French Property

[redwine]

Paris seems to have ground to a halt. CIF are not allowed to lend at the moment despite the proposed bail-out so that is a chunk of mortgage lending gone.

Absolutely correct yet for some reason best known to themselves the adrianleeds.com website continues its unabashed ramping of the market.

Dear me Picnic

Where on earth did you find Adrian leeds .com ?

I had a look on his Paris press section .

Not forgetting the Paris Weekender blog by Abbey Gordon who seems to spend alot of time in Brittany.

She is also a happy appartment owner and is the subject of an upcoming House Hunters International.

The news on the site dates back to 2008.

Apart from adverts for mags such as VivaDeco and PrimaMaison.

However i did like the article about the flat with the 'cosy view of the Eiffel Tower' although they forgot to mention that the Eiffel Tower is actually the number one suicide tower in France.

Not forgetting the article about owning an 'Eleventh of an Apartement' in Paris wrote by the NYTimes a French Hating Newspaper IMHO.

Adrians last interview in 2010 in the USA Portland Oregon.

With regards to the CIF and other regions i will post a few updates that date to only a few weeks or days ago .

[torridon18]

I am looking at a house near Limoges which is owned by the local mairie. Does anybody have any experience with properties like this or can give me any tips on what to look out for? It's a cheap fixer upper but I'm not sure if the mairie will be keen to sell to a foreigner.

[swissy_fit]

I am looking at a house near Limoges which is owned by the local mairie. Does anybody have any experience with properties like this or can give me any tips on what to look out for? It's a cheap fixer upper but I'm not sure if the mairie will be keen to sell to a foreigner.

If it's a cheap deal he'll sell it to a friend.

If it's a swindle he/she'll be only too keen to sell it to a foreigner.

That's the way it goes in France.

[torridon18]

So if it looks like a good buy it probably isn't?

That makes life difficult as how do you know a good deal when you see it? I'm looking in the area but am not in a rush. I wondered if they just wanted to offload it as the property market is dead or if there are any problems I don't know about. I have to admit that the mairie owning the property makes me a bit less interested as I also assumed they would sell it to a mate at a knockdown price.

[swissy_fit]

So if it looks like a good buy it probably isn't?

That makes life difficult as how do you know a good deal when you see it? I'm looking in the area but am not in a rush. I wondered if they just wanted to offload it as the property market is dead or if there are any problems I don't know about. I have to admit that the mairie owning the property makes me a bit less interested as I also assumed they would sell it to a mate at a knockdown price.

Difficult to say without a link and without knowing what you want it for. The property market works differently in France, people aren't interested in doer-uppers unless they're in a prime position, a doer-upper in the middle of nowhere is worth close to nothing.

My advice would be this :-

If you're planning to move there, rent first, sniff around.

If you're buying a holiday home(though I can't see why anyone would, there's enough choice of rentals), rent first.

You will never find out enough without being there, having a good mastery of the language and courting the locals a bit.

Redwine posted some good advice, check out the local election results and avoid places where Le Pen has much of the vote.

It's a strange part of France to choose IMO, unless you're particularly fond of cows and sheep, not much climate advantage over the UK there.

[fjcruiser]

So if it looks like a good buy it probably isn't?

That makes life difficult as how do you know a good deal when you see it? I'm looking in the area but am not in a rush. I wondered if they just wanted to offload it as the property market is dead or if there are any problems I don't know about. I have to admit that the mairie owning the property makes me a bit less interested as I also assumed they would sell it to a mate at a knockdown price.

The Limousin is a poor part of France, has always been and will always be. There are no jobs, climate wise it is generally wet and cold bar a few months during summer. There is an entire village up for sale and which has not sold for decades. If you need to renovate a property you bought, you will not only face local red tape regarding planning, you will also find it difficult to find reliable builders and you will have to pay as they may need to travel from far away. Limousin is cheap because no French people want to live there, most having left already generations ago for a better life elsewhere.

[redwine]

http://www.ouest-france.fr/ofdernmin_-Rennes.-150-salaries-du-Credit-immobilier-manifestent_6346-2114025-fils-tous_filDMA.Htm

West France 18:9:12

Rennes 150 salaires du Crédit immobilier manifestent

Rennes 150 staff of the credit immobilier protest.

Quote

A 150 staff of Crédit immobilier Brittany but also the pays-de-la-Loire and Normandy have protested this tuesday morning in the streets of Rennes against the threat of losing there jobs.

The credit bank of social housing which counts 2500 staff are in peril.

The state have already injected 24 hundred million euros which is destinated to cover existing loans.

Although they have already told us to stop lending.

It is clear that we will soon end our activity says Alain Giboire a staff spokesman.

In Brittany the CIF make a 1000 loans each year and employ a 125 staff.

IMHO No real decision has been made by the g'vt with regards to the future of the CIF but its not looking good.

Also in Rennes well PSA are going to get rid of 1400 staff on there Rennes site.

Not forgetting that last week 'Doux' made a 1000 staff redundant out of 1700 who work there.

Next it will be the EAs in the streets protesting

[torridon18]

My link

Looking at this.

Trust me, the weather is better than up here in Scotland. It's for a holiday home but for work reasons it's handy for me to be near Limoges.

[torridon18]

Forgot to ask, is any Le Pen area an automautic no go and is it because they are idiots or do they really hate foreigners?

[davidg]

I am looking at a house near Limoges which is owned by the local mairie. Does anybody have any experience with properties like this or can give me any tips on what to look out for? It's a cheap fixer upper but I'm not sure if the mairie will be keen to sell to a foreigner.

If the house is offered for sale on the open market and you offer the asking price the buyer cannot legally refuse to sell it to you.

As for red tape in the Limousin, there is often very little problem getting planning permission as mayors are desperate to get people to move into their villages to boost revenues. There is generally little problem getting builders, you can even find British or Irish ones. However it rarely makes economic sense to fix up properties in the region unless you are talking about minimal works. The costs will far exceed any value added to the property.

As others have said, there is an issue in the area with continued desertification. You may find it hard to find a doctor or dentist.

The French climate south of the Loire is pretty mild. Summers can be extremely hot and humid and there are a lot of flies in anywhere with populations of sheep and cattle.

As Swissy says, rent first, buy later (if ever).

[swissy_fit]

My link

Looking at this.

Trust me, the weather is better than up here in Scotland. It's for a holiday home but for work reasons it's handy for me to be near Limoges.

OK but if you're going to France anyway, why not choose somewhere drier and more pleasant? That chap who writes in the Telegraph has much to answer for. :-)

Like I said, a doer-upper in that area is worth very little, that's why it's "cheap".

It might be worth doing if your motivation to be near Limoges is very strong, plus you're a very good handyman yourself and have the time/energy to do most of the work. Otherwise buy a plot, you should be able to get one round there for peanuts if you rent for a while and get to know people, and have something like one of these put on it, it'll be a lot more pleasant and at least you might one day be able to sell it.

http://www.est-bois.fr/maisons_ossature.php

[davidg]

have something like one of these put on it, it'll be a lot more pleasant and at least you might one day be able to sell it.

http://www.est-bois.fr/maisons_ossature.php

Bear in mind there are zoning laws so you won't be able to put up any old style. For example a "Swiss Chalet" type house would almost certainly not be allowed.

if you are going to get a wooden kit consider getting one from Poland or the Balts as it will be a lot cheaper. Again get planning permission sorted before placing an order.

Edited September 19, 2012 by davidg

[torridon18]

I hear what you are saying. There are plots available at about 10-15000 euro but I like to be near the centre of a village. What would a 2 bed wood building cost to buy and construct (approx)? I am pretty handy and actually enjoy doing a lot of the work. I'm not overly concerned about it as an investment as I don't plan to sell for a long time. I'm looking to buy and renovate for about 40-45000 euro. I work in France a lot of the time and can get to this town easily. I like this area but am willing to look other places if there is better available. I also like the area around Niort. I might have another look at the climate graphs to check the weather again, rain is more of an issue than it being super hot as I'm Scottish and start to melt above 25 oC !

[swissy_fit]

I hear what you are saying. There are plots available at about 10-15000 euro but I like to be near the centre of a village. What would a 2 bed wood building cost to buy and construct (approx)? I am pretty handy and actually enjoy doing a lot of the work. I'm not overly concerned about it as an investment as I don't plan to sell for a long time. I'm looking to buy and renovate for about 40-45000 euro. I work in France a lot of the time and can get to this town easily. I like this area but am willing to look other places if there is better available. I also like the area around Niort. I might have another look at the climate graphs to check the weather again, rain is more of an issue than it being super hot as I'm Scottish and start to melt above 25 oC !

Rent in the area you want and court the locals assiduously, never forgetting to tell them how marvellous France is and much better than the UK at least once a day - sooner or later someone will sell you a plot in the village if they know you're looking. The locals will mostly be poor but will have land, sooner or later one will need the money. Watch your back with those that think of foreigners as another species, they're quite numerous and not always who you might expect, duplicity is more common in the French culture than the British IMO.

The best climates in France push prices up a bit, but not too bad in Charente-Maritime away from the coast. How does 2500+ hours of sun a year sound? - not a million miles from the Limousin either.

For building costs, sorry don't know, but davidg's post looks worthy of attention, maybe you can get some Romanians to put a small wooden house up for 25k, but get permission first.

Renovation costs are as high as the UK with similar problems unless you do it yourself, so 45k Euros is only OK if you're doing the work IMO.

[redwine]

My link

http://www.lamontagne.fr/limousin/actualite/2012/04/10/le-maire-qui-a-parraine-marine-le-pen-pris-a-partie-avant-un-mariage-1140200.html

Having fun troll ?

I looked at your link in Chateauponsac a total wreck that was built in 1800 for sale at 23000 euros .

Its not up for sale by the local mairie but by an estate agency called VIAP Immobilier in Limoges .

The wreck in question is actually the first house( if you can call it a house ) that appears on the SeLoger site.

BTW it was put on the site yesterday just like your post a nice little wind-up.

Funny though the estate agency in question also speak english is this your french job?

Your posts about Le Pen and foreigners i fell on the floor laughing.

The mayor of Chateauponsac is a FN supporter he's called Gérard Rumeau.

Look at the link and you don't have to understand english to understand that he is a supporter of Marine Le Pen.

Actually he was insulted by a local during a wedding last April for his support of the FN.

You can even see what he looks like but you already knew that didn't you .

Its troll season here on hpc.

[redwine]

If the house is offered for sale on the open market and you offer the asking price the buyer cannot legally refuse to sell it to you.

Really ?

Can you post a french legal law link that states says this .

Although reading your post i would of replaced buyer by vendor.

As i understand there exists a 'cooling off' period for the buyer and the vendor under french law.

[torridon18]

http://www.lamontagne.fr/limousin/actualite/2012/04/10/le-maire-qui-a-parraine-marine-le-pen-pris-a-partie-avant-un-mariage-1140200.html

Having fun troll ?

I looked at your link in Chateauponsac a total wreck that was built in 1800 for sale at 23000 euros .

Its not up for sale by the local mairie but by an estate agency called VIAP Immobilier in Limoges .

The wreck in question is actually the first house( if you can call it a house ) that appears on the SeLoger site.

BTW it was put on the site yesterday just like your post a nice little wind-up.

Funny though the estate agency in question also speak english is this your french job?

Your posts about Le Pen and foreigners i fell on the floor laughing.

The mayor of Chateauponsac is a FN supporter he's called Gérard Rumeau.

Look at the link and you don't have to understand english to understand that he is a supporter of Marine Le Pen.

Actually he was insulted by a local during a wedding last April for his support of the FN.

You can even see what he looks like but you already knew that didn't you .

Its troll season here on hpc.

???

Totally wrong fella.

I've visited the house and it's been on seloger for a couple of months. It's for sale through an agency but is owned by the mairie. I'm not interested in French politics so was not really concerned about the politics of the mairie. You must be easily amused if this got you rolling on the floor.

I was looking for some advice from anybody living in France already and I think that your paranoia has got the better of you. I'll look for a more helpful forum.

[redwine]

???

Totally wrong fella.

I've visited the house and it's been on seloger for a couple of months. It's for sale through an agency but is owned by the mairie. I'm not interested in French politics so was not really concerned about the politics of the mairie. You must be easily amused if this got you rolling on the floor.

I was looking for some advice from anybody living in France already and I think that your paranoia has got the better of you. I'll look for a more helpful forum.

Hi Troll.

The house on question if you can call this wreck a house has not been on seloger for the last couple of months.

Due to the simple fact that its not on a french property trackers website.

Why not post me a link from Seloger website that states this.

So you have visited this dump that hasn't even got an energy rating

All you post about is politics and the FN;

The advert on seloger has been placed by an agency that is40kms away from Chateauponsac.

Why don't you post a link from the local council website afterall if its the council that are selling this wreck then why isn't this so called bargain house on there website

You are not looking for advice and you are starting with the insults.

Dear me so now i am suffering from'paranoia' well thats a new one i will have to add it on to all of my other hpc compliments.

You will now go back to your EA forum full of posters that don't live in france but only pretend to.

I live in France .

[torridon18]

2#

Vente - Maison en pierre - Chateauponsac - 90 m² - 23 000 €

sauvegardée le dimanche 29 juillet 2012 à 22h03

message envoyé à l'agence le 06/08/2012 14:54:13

détail de l'annonce

enlever de mes annonces sauvegardées

infos agence

From my saved properties list, good enough?

I think that you wil find that it wasn't me who started mentioning politics. Don't worry I'm not holding out for an apology and have remembered why I seldom post on the internet. I'm not sure what the problem is here.

[redwine]

I am looking at a house near Limoges which is owned by the local mairie. It's a cheap fixer upper but I'm not sure if the mairie will be keen to sell to a foreigner.

http://www.petitscailloux.com/

[torridon18]

If that site works then it was listed in May?

There is no copy link location option when i right click on imprimer. I used view page info and put the info in your linked website.

Is the site usually accurate?

[swissy_fit]

Don't worry about redwine, he gets overexcited sometimes and thinks people are trolls (they may be, but who cares?) but he does post some useful stuff.

Best of luck with whatever you decide to do.

[davidg]

Really ?

Can you post a french legal law link that states says this .

Although reading your post i would of replaced buyer by vendor.

As i understand there exists a 'cooling off' period for the buyer and the vendor under french law.

yes Vendor, my bad.

Le vendeur est lié à la première offre "au prix". - covered by article 1583 of the Civil Code.

That is to say that he has to accept the first offer made at the price initially fixed. You'll see this clause on sites such as PAP.fr and there is a recent case of a couple refusing to sell to Arabs because they would "lower the tone of the neighbourhood"; they were fined.

You are correct about the cooling off period for the buyer after making an offer. Having received an acceptance of your offer by recorded delivery letter you have 7 days to back out. You would normally pay a 10% deposit later and would loose this if you subsequently pull out although normally you would put a clause in the contract saying subject to getting a mortgage.

Edited September 20, 2012 by davidg

[redwine]

If that site works then it was listed in May?

There is no copy link location option when i right click on imprimer. I used view page info and put the info in your linked website.

Is the site usually accurate?

http://www.leboncoin.fr/ventes_immobilieres/335486824.htm?ca=14_s

1 no.

2 true

3 yes

The property that you are interested in is also on the boncoin since the 9/8/12.

A pro but to be fair the same price as seloger.

You can also follow property on the boncoin as well although not in the form of graphs a rather complicated e mail alerts system although there is a new light application that exists.

Having said that they have there limits

The number of days and years even with price changes but thats as far as it goes.

If you want to buy this property make a -40% offer .

Original price 23000 so you offer 13800.

They might refuse if you are still interested try a -35% or 14950.

Then walk away and wait and see.

[felix]

I am in Cannes at the moment. Absolutely no sign of a recession. The place is packed.

The restaurants are full, and the wealthy are flaunting it. This is one place that reinforces the wealth divide.

No sign of price reductions in the immobiliers. Still at least 190,000 euros for a 30 sq m studio in the centre. Prices are ludicrous.

I got to say that this was indeed very true 3 years ago, however when I was there last May it was surely not as busy as it should be.

Anyone else experience this?