OnionTerror Posted February 14, 2014 Share Posted February 14, 2014 I think you need to walk a few miles in someone else's shoes. Not that I'd use force to make you do it. Going from a well paid ish job to retail has certainly removed any pretentious I had...It has certainly opened my eyes, and I'm glad of the experience.. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Traktion Posted February 14, 2014 Share Posted February 14, 2014 re IT ... (apologies, not sure how to edit my post) we do, in fact, often have IT problems at the weekend in my workplace. Despite this, the IT dept does not routinely work weekends - not even Saturdays, though that IS our busiest day of the week and the day that most money is made. Surely weekend working must be on the horizon - if not already here - for many people who work in IT. The more people who work on Sundays, the greater the demand for all their support staff to work on Sundays, surely. Many IT support staff do work at the weekend (or at least are on call). That is between them and their employer. There is no law dictating that they must or cannot work on Sundays. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
gf3 Posted February 14, 2014 Share Posted February 14, 2014 Going from a well paid ish job to retail has certainly removed any pretentious I had...It has certainly opened my eyes, and I'm glad of the experience.. I don't really wish bad things happening to anybody. But I think some people would be nicer and more understanding if they had one hiccup in their lives so they could see things from the other side. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Traktion Posted February 14, 2014 Share Posted February 14, 2014 I don't really wish bad things happening to anybody. But I think some people would be nicer and more understanding if they had one hiccup in their lives so they could see things from the other side. It would also be nicer if people stopped seeing violence as a solution to problems, right? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
gf3 Posted February 14, 2014 Share Posted February 14, 2014 It would also be nicer if people stopped seeing violence as a solution to problems, right? Oh Tracktion what is it with you and this threats of violence. I remember when I first joined HPC reading your posts and finding them interesting and thought provoking. I've been racking my brains to try and think of a post you did about three years ago where you made me stop and rethink things. I remember it happening but I can't remember the subject. The last year or so every post seems to be a threat of violence post. Perhaps it would be good if you started a new thread and explain your philosophy. My guess is you are all for anarchy? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Wurzel Of Highbridge Posted February 14, 2014 Author Share Posted February 14, 2014 It would also be nicer if people stopped seeing violence as a solution to problems, right? I kind of guess that was the point of the original post. I forgot that the UK had Sunday restrictions, as they don't have them in Ireland. Using Ireland as a case study you will find that the shops are busy until about 12:00 (after church) until about 5pm. Most large shops open until 9pm as the staff need to stack shelves anyway - you will usually find 1 till open in Tesco. It makes the whole shopping experience a little more relaxed as it removed the pressure selling of buy now before we shut at 4pm. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
gf3 Posted February 14, 2014 Share Posted February 14, 2014 Going from a well paid ish job to retail has certainly removed any pretentious I had...It has certainly opened my eyes, and I'm glad of the experience.. Sorry to quote your post again. I was just wondering. If you still had your 9 to 5 IT job would you have voted the other way? Just wondering whether it was your experience of finding yourself on the other side of the fence that has moulded your view. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Traktion Posted February 14, 2014 Share Posted February 14, 2014 (edited) Oh Tracktion what is it with you and this threats of violence. I remember when I first joined HPC reading your posts and finding them interesting and thought provoking. I've been racking my brains to try and think of a post you did about three years ago where you made me stop and rethink things. I remember it happening but I can't remember the subject. The last year or so every post seems to be a threat of violence post. Perhaps it would be good if you started a new thread and explain your philosophy. My guess is you are all for anarchy? It's just calling a spade a spade. The Internet dialogue is slowly chipping away the statist groupthink, but we're not there yet. Whenever someone proposes new legislation, they are suggesting that violence should be used to make someone do one thing or another. This is what legislation is - a list of rules, to make people do one thing or another, under the threat of being locked in a cage if they don't comply. Personally, I think the idea of threatening people for arbitrary reasons is wrong. It just isn't civilised. It's a crude and lazy way for one group of people to bully another group of people into doing what they want. If people want others to do something, they should give them an incentive to do it. If they still don't want to do it, then they should be given the good grace of allowing them to do something else. That is civilised. I'm happy to enter into debates about how we can have a society based around voluntarism - or anarchism if you prefer - but we need to stop reaching for the club/gun/cage first... then we can talk. Until then, there is little interest for me in debating how X or Y should be beaten into people. Edited February 14, 2014 by Traktion Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
OnionTerror Posted February 14, 2014 Share Posted February 14, 2014 (edited) Sorry to quote your post again. I was just wondering. If you still had your 9 to 5 IT job would you have voted the other way? Just wondering whether it was your experience of finding yourself on the other side of the fence that has moulded your view. Hmmm....It wouldn't have bothered me one way or another...I do most of my shopping online anyway, so I hadn't really put any thought into it...Its only when you are in a situation whereby some customer comes in on a Saturday or a Sunday ready for an argument, you think "you came in for this"...It seems people are more susceptible for arguments over a weekend... During the week, you usually get a load of older folk in who are much more "relaxed"... IT at times, can be frustrating...sitting at a desk all day...And the job I do is physically and mentally demanding...one day is never the same to the next...trouble is that the staff are treated like **** by customers and by the company, although I do work with some good people... Edited February 14, 2014 by Dave Beans Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Parkwell Posted February 14, 2014 Share Posted February 14, 2014 Well, this thread has taken off. I'm still not sure why people are bothered about losing what little is left of Sunday trading restrictions. It only effects one group of Sunday workers and only a couple of people on here have shown interest in going back to the days of very strict Sunday working practices, which would throw up a lot of other issues. If shop workers are that important, why not bar staff, or train/bus drivers, or factory workers, or hotel workers et al. What about the tourist industry? It would take a seismic shift to reach this fabled idea of everyone spending time with the family on Sunday. Except of course those many people who'd rather not be with them. Millions more people with nowhere to go on Sunday because everything is shut, all looking at their ipads and watching TV. Sounds grand. The last year or so every post seems to be a threat of violence post. Perhaps it would be good if you started a new thread and explain your philosophy. My guess is you are all for anarchy? Whilst it can be hard to see how Traktion's philosophy can be integrated into life as we know it, I find it refreshing that people can hold strong fundamental principles and look for ways (no matter how difficult or unpopular) to adhere to them. I'm not sure how well that world would work out but I do think it's the direction we should be headed. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
winkie Posted February 14, 2014 Share Posted February 14, 2014 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
gf3 Posted February 14, 2014 Share Posted February 14, 2014 Well, this thread has taken off. I'm still not sure why people are bothered about losing what little is left of Sunday trading restrictions. It only effects one group of Sunday workers and only a couple of people on here have shown interest in going back to the days of very strict Sunday working practices, which would throw up a lot of other issues. If shop workers are that important, why not bar staff, or train/bus drivers, or factory workers, or hotel workers et al. What about the tourist industry? It would take a seismic shift to reach this fabled idea of everyone spending time with the family on Sunday. Except of course those many people who'd rather not be with them. Millions more people with nowhere to go on Sunday because everything is shut, all looking at their ipads and watching TV. Sounds grand. Whilst it can be hard to see how Traktion's philosophy can be integrated into life as we know it, I find it refreshing that people can hold strong fundamental principles and look for ways (no matter how difficult or unpopular) to adhere to them. I'm not sure how well that world would work out but I do think it's the direction we should be headed. I was talking to my ex wife about the thread. She is a manager of a service that require 24 hour cover. I asked her about weekend cover and she gets her staff to work one weekend in four running on a skeleton crew. So a lot of the focus is trying to get that work life balance. But you are right a lot of jobs are just 7 day a week and that's it. But on balance I would stick up for the powerless shop worker that can sit down with their kids on a Sunday evening over the guy that can't be bothered to get to the shop when it's open. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Wurzel Of Highbridge Posted February 14, 2014 Author Share Posted February 14, 2014 For me - this is the winning argument. Indeed in much of Germany you aren't even allowed to use lawnmowers and the like on the Sunday to avoid disturbing other people's pleasure of peace. Hardly capitalist and free market imposing opening times on a very small section of society. It's as bad as the enforced closing times at pubs. Any idiot would realize that people get tired at a certain time and tend to drift home. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bristolhunter Posted February 18, 2014 Share Posted February 18, 2014 Good man What gets me is the number of people that vote yes and aren't prepare to post their reason. Maybe their only reason is because they are selfish **** who have no empathy with anybody else as long as they are ok. A large number of good reasons were posted. I've yet to see a reason against ("Keep sunday a day of religious oppression" doesn't count),. I've worked sundays before in retail. I'm available in my job on sundays now if needed, as are all my superiors. Nobody has ever, at any point, suggested a reasonable reason (again, your earlier reply to me of 'I don't want to work' doesn't count as reasonable) why I shouldn't be allowed to purchase something from somebody who wants to sell me something at whatever time we damn well please. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CentrinoDuo Posted February 19, 2014 Share Posted February 19, 2014 People keep quoting Germany. There are many other countries in Europe has no Sunday trading laws. Denmark, Ireland, Italy, Finland similar to UK. Yet we don't see this breakdown of family ties or workers oppressions mentioned on this thread. You are right. There's no good reasons for Sunday trading laws. It's antiquated, let the big shops sort themselves. The little shops already open or close on Sunday based on demands. Major supermarket already have answered for Sunday trading law with their express and local versions. There's no need to have Sunday trading laws. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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