Gold

[MarkG]

What IS normal?

For most of history, slowly declining prices with metal or metal-backed money. Booms and busts were abnormal.

It's worth noting that the average lifespan of a fiat currency has been about 30 years, and pretty much the entire world has now been on fiat currency for 35 years. It's no wonder that the financial devastation is getting worse and worse.

[Backseat Economist]

For most of history, slowly declining prices with metal or metal-backed money. Booms and busts were abnormal.

It's worth noting that the average lifespan of a fiat currency has been about 30 years, and pretty much the entire world has now been on fiat currency for 35 years. It's no wonder that the financial devastation is getting worse and worse.

Which is why I think we'll have no option at some point in the next ten years or so, but to go into the Euro.

Am I the only one who feels that at some point soon we'll be issued with a fait accompli - watching our savings

and investments get devalued away to nothing in terms of gold and stronger currencies or join the Euro and deal with noticeably higher interest rates?

[MarkG]

Why would the Euro be any improvement? It's just another fiat currency, and it's one which is printed by multiple governments, rather than just one.

[Pluto]

Why would the Euro be any improvement? It's just another fiat currency, and it's one which is printed by multiple governments, rather than just one.

The Euro is toast. It is being elevated by the demise of the dollar.

Use strength in the dollar, pound, and euro to liquidate these worthless pieces of paper and buy Gold.

[drminky]

Also, yes, you can print more money. But you can also dig up more gold...

Ahh but digging up more gold takes TIME, WORK, and ENERGY. This, and the fact it is rare gives gold it intrinsic value as a store of wealth. It simply CAN'T be cheaply produced in massive quantities like paper can, no matter how much you try.

[Backseat Economist]

The Euro is toast. It is being elevated by the demise of the dollar.

Use strength in the dollar, pound, and euro to liquidate these worthless pieces of paper and buy Gold.

I agree that swapping one piece of worthless paper for another is crackers, it makes no sense. But look at it this way - how many people understand FIAT? How many understand FOREX trading? How many really understand inflation? How many people care about this as a subject? More people are concerned about what they'll be wearing when their out on the lash this evening.

But it comes back to what I was saying before. People will accept what they are told by governement, TV, the print media and swallow it whole - because anything else is just far too difficult to get their head around. If you offer people a reason to go into another currency at a period in time, probably when they've been suffering from the massive recession that will be created after this boom has bust, what do you think they'll say? If you promise them stability and good savings rates with manageable house prices, I'd buy it if I'd been kicked out of my job, my house repossessed because I couldn't keep up repayments and my savings whittled away to sod all in the last round of madness.

The Euro may well be toast in the long run, but frankly, if the BoE decide that devaluation of Sterling is the way to go, the Euro will be the lesser of two evils. I can't forsee - yet, that Gold will come back, but I do think it will - eventually.

I'm not qualified to make an accurate judgement on this, so please don't tear me to shreds. I'm just calling this as I see it. I'd like to think that I'm not as blind as most people but I lack the raw theory that some of you have on this forum. I'd welcome anyone to correct anything that I put on here that may not be technically correct.

[Goldfinger]

I agree and don't agree with this - I'm 32 and have known nothing but FIAT currency as the way to get what you want. If someone had said to me a few years ago, that for hundreds of years we were able to easily barter with gold and sliver I'd have called them a nutter. I simply didn't know, and didn't perceive that society used to work in that way. Just because it doesn't work like this now, doesn't mean it won't in the future. Guess in the same guise people at the moment can't perceive that house prices can go down, but eventually, they will.

The majority of us have grown up accepting that this is the way things are. Until I learnt that £1 in 1971 is now the equivalent of £8 today, even though the face value is the same and started to understand the purchasing power effect, I was clueless about inflation and money supply. This is why people are making the fatal mistake of assuming that debt and rising house prices are real wealth. Everything has gone horribly wrong because people perceive this debt fuelled housing and credit bubble as normal. They've got no reference for it because they DON'T KNOW ANY BETTER. What IS normal? I can't answer that, but I know that it's not this.

I totally agree with that statement. Most people I know, even my own parents, know nothing but comparatively stable fiat currencies.

They never experienced (consciously) a hyperinflation or serious economic crisis.

I talk to colleagues about currencies and by what they are backed, and they look at me as if I was dumb and ask me why a currency

should be backed by anything. Boy! We only know what a loaf of bread costs, because it cost similar yesterday. And the day before, and

before and bef... And going back far enough, the fact is, we only know what a loaf of bread costs, because it was once measured in gold.

A sheet of paper is simply not worth 20, 50 or 100 pounds. And if there was nothing backing a currency, speculators were always good

in making huge profits from this.

If you think the next George Soros is not around the corner and waiting to break the Bank of England again, you're wrong. If I could,

it would be the first thing to do for me. It will cost the taxpayer billions.

Goods and services can finally only be paid in goods and services. If a currency is not backed by anything real, it must sooner or later

collapse. It is only a question of time when the collective psychosis must come to an end.

[Goldfinger]

Merrill Lynch increases its gold, silver price forecasts

http://www.platts.com/Metals/News/6366477....d&undefined

The positive drivers for gold include: "heightened geopolitical risk, the

Merrill Lynch' foreign exchange team's forecast for a weaker dollar, ongoing

dehedging, lower central bank sales, a rebound in fabrication demand and

continuing growth in investment demand," said Merrill. "The negative drivers

include potentially lower jewelery demand and increased scrap supply in

response to high prices. Despite these issues, we believe there will be a

200-400 mt demand gap in 2007."

[Backseat Economist]

Merrill Lynch increases its gold, silver price forecasts

http://www.platts.com/Metals/News/6366477....d&undefined

The positive drivers for gold include: "heightened geopolitical risk, the

Merrill Lynch' foreign exchange team's forecast for a weaker dollar, ongoing

dehedging, lower central bank sales, a rebound in fabrication demand and

continuing growth in investment demand," said Merrill. "The negative drivers

include potentially lower jewelery demand and increased scrap supply in

response to high prices. Despite these issues, we believe there will be a

200-400 mt demand gap in 2007."

You wouldn't happen to own or have interests with a metals mining company by any chance?

You do realise that this forecast has coincided with your arguments and rationale for a gold backed monetary system on an influential and popular economic website.

Surely the two aren't related?

[Goldfinger]

You wouldn't happen to own or have interests with a metals mining company by any chance?

You do realise that this forecast has coincided with your arguments and rationale for a gold backed monetary system on an influential and popular economic website.

Surely the two aren't related?

My name is Lynch, Meryll Lynch.

[cells]

In the book, "Goldfinger" by Ian Fleming, Bond goes to see an expert from the Bank of England to learn about gold. "The first thing you need to know about gold", he is told, " is that it is the only commodity in the world which you can take to any town or village anywhere and obtain goods and services in return".

not true

take your gold to ANY market in London (bar a gold market ) and try trade your gold or silver for goods or services

hell, if i had the time i would bet against this. just go down to a market and hand over a silver coin to the man selling fruit and veg. you really think you will get very far

hell, true story. less than a week ago i was walking to university with my roommates and some immigrants approached us and wanted to trade some gold rings for fiat £££. we didn’t even consider it, because it could be any metal made to look like gold, we can not tell the purity in a timely fashion, we could not verify it was or was not gold.

1: gold is fiat, repeat after me " gold....is.....fiat". it had no intrinsic large scale use apart from jewellery which is probably one of the first things pawned in bad times for guess what PAPER fiat

2: why does the fiat price of gold matter to you gold bugs? on one hand you preach £££ $$$ is just paper, and on the other you get an orgasm thinking of gold at $4000. VI trolls in my eyes, just as bad as EAs

3: gold is not legal tender, it will never be legal tender in any country that will affect gold price or use

4: any limited asset such as gold can soar in fiat price if enough people invest in it. this is comparable to HPI. people see HPI so buy houses, causing more HPI, causing more people to buy......ect.

5: if you want a true asset that protects wealth, you should invest in something that all humans need for life. for example, water shares, energy shares, ect.

love gold bugs

Inert metals don't argue.

IIRC, US pilots are given gold sovereigns in case they eject over enemy territory and need a viable method of exchange (i.e. money)

bullets and guns would probably increase your chances and there is no language barrier with them.

also dont you think it is ironic you have to trade the "real gold money" for paper before you can use it for goods and services?

Edited March 14, 2007 by cells

[cells]

Use strength in the dollar, pound, and euro to liquidate these worthless pieces of paper and buy Gold.

why gold over any other real asset?

don’t say transportable, small, dense, high value asset because if it ever came to needing a transportable, small, dense, high value asset you would probably much better investing in harder metals like iron so you can forge yourself a sward to kill off the hordes of pikis that will be chasing you

[oracle]

The way I see it is gold is a hedge against inflation

No surprise that gold has done well the last few years. we've seen huge inflation but fraudulent inflation figures massively understating it

Now however, we are about to enter a deflationary cycle and gold prices will fall IMO. Cash will be king in the short term (Though not Sterling).

Don't be so sure of that!!!!

heli ben + co...including the ECB and BoE are VERY dependent on inflating away their debt....so will do whatever it takes to induce inflation into the system without it filtering through to the masses.

By that I mean crank up IR's and endure recession if needs be.

This is what JC Trichet meant by a downward adjustment in asset prices.

stocks,ETF's,and property are bought mostly on debt....the debt has to be flushed out of the system and an element of caution restored to the markets....this will inevitably lead to sharp corrections in some assets.....property being the biggest as the demand also gets curbed in a big way.....stocks have market makers to take up some of the slack.

however they are holding gold as an insurance policy,for when the caution button gets pressed.........gold is the ultimate safe haven in times of uncertainty.

[LargelyIgnorant]

1: gold is fiat, repeat after me " gold....is.....fiat". it had no intrinsic large scale use apart from jewellery which is probably one of the first things pawned in bad times for guess what PAPER fiat

You a student of RB or Imperial? Lookup the definition of fiat.

2: why does the fiat price of gold matter to you gold bugs? on one hand you preach £££ $$$ is just paper, and on the other you get an orgasm thinking of gold at $4000. VI trolls in my eyes, just as bad as EAs

Cells, even if every HPCer invested 100% in PMs tomorrow, the price would not perceptibly move.

3: gold is not legal tender, it will never be legal tender in any country that will affect gold price or use

Both Britannias and Sovereigns are legal tender

4: any limited asset such as gold can soar in fiat price if enough people invest in it. this is comparable to HPI. people see HPI so buy houses, causing more HPI, causing more people to buy......ect.

How about a few billion gold loving Asian people, not just a few HPCers?

===

This 'gold is not money' argument is, imo, ******. The central bankers believe gold is money. The British military believe gold is money. Please explain why, if gold is not money, the central bankers of the world hold thousands of tonnes of it in their foreign currency reserves.

MONEY IS NOT GOLD. Have a look at the change in your pocket.

The high value fake gold ones (£1 & £2 coins) aren't made of gold, but brass and nickel.

The intermediate value fake silver ones (5p, 10p, 20p, 50p) aren't made of silver, but copper and nickel.

The low value copper ones (1p & 2p) are partially made of copper. More steel than copper, but at least they give the 1p & 2p coins a cladding of the real thing.

Here's a verifiable experiment for you, cells. Buy a silver Britannia on ebay - It'll cost you about £12. Show it to your friends, explain it's an ounce of pure silver and ask them how much they think it is worth.

[Goldfinger]

Have to respond to this post of Cell. You definitely haven't read the previous posts.

not true

take your gold to ANY market in London (bar a gold market ) and try trade your gold or silver for goods or services

hell, if i had the time i would bet against this. just go down to a market and hand over a silver coin to the man selling fruit and veg. you really think you will get very far

Take Yen or any share certificate to a market and you hav the same problem.

1: gold is fiat, repeat after me " gold....is.....fiat". it had no intrinsic large scale use apart from jewellery which is probably one of the first things pawned in bad times for guess what PAPER fiat

Complete nonsense. You will always get a lot of paper for little gold. Because paper has a much lower intrinsic value.

(Why do I answer anyway???)

2: why does the fiat price of gold matter to you gold bugs? on one hand you preach £££ $$$ is just paper, and on the other you get an orgasm thinking of gold at $4000. VI trolls in my eyes, just as bad as EAs

Complete nonsense. The only interesting thing is how gold relates to other things like houses etc.

A prediction of any kind always expresses gold in fiat with todays purchasing power (i.e. inflation adjusted).

3: gold is not legal tender, it will never be legal tender in any country that will affect gold price or use

Simply wrong. Sovereigns and Krugerrands are legal tender (and there are more example).

4: any limited asset such as gold can soar in fiat price if enough people invest in it. this is comparable to HPI. people see HPI so buy houses, causing more HPI, causing more people to buy......ect.

Exactly. Now, look at an inflation adjusted gold-plot and you'll see, the picture is as the one on the HPC mainpage,

only, gold is at a bottom right now.

5: if you want a true asset that protects wealth, you should invest in something that all humans need for life. for example, water shares, energy shares, ect.

Yes. But only if the fundamentals are looking good. E.g. everyone needs a home. But if you buy one now, I'll feel very sorry for you.

bullets and guns would probably increase your chances and there is no language barrier with them.

also dont you think it is ironic you have to trade the "real gold money" for paper before you can use it for goods and services?

In whatever you'll change your gold, the important thing is, you CAN change it. Try trading you energy-shares when your helicopter

is down somewhere in Iraq.

Some people just don't get it:

(1) Money is always a commodity, i.e. something real.

(2) If money has the form of paper, then only because it promises a commodity.

(3) If money is not backed by a commodity, it usually ends in desaster pretty soon.

(4) Gold and silver are ideal commodity money for these reasons: http://www.financialsense.com/editorials/c.../2005/1123.html

[cells]

Both Britannias and Sovereigns are legal tender

sure spend your sovereigns or britannias at 1/3 value or less. there are some legal tender 1 ounce coins with face value of 1 pound . to add to this, if it was true legal tender i should be able to turn my gold ring into a britannias and use it as money, is that legal?

How about a few billion gold loving Asian people, not just a few HPCers?

what % of those can barly afford to feed themselves? but then again if they are gold bugs. gold > food. but here we are discussing supply and demand. anything that is limited will rise in value if more people demand it. im not arguing against that at all. but that is the same with any limited supply good

===

This 'gold is not money' argument is, imo, ******. The central bankers believe gold is money. The British military believe gold is money. Please explain why, if gold is not money, the central bankers of the world hold thousands of tonnes of it in their foreign currency reserves.

simple. ready for this. lets use the USA as an example. they print money, at what 10-15% a year, yet they do not have 10-15% inflation. nor do they have a growth of 10-15% in trade. how can this be. simple, other banks reserve their currency, they can print 15% a year as long as a lot of that is taken in as new reserves by foreign central banks and others. now this is in effect a free meal ticket for America, because they trade paper for real goods. this train stays in their favour as long as the USD is stable and more people reserve yet more USD. now, suppose there is a competitor, such as gold. if it appreciates in value year on year, more so than the yeild you offer on your reserved currency. then central banks will dump your currency and buy gold. you loose your free meal ticket. so it is smart to have some gold to supress its price and make it unattractive. AKA UK selling gold 5 odd years ago, but the amount of £££ taken in for reserve purposes has rocketed. understand now?

The high value fake gold ones (£1 & £2 coins) aren't made of gold, but brass and nickel.

The intermediate value fake silver ones (5p, 10p, 20p, 50p) aren't made of silver, but copper and nickel.

The low value copper ones (1p & 2p) are partially made of copper. More steel than copper, but at least they give the 1p & 2p coins a cladding of the real thing.

i dont understand what your trying to get at here

Here's a verifiable experiment for you, cells. Buy a silver Britannia on ebay - It'll cost you about £12. Show it to your friends, explain it's an ounce of pure silver and ask them how much they think it is worth.

doesn’t matter what they think it is worth, what matters is what they will actually trade me for it. for that they would go look up the value of the metal in fiat terms and then give me an answer. try taking that silver britannia into a local market and buy some food with it, you cant honestly say you will get very far

[Pluto]

There is an old saying that reminds me of cells. It is: "If you teach a donkey how to read it will more than likely end up kicking you". Therefore there is no point in trying to debate him.

But let me take this opportunity in informing all the "gold is crap" camp of the following:

++ Gold has been currency for over 5000 years. It is only the last 35 it hasn't, which is why we get this see-sawing of inflation/deflation, boom and busts.

++ It is kept by central banks in its vaults for a reason, because they know it is (and always will be) the currency of last resort.

++ Gold is not fiat. Gold has intrinsic value. It is no governments responsibility.

When gold was currency people knew the value of money are were prepared to work hard to obtain it and save it. The opposite is true of fiat money, and that is why it is doomed for failure. You see, if you perceive that fiat money has little value you will borrow more and more of it because you know in the future it will be worth less and less. This promotes borrowing and speculation. Central banks fight this will a bought of deflation, but eventually give in and inflate again. Thus we get the boom and bust scenario.

All it will take is a strong economy (with a lot of nukes) to buy up a lot of gold and declare their currency is back on the gold standard. This will be check mate for all fiats that do business with it.

Basically this is what the Brettens Wood agreement was, and led to US having a truly booming economy until the mid 60s.

We shall return to a similar time and gold bugs will be richer than their wildest dreams.

[Goldfinger]

Cells:

now, suppose there is a competitor, such as gold. if it appreciates in value year on year, more so than the yeild you offer on your reserved currency. then central banks will dump your currency and buy gold. you loose your free meal ticket. so it is smart to have some gold to supress its price and make it unattractive. AKA UK selling gold 5 odd years ago, but the amount of £££ taken in for reserve purposes has rocketed. understand now?

No, I don't. Are you making the case for gold suddenly?

Or, alternatively, are you telling me it was clever by the BoE to sell their gold, because the pounds they made are worth much more now?

Clearly, if you're sitting on a printing machine that produces pound-notes 24/7, the absolutely most stupid thing you could do is

to trade something of value (gold) with something you can produce yourself at no cost (pound-notes). Can be applied to EUR or USD

as well.

[LargelyIgnorant]

sure spend your sovereigns or britannias at 1/3 value or less. there are some legal tender 1 ounce coins with face value of 1 pound . to add to this, if it was true legal tender i should be able to turn my gold ring into a britannias and use it as money, is that legal?

Moving arguments are tiresome. I'm glad you have changed your position on this.

what % of those can barly afford to feed themselves? but then again if they are gold bugs. gold > food. but here we are discussing supply and demand. anything that is limited will rise in value if more people demand it. im not arguing against that at all. but that is the same with any limited supply good

And there I was thinking Indian and Chinese people had some of our money

simple. ready for this. lets use the USA as an example. they print money, at what 10-15% a year, yet they do not have 10-15% inflation. nor do they have a growth of 10-15% in trade. how can this be. simple, other banks reserve their currency, they can print 15% a year as long as a lot of that is taken in as new reserves by foreign central banks and others. now this is in effect a free meal ticket for America, because they trade paper for real goods. this train stays in their favour as long as the USD is stable and more people reserve yet more USD. now, suppose there is a competitor, such as gold. if it appreciates in value year on year, more so than the yeild you offer on your reserved currency. then central banks will dump your currency and buy gold. you loose your free meal ticket. so it is smart to have some gold to supress its price and make it unattractive. AKA UK selling gold 5 odd years ago, but the amount of £££ taken in for reserve purposes has rocketed. understand now?

Yes, it is clear that your understanding of the value of gold rivals that of Gordon Browns.

i dont understand what your trying to get at here

Doesn't surprise me.

doesn’t matter what they think it is worth, what matters is what they will actually trade me for it. for that they would go look up the value of the metal in fiat terms and then give me an answer. try taking that silver britannia into a local market and buy some food with it, you cant honestly say you will get very far

Don't they teach you students to do the experiment before deciding the results nowadays?

[oracle]

All it will take is a strong economy (with a lot of nukes) to buy up a lot of gold and declare their currency is back on the gold standard. This will be check mate for all fiats that do business with it.

so that would be russia and china then.

[cells]

Have to respond to this post of Cell. You definitely haven't read the previous posts.

i went through the whole thread

Take Yen or any share certificate to a market and you have the same problem.

shares earn you a dividend (yield) and because of that have an intrinsic value.

paper money earns you interest in a bank. paper and shares are cheap to trade and transfer, and cost nothing to store safely

gold, earns you no deviants. and no real intrinsic value. its value is totally dependant on supply and demand and is thus very volatile. It costs you money to store gold safely, and a hefty commission in comparison to fiat to trade

Complete nonsense. You will always get a lot of paper for little gold. Because paper has a much lower intrinsic value.

(Why do I answer anyway???)

why are you thinking of legal tender as paper. why dont you try paying for your shopping with a blank sheet of A4 paper? legal tender such as a £50 note has value because i know i can trade that paper for goods, very simply

Complete nonsense. The only interesting thing is how gold relates to other things like houses etc.

A prediction of any kind always expresses gold in fiat with todays purchasing power (i.e. inflation adjusted).

finally your starting to make some sense. what is important if you are considering investing in gold is what it will buy you in terms of other real assets. now that begs the question, will gold rise in price because of supply and demand. it may or may not do. but i can tell you for sure the UK and USA government have a very large vested interest in keeping gold volatile and low yielding in long terms, you can probably add the EU to that list as euro gains more and more reserve currency status

Simply wrong. Sovereigns and Krugerrands are legal tender (and there are more example).

when was the last time you traded a gold or silver coin for goods or services? it is not legal tender if the man on the street doesn’t take it, it is not legal tender if it isn’t easy to use, it is not legal tender if its face value is only 30% or less its intrinsic value

Exactly. Now, look at an inflation adjusted gold-plot and you'll see, the picture is as the one on the HPC mainpage,

only, gold is at a bottom right now.

more info pls. and you cant compare gold to housing, one is a necessity the other is nothing of the sort

In whatever you'll change your gold, the important thing is, you CAN change it. Try trading you energy-shares when your helicopter

is down somewhere in Iraq.

at what value will you be able to trade your gold in iraq, id bet less than 10% its value. as they don’t know its purity, if it is even gold, if it is just gold plated....... and if you say you find someone who knows about gold and can verify its genuine. same applies to fiat USD. one other thing, id rather have a long range radio, water, food, and a gun than a thousand gold coins if i was shot down in iraq. In fact id probably be willing to trade an ounce of gold for an ounce of bullets (you see value is what others make of it at the time and place)

Some people just don't get it:

(1) Money is always a commodity, i.e. something real.

(2) If money has the form of paper, then only because it promises a commodity.

(3) If money is not backed by a commodity, it usually ends in desaster pretty soon.

(4) Gold and silver are ideal commodity money for these reasons: http://www.financialsense.com/editorials/c.../2005/1123.html

after all that, i will admit gold can be a good earner, but if and only if enough people invest to drive up the value. think of propert porn headlines replaced with gold porn headlines.

[cells]

"If you teach a donkey how to read it will more than likely end up kicking you".

[cells]

Cells:

now, suppose there is a competitor, such as gold. if it appreciates in value year on year, more so than the yeild you offer on your reserved currency. then central banks will dump your currency and buy gold. you loose your free meal ticket. so it is smart to have some gold to supress its price and make it unattractive. AKA UK selling gold 5 odd years ago, but the amount of £££ taken in for reserve purposes has rocketed. understand now?

No, I don't. Are you making the case for gold suddenly?

Or, alternatively, are you telling me it was clever by the BoE to sell their gold, because the pounds they made are worth much more now?

Clearly, if you're sitting on a printing machine that produces pound-notes 24/7, the absolutely most stupid thing you could do is

to trade something of value (gold) with something you can produce yourself at no cost (pound-notes). Can be applied to EUR or USD

as well.

i don’t think you understand

lets take the Uk gold selling as an example

if you look at world reserve currencies atm you will see sterling £££ had gone up to about 2.5% (last time i checked) from i dont know, lets say 1%

now thats a 1.5% difference. so if the world reserve total is lets say £10 trillion, 1.5% of that is 150bil?

so that is about a tonne of paper with the number 150,000,000,000 traded for a LOT of real goods like 5billion barrels of oil. not bad eh. something for nothing

now it can be argued that if Brittan didn’t sell off its gold back then, we might have 2k USD an ounce gold now. which might of prompted reserve banks to dump pounds and buy gold. which would of mean we lost 150bil of real goods traded for paper, and got more inflation.

see why it makes sense for any country that had foreign banks reserving its currency to keep gold volatile and low?

******** the numbers are probably not accurate but prove a point************

Simply stated, what's more likely, a worthless dollar or worthless gold?

Next!

if there is a limited number of dollars, which there are

and the USD stays as legal tender in the US, which it will

the USD will have an intrinsic value because the US produces shite the rest of the world wants and needs

Edited March 14, 2007 by cells

[Guest Charlie The Tramp]

In the mid 80s I was doing some work for a Broker located in the old WTC by Tower Bridge.

On the floor were many brokers ( salesman ) telephoning clients advising them to buy gold and as each one made a successful sale put his fist in the air telling the guy next to him that Mr X has just bought let`s say £100k. This went on all day with very happy faces on the floor and continued the following day, sure enough gold did go up.

Having to return 3 weeks later to complete the work the same thing was happening again, but this time they were on the phones telling their clients to sell as gold would fall, still with those happy faces, and sure enough gold did fall in price.

I wished I knew where that Broker moved to when they demolished the building, I might have been a rich man today.

[TTID]

God willing.

You missed out the 'L'.