Sledgehead

Heroes & Villains of Ethnicity: Telling the difference

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The plight of the rohingya muslims in the former Burma, under the now de facto leadership of Nobel Peace laureate, Aung San Suu Kyi, is distressing, deplorable and depressing.

I am far from alone in feeling personally duped by what now appears to be Suu Kyi's faux facade of human rights activism.

It got me thinking about all our other celebrated human rights heroes. And it occurred to me that some of the most revered did most of their standing-up for their 'own kind' so to speak. And when you think of it that way, politically, it becomes depressingly difficult to tell the difference between them and some of the worst examples of so called humanity.

Meanwhile, imho, the folks most likely to be found standing up for peoples not of their own 'group', are the so called 'bleeding heart liberals'. And yet this appears to be the group most often branded intrinsically racist.

It's all very depressing.

Edited by Sledgehead

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reddog   

Two points:

 

1). It's a bit hard to know what is going on in Burma unless you are actually there, many media outlets have an agenda, so who knows what is going on

 

2) the Nobel prize committee are clueless, they just dish the prize out to however is flavour of the month.

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8 hours ago, reddog said:

Two points:

 

1). It's a bit hard to know what is going on in Burma unless you are actually there, many media outlets have an agenda, so who knows what is going on

 

 

I suppose those 164,000 could all have simultaneously got cheap hotel rooms in Bangladesh. Maybe we should blame Trivago?

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Thankfully Amnesty value other's lives more than their own 'cred' and have called out the Myanmar authorities on their flagrant breaches of human rights, despite having previously given an award to the now de facto leader of the country, the Nobel Peace laureate, Aung Sann Suu Kyi:

Myanmar Army landmines along border with Bangladesh pose deadly threat to fleeing Rohingya

Shame the same can't be said for social justice general Bono, who presented Suu Kyi with the Amnesty award:

Quote
U2‘s Bono is to present Burmese freedom fighter and poltician Aung San Suu Kyi with Amnesty International’s Ambassador of Conscience honour in Dublin next month.

Suu Kyi was awarded the honour in 2009, but was unable to collect it as she was under longstanding house arrest.

... the U2 frontman said:

"It’s so rare to see grace trump military might, and when it happens we should make the most joyful noise we can. Aung San Suu Kyi’s grace and courage have tilted a wobbly world further in the direction of democracy. We all feel we know her, but it will be such a thrill to meet her in person."

 

Right Bono.

So here's some Rohingya refugees, not quite on message, begging for food. Or maybe they are just U2 gig-goers? "Man," after all, "it is written, cannot live on bread alone, but on every word that comes from the mouth of God."

 

2B3390B1-5582-46A6-A600-26F7C1F6FE55_w10

Quick, airbrush in a piccie of yerself.

 

Edited by Sledgehead

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So what is new in Burma

This has been going on in various degrees since Burma became independent in 1948

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Internal_conflict_in_Myanmar

It is a very complex country in terms of religion and ethnicity. Moreover, when not fighting the central government a lot of the separatists groups seem to spend times killing each other,.  Muslim Rohingya and Buddhist Rahkine being just one example

 

Edited by stormymonday_2011

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7 hours ago, stormymonday_2011 said:

So what is new in Burma

This has been going on in various degrees since Burma became independent in 1948

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Internal_conflict_in_Myanmar

It is a very complex country in terms of religion and ethnicity. Moreover, when not fighting the central government a lot of the separatists groups seem to spend times killing each other,.  Muslim Rohingya and Buddhist Rahkine being just one example

 

True, but one would have hoped that a Nobel Peace laureate would not, having recently become the de facto leader, stepped with such alacrity into the shoes of despots, by deploying propaganda to make one section of the population seem less than human.

Would you not agree?

Remember, this is a woman whose name is mentioned in the same breath as Ghandi and Mandela.

And now we have an exodus of a quarter of a million people, fleeing for their lives.

And you ask me what's new?

Edited by Sledgehead

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On 9/10/2017 at 6:58 PM, Sledgehead said:

True, but one would have hoped that a Nobel Peace laureate would not, having recently become the de facto leader, stepped with such alacrity into the shoes of despots, by deploying propaganda to make one section of the population seem less than human.

Would you not agree?

Remember, this is a woman whose name is mentioned in the same breath as Ghandi and Mandela.

And now we have an exodus of a quarter of a million people, fleeing for their lives.

And you ask me what's new?

It's a ******** marketing award. The nobel peace prize didn't stop Saint Barack Obama from bombing 7 other countries. Or stop the EU actively agitating for civil war in Ukraine.

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6 hours ago, Hail the Tripod said:

It's a ******** marketing award. The nobel peace prize didn't stop Saint Barack Obama from bombing 7 other countries. Or stop the EU actively agitating for civil war in Ukraine.

Okay, so I used the NPP as short hand for "widely accepted good egg."

We've had films made about her. Bono has built a religion around her. SJW's have shrines dedicated to her in their bedrooms. Jesus prays to her; well, he would if he were alive. You get my drift. This was supposedly somebody - perhaps the only public person -  we could have faith in.

I never believed for one second Diana was a saint, but I needed to believe somebody might be. I don't think I'm alone in hoping it might have been ASSK. Now I just feel, well, blah.

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Byron   

Frankly, my own world is complicated enough, why should I be bothered by what is happening in a country on the other side of the world?

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5 hours ago, Byron said:

Frankly, my own world is complicated enough, why should I be bothered by what is happening in a country on the other side of the world?

I'm not saying you should.

I'm commenting on a situation I feel is important, not just for what it is, but what it says about humanity. You don't need to be interested for me to be.

If I were being unkind I might ask why you haven't posted such a comment on any other topic, but let's just assume the complication of life you declare is brought about by your enthusiasm for every other topic on the forum (bar this one). You must be exhausted just keeping up! ;)

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Byron   
9 hours ago, Sledgehead said:

I'm not saying you should.

I'm commenting on a situation I feel is important, not just for what it is, but what it says about humanity. You don't need to be interested for me to be.

If I were being unkind I might ask why you haven't posted such a comment on any other topic, but let's just assume the complication of life you declare is brought about by your enthusiasm for every other topic on the forum (bar this one). You must be exhausted just keeping up! ;)

Actually, I think that it is probably a form of self protection, you know 'fingers in my ears' type.

But the USA and the UK have brought far more misery to people in other countries by our penchant for interfering, judging, moral toning and acting like the worlds Headmaster.

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6 hours ago, Byron said:

Actually, I think that it is probably a form of self protection, you know 'fingers in my ears' type.

But the USA and the UK have brought far more misery to people in other countries by our penchant for interfering, judging, moral toning and acting like the worlds Headmaster.

I take your point.

But if you read my original post - well, any of them on this thread - you'll see I'm actually being critical of those who demand we sort out the problems of the world by doing what they want. My whole point is that those types - celebs mainly - have a very poor grasp of what is going on.

So sorting the heroes from the villains isn't something we should trust Bono to do. Giving money to causes just cos a celeb tells us to is almost the definition of not bothering: we assuage our conscience for a pittance, and probably fund villains.

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Byron   
2 hours ago, Sledgehead said:

I take your point.

But if you read my original post - well, any of them on this thread - you'll see I'm actually being critical of those who demand we sort out the problems of the world by doing what they want. My whole point is that those types - celebs mainly - have a very poor grasp of what is going on.

So sorting the heroes from the villains isn't something we should trust Bono to do. Giving money to causes just cos a celeb tells us to is almost the definition of not bothering: we assuage our conscience for a pittance, and probably fund villains.

Agreed. Let people be adults and sort themselves out, it might seem tough.

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11 hours ago, Byron said:

Actually, I think that it is probably a form of self protection, you know 'fingers in my ears' type.

But the USA and the UK have brought far more misery to people in other countries by our penchant for interfering, judging, moral toning and acting like the worlds Headmaster.

That's an incomplete, selective view when brutal tyrants and extremist militias that replace them after said tyrants get toppled seem by far the most intent on carrying out mass murder on civilians and inflicting decades of misery - the problems of Western military adventures in recent decades  stems from unrealistic planning, naively jumping the gun, and wasting effort.

Edited by Big Orange

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4 hours ago, Byron said:

Agreed. Let people be adults and sort themselves out, it might seem tough.

Well, I'm not saying that either.

"Standing idly by" is not a position I am comfortable with. But don't imagine doing something necessarily makes the world a better place.

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Byron   
2 hours ago, Big Orange said:

That's an incomplete, selective view when brutal tyrants and extremist militias that replace them after said tyrants get toppled seem by far the most intent on carrying out mass murder on civilians and inflicting decades of misery - the problems of Western military adventures in recent decades  stems from unrealistic planning, naively jumping the gun, and wasting effort.

Your view, not mine.

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36 minutes ago, Byron said:

Your view, not mine.

Do you see the US and UK governments shoot evil brain control rays at ISIS, Libyan militiamen, Al Quada, Assad loyalist, the Taliban, drug syndicates, and the Burmese military or vigilantes to mass slaughter hundreds of thousands of innocents, as grossly imperfect and unpredictable as their military adventures are?

 

Edited by Big Orange

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Riedquat   
11 hours ago, Sledgehead said:

Well, I'm not saying that either.

"Standing idly by" is not a position I am comfortable with. But don't imagine doing something necessarily makes the world a better place.

The "none of our business" argument has never sat well with me. Sure, there's a dividing line - it's not up to everyone, from country to individual, to spend all their time and effort trying to help those they can, but at the other extreme walking past someone drowning when you could throw them a lifebelt is not the morally acceptable alternative. The "it'll just make things a lot worse" argument is rather more persuasive, which is (hopefully) why helping with dealing with natural disasters is less controversial.

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I'm rather worried about the orchestrated media campaign that seems to be building up around this. Thats how it started with all the nonsense in the middle east. A couple of years down the line we'll have the royal navy ferrying them from the indian ocean back to the human rights paradise that is blighty.

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But the all-too plain truth is that a policy of non-intervention can equally lead to floods of refugees, who, once stateless, might as well aim for somewhere affluent and tolerant. Why, having been uprooted and expelled, would Myanmar's Rohingya's settle in Bangladesh? Once you've been forced into a nomadic existence, why stop at the first place you come to? And if neglected, what's to stop you turning against the world?

 

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On 9/15/2017 at 11:17 AM, Steppenpig said:

I'm rather worried about the orchestrated media campaign that seems to be building up around this. Thats how it started with all the nonsense in the middle east. A couple of years down the line we'll have the royal navy ferrying them from the indian ocean back to the human rights paradise that is blighty.

+100 

 

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