad may not work out. If you only want to live abroad to be able to afford a house, then I would say that is no guarantee of a happy life at all. And don't think things are necessarily better elsewhere.... the grass is almost not always greener on the other side.

[twatmangle]

Realistbear, on Dec 27 2007, 06:26 PM, said:

Anyone else at the brink and making plans to sod off somewhere? Where?

Romania. Why?

Sunny summer. Snowy winters. Beaches. Mountains. Un-spoiled medieval towns and villages. Highly educated population, no chavs, fantastic nightlife, beautiful women, fabulous food, great beer. Cheap living, no language barrier.

[Knut]

I left for Berlin, Germany. Britain’s governing authority and bureaucratic nanny state are the major reasons I wanted to leave. I also loath the dump-on-thy-neighbour attitude that I was experiencing too often. Germany has its problems too but I haven't discovered enough of their bad traits yet!

[Godfather]

Seriously thinking about returning to Oz. Lived there for five years but returned to the UK for what was only meant to be a short time as my mum was

very sick. That was over ten years ago and I am still here. My missus is Australian so there should be no problems getting back out except that she

quite likes it here now.



Main reasons for going:

High cost of living including housing.

Lousy climate

Too much immigration, which is completely hypicritical as I would then be the immigrant, but I guess we share a common language.

The lifestyle over there is completely different. People know how to enjoy themselves.

G.

[MarkG]

Craig77, on Dec 27 2007, 08:16 PM, said:

Basically he found it hard to get a job, didn't know anyone in Toronto or anywhere else in Canada, and found it difficult to socialise and fit in with their way of life.

Yeah, hiring culture here is very different to the UK, and an awful lot of jobs are handed out to 'friends of friends' rather than openly advertised (or they're advertised and then handed out to 'friends of friends'). That said, in a sense I got my last three jobs in the UK that way as I'd previously worked with people who had worked at those companies or were then working for them.

Winter hasn't been a big deal yet despite -20C temperatures (and -30 or lower with wind-chill). Biggest issue is driving, I'm thinking of getting a 4WD of some description because only the major roads really get cleaned up properly.

[The Masked Tulip]

Craig77, on Dec 27 2007, 09:16 PM, said:

It is indeed a big decision that needs to be thought through very carefully. I have a friend who went to live in Canada in 2004, thinking it would be easy to adapt and adjust to a different life. It was not to be. Basically he found it hard to get a job, didn't know anyone in Toronto or anywhere else in Canada, and found it difficult to socialise and fit in with their way of life. He returned to the UK in 2005 before sinking into deep depression. He was on antidepressents for much of 2005 and 2006 before moving to Bulgaria towards the end of last year. He bought an old house there as a renovation project, but once again he found himself with no job or friends so returned to the UK. Needless to say, he is now clinically depressed once more.

It might sound harsh, but the reality for most is that there is a very good chance that a life abroad may not work out. If you only want to live abroad to be able to afford a house, then I would say that is no guarantee of a happy life at all. And don't think things are necessarily better elsewhere.... the grass is almost not always greener on the other side.

Yes, I agree with you. The grass is certainly not always green on the other side and, at the end of the day, there are hundreds of worse places on the planet to be born and brought up in than the UK. But... I am by myself, have no ties now and simply no longer feel that I fit in in this country. Oddly, when I was working out in the San Francisco area several years back I felt relaxed, chilled out and 'at home'. I am also aware that I am still grieving for my Mum and have mixed emotions about several things that have gone in my life in recent years, in fact over the past 20 or 30 years, that are perhaps clouding my views on things at the present time.

I am also havnig some bizarre experiences of late where elederly people, complete strangers to me, are turning to me and telling me to do what I want to do, to move on and to go where I want to go. It is fascinating.

[Family Man]

Going to Oz tomorrow for a month to check it out.

If we like it we will leave hopefully within a year.

Reasons for leaving?? where do you begin there is so much you could point to.

If I had to condense it down I'd say a lack of integrity or honour among those that we have elected and the lack of space. More people crammed into the same space more traffic and no sign of it ending.

Corruption and sardines filters into your life in a variety of ways and the future looks very bleak. GB has said we are the financial hub of the world and we all know money does not bring happiness yet this is what the country is set up to chase - money. We're not going to manufacture anything anymore.

I hope we all like OZ cause don't know where else I like that is far enough away from it all.

[MarkG]

Wad, on Dec 27 2007, 07:59 PM, said:

Canada - decent schools but housing very very expensive due to commodity boom - will look again in a few years when boom is over and the Canadian Dollar has collpased.

Depends on where you go. Alberta prices are certainly crazy due to the commodity boom, and Vancouver prices have been crazy for years, but the rest of the country still has decent houses for sale that are cheap by UK standards. I'd say houses here in Saskatchewan have gone from underpriced to overpriced in the last year, but they're still cheap by UK standards; and if you can get and hold a decent job in one of the poorer parts of Eastern Canada, you'll be laughing.

Actually, our house here cost about 2.5x our combined income and the mortgage (after a $100,000 deposit) is about 20% of our take-home pay, so by historical standards it's still quite affordable.

Edit: Oh, and neither of us have bubble-based jobs and neither can easily be outsourced, so we shouldn't get laid off if there is a recession.

This post has been edited by MarkG: 27 December 2007 - 07:43 PM

[nmarks]

Mr Parry, on Dec 27 2007, 07:31 PM, said:

I'm sorry to hear of your bad luck nmarks, good luck with the innovation.

For me, Thailand . . . why? Because the wife lives there, won't move to the UK. Plus it's fun. Forget all this corruption stuff you hear. I spent half my life there and only ever experienced what I consider to be the most efficient government system I've ever seen. Even when it's in Police State mode, you'd never know, they don't intrude on people's lives like the UK Govt.

Many will disagree I'm sure. Don't care, I love the place.

Thailand's just an hour or so from Sing. Great place. I was there last year when the coup happened. Its weird being watching machine gun Humvie convoys mixing it with the tuk-tuks. All part of the fun.

Mmmm . . . can almost taste the Pad Thai.

Enjoy. Life's too short.

[Bearback]

Pakistan, cos when politicians get on your nerves you can just get rid of them.

[bugged bunny]

Italy because I feel I belong there and have always felt at home there. Love the language, and can speak it.

Fantastic climate, beautiful cities and countryside. The public transport is superb and a third of the cost (relative to wages) of the UK, they have far superior national health service to ours and better social provision. Every town/city has a strong sense of civic pride and tradition, and no chavs.

Corruption - hmm, it's probably worse in the UK.

Inter-generational inequity? Yes, the Italian boomers have pissed all over their children's generation too. Might just explain the extremely low birth rate in Italy. Not such a problem for me.

This post has been edited by bugged bunny: 27 December 2007 - 07:55 PM