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Should cyclists have to have registration numbers and insurance?


Will!

Should cyclists have to have registration numbers and insurance?  

77 members have voted

  1. 1. Should cyclists have to have registration numbers and insurance?

    • Yes
      28
    • No
      49


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HOLA441
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1
HOLA442
5 minutes ago, One-percent said:

No, playing cards are way too expensive. Cut up cereal boxes is the thing to use.

btw, why did we do this?  

It sounded like a cheap motorbike.  The first time I heard it I was in my room and thought "what's that?" and looked up to see a boy cycling past, I worked out the noise was coming from him but couldn't pick out the card.  Asked my mates at school and soon I was a member of the card club.

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HOLA443
13 hours ago, Northern Welsh Midlander said:

Londons shit.

I never use pavements or paths save for one "shared" area where I slow to a crawl as its a short cut that avoids a bad junction, they are too slow generally.

I will admit to a few reds I will ignore, both are left turns and have no pedestrian facilities. It allows me to get far enough away from the chaos when the lights go green and the lanes merge, everyone looks in their mirrors instead of in front. Oh and bus lanes... the detectors don't pick up bikes to change the lights, so you jump the red or merge across a solid white...

Where in the Highway Code does it condone that?

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HOLA444
4 minutes ago, Frank Hovis said:

It sounded like a cheap motorbike.  The first time I heard it I was in my room and thought "what's that?" and looked up to see a boy cycling past, I worked out the noise was coming from him but couldn't pick out the card.  Asked my mates at school and soon I was a member of the card club.

Oh the simple and cheap ways were found to amuse ourselves. Good times. 

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HOLA445
10 hours ago, knock out johnny said:

Last thursday, I was stationery at traffic lights when one of the fckers rear ended me - I asked if he was alright and he couldn't cycle away quickly enough. On inspection, he'd smashed my rear light cluster - cnt

cyclists are arrogant cnts

If I'd have hit him in my car I'd be in a world of sh!t

cnts

That happened to me.  On a steep hill, indicating and stationary to make a right into my work car park. Knob going too fast on his pushbike overtakes me as I start to turn, narrowly missing the front wing. Stops and gives me an earful. In whose universe is that my fault???

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HOLA446
1 minute ago, Bossybabe said:

That happened to me.  On a steep hill, indicating and stationary to make a right into my work car park. Knob going too fast on his pushbike overtakes me as I start to turn, narrowly missing the front wing. Stops and gives me an earful. In whose universe is that my fault???

Well, quite clearly yours.  Don't you know that the Lycra  clad gods of the road have free and uncumbered passage everywhere., including roads, pavements and open land.  

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HOLA447
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HOLA448
1 minute ago, Bossybabe said:

That happened to me.  On a steep hill, indicating and stationary to make a right into my work car park. Knob going too fast on his pushbike overtakes me as I start to turn, narrowly missing the front wing. Stops and gives me an earful. In whose universe is that my fault???

It's the "going too fast" bit that is the problem.  Motorcyclists don't cause similar problems because they can brake and accelerate with ease.  SOME cyclists pedal as fast as they can with little regard for traffic conditions and don't want to lose any of that speed so just weave through the traffic forgetting that they're not very visible.  I had one zoom up in slow moving but lane changing traffic (three lanes, people joining and moving across, or moving across to leave, all going about 10 / 20 mph) start to undertake me at 30 (it's a downhill)  not long after I'd joined and then shouted when I started to turn left as I'd indicated I was doing; it's a lane that can only turn left so this shouldn't have been a surprise.  I had checked my mirrors before moving and wasn't expecting some nutter with a death wish to try to undertake a car that was indicating to turn left purely because he didn't want to slow down.

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HOLA449
11 hours ago, CunningPlan said:

Perhaps you are right.

We should revert to kids cricket without helmets. Rugby without scrumcaps. No rear seatbelts. No cycle helmets. No drink driving laws. 

Survival of the fittest.

Kids have to wear helmets playing cricket these days?

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HOLA4410

Part of the problem is related to that old phrase about Britain/cyclists:

Britain is a nation of cyclists.  Holland is a nation where people ride bikes.

We don't have loads of people just riding their bikes around, trying to get things done.  We have a very large percentage of people riding their bikes always at 90%, trying to keep the speed to a maximum, not wanting to slow down for anything.  If most people were just using an efficient mode of transport which is just great compared to walking then we wouldn't be having this conversation.

The lycra / mamil thing amuses me.  It is sold as being performance sportswear, but it is just about being part of a stupid club.  I found this article amusing http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-england-nottinghamshire-38131533 ... just compare the modern girl to the one from the 30s...

_93177500_250af450-549c-4c9e-a6da-a3e26a

and 

billie-fleming-6.jpg

And it isn't just the clothing.  She had a normal bike (single gear), went around stopping in tea rooms for sustenance and was sponsored by Cadbury's, which sent her more chocolate than she could eat.  She didn't even have a water bottle -- she stopped for water.

The stupid thing is, the mamils (well, and other genders/ages) don't want to stop or slow down, and want to have an expensive bike because it is all about being an efficient machine.  But if it is for the great exercise of it all, then they'd be better off wearing flappy clothing, having a bike made of girders that cost £40, stopping whenever they could so that they could start up again.  But no, they have to pretend to be sportspeople, trying to scrape 5 seconds off their stupid record.  I just wonder what the next fad will be.

Anyway, no plates or insurance, but I'd like to see the current rules being policed.

Oh, and I'd like to see something official done about cyclists and pavements.  IMO they should be allowed to use the pavement, but with a maximum speed limit of 6mph (or whatever) and made clear that pedestrians always have priority.  

 

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HOLA4411
10 hours ago, whitevanman said:

What is a false argument? It's an opinion. I think H&S has gone too far, you think it hasn't gone far enough. That's fine, opinions differ. 

Btw I rode a motorbike all over India without using a helmet and it was great! Mandatory helmet use is a huge imposition on the individual. The state does not own you! I scuba dive and I had lessons but you know what? Jacques Cousteau worked it out for himself and he wasn't too bad at it.

If we always put safety first we will lose our freedom and we won't move forward as a people.

Good luck, but it appears that some people are happy to trade living for the possibility of more existence. IMO it comes not from an appreciation of risk, as they so often claim, but from a lack of it, resulting in massive over-caution to unlikely events (and not being able to make sensible judgments about real, likely risks if there aren't a clear set of rules and physical barriers in place to do it for them).

It's not so much rules as attitudes, and when I look around at some of the crap I see today (e.g. ugly steel security fencing alongside railways in the middle of nowhere, so much high-vis that it's easier to spot the one person not wearing it etc.) it's hard to not just get depressed at the state of the country. I'm certainly against any rules designed to protect people from themselves, and whilst the overprotective attitude might save a few I'm sure it's got a boy who cried wolf effect too. So more freedom and come down like a ton of bricks on those who abuse it.

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HOLA4412
19 minutes ago, dgul said:

The stupid thing is, the mamils (well, and other genders/ages) don't want to stop or slow down, and want to have an expensive bike because it is all about being an efficient machine.  But if it is for the great exercise of it all, then they'd be better off wearing flappy clothing, having a bike made of girders that cost £40, stopping whenever they could so that they could start up again.  But no, they have to pretend to be sportspeople, trying to scrape 5 seconds off their stupid record.  I just wonder what the next fad will be.

I've never understood the monolothic uniformity of the MAMIL.  They are all the same.  Carbon fibre bike, lycra, hunched down, serious face on.   Relax guys, biking CAN be fun.

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HOLA4413
16 minutes ago, canbuywontbuy said:

I've never understood the monolothic uniformity of the MAMIL.  They are all the same.  Carbon fibre bike, lycra, hunched down, serious face on.   Relax guys, biking CAN be fun.

At least when going downhill... Actually I was starting to get something out of going uphill last year, just using the excuse of waiting for warmer weather now. No lycra mind you (or helmet since the strap broke), but getting a better bike did make the uphill rather more tolerable.

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HOLA4414
51 minutes ago, Riedquat said:

It's not so much rules as attitudes, and when I look around at some of the crap I see today (e.g. ugly steel security fencing alongside railways in the middle of nowhere, so much high-vis that it's easier to spot the one person not wearing it etc.) it's hard to not just get depressed at the state of the country. I'm certainly against any rules designed to protect people from themselves, and whilst the overprotective attitude might save a few I'm sure it's got a boy who cried wolf effect too. So more freedom and come down like a ton of bricks on those who abuse it.

 

jacket.jpg

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HOLA4415

As an road bike rider who has mixed it with traffic etc i have always been of the opinion that cycling should be free and a free mode of transport, so i don't agree with having to pay any taxes etc but in the last couple of years or so i have noticed the attitude and behaviour change of some of these on road cycle commuters / Mamils etc 

Dawdling, riding 2 abreast chatting in the rush hour, on the pavement / off the pavement, and squeezing past queueing cars knocking peoples wing mirrors. 

I think a rear reg plate like the motorbikes would be a good thing no costs just an ID marker that can be followed up. 

I'm not talking about on off road bikes or childrens bikes but just for the on road cycle commuters and Mamils. 

Some sort of traceability, at the moment in the event they damage someones car they can just ride off with impunity. 

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HOLA4416
16 hours ago, Northern Welsh Midlander said:

You should definitely split this vote:

I'm a cyclist, so No.

I'm not a cyclist, so Yes.

Other options not required :)

As has been covered over and over though, cyclists generally do have insurance! Its covered under all but the most bare bones household policies.

Does household insurance include injuries to others?

16 hours ago, ChewingGrass said:

So you want to financialise the last remaining 'free' means of transport. You should be banned from this site. It will be walking next, particularly dangerous in central London, everyone would have to carry a number plate and be insured, even children, presumably the homeless would also be banned from the street for not having any insurance or permanent address for fines/summonses.

I'd also ban straw men for not having insurance against flames.

9 hours ago, TheBlueCat said:

Not practical to enforce - what are you going to do, have cops running around after kids out on their bikes to make sure they have a tax disk etc? 

I didn't mention road tax and no-one has tax discs now anyway.

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HOLA4417
57 minutes ago, canbuywontbuy said:

I've never understood the monolothic uniformity of the MAMIL.  They are all the same.  Carbon fibre bike, lycra, hunched down, serious face on.   Relax guys, biking CAN be fun.

See, if I was a really fit guy and good at cycling, for normal training I'd just wear cords (or plus-4s) and a cotton top, and perhaps ride an old steel bike (well, with Reynolds tubes, I'm not stupid) with down-tube shifters.  I gain the smug satisfaction from overtaking the fat guys in lycra on their £1000 bikes., while giving a cheery wave. 

But, of course, I'd then not fit in, and they'd say things like 'look at the odd guy riding his bike, if only he'd try properly he'd be world class'.  In their heads there is no option but to comply.

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HOLA4418
11 hours ago, CunningPlan said:

I don't think h&s hasn't gone far enough. There needs to be a happy balance. In all seriousness, which rules would you repeal?

 

11 hours ago, whitevanman said:

As a general principle I would leave it up to the individual/parent. Some activities have significant externalities: drivers, pilots, etc. I don't have a problem with evidence based rules for those activities. 

 

1 hour ago, Riedquat said:

Good luck, but it appears that some people are happy to trade living for the possibility of more existence. IMO it comes not from an appreciation of risk, as they so often claim, but from a lack of it, resulting in massive over-caution to unlikely events (and not being able to make sensible judgments about real, likely risks if there aren't a clear set of rules and physical barriers in place to do it for them).

It's not so much rules as attitudes, and when I look around at some of the crap I see today (e.g. ugly steel security fencing alongside railways in the middle of nowhere, so much high-vis that it's easier to spot the one person not wearing it etc.) it's hard to not just get depressed at the state of the country. I'm certainly against any rules designed to protect people from themselves, and whilst the overprotective attitude might save a few I'm sure it's got a boy who cried wolf effect too. So more freedom and come down like a ton of bricks on those who abuse it.

I suspect we can all appreciate the difference between rules (be they compulsory registration and insurance or Health & Safety) that protect the individual from themselves and rules that protect others from the individual.

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HOLA4419
1 hour ago, dgul said:

Part of the problem is related to that old phrase about Britain/cyclists:

Britain is a nation of cyclists.  Holland is a nation where people ride bikes.

We don't have loads of people just riding their bikes around, trying to get things done.  We have a very large percentage of people riding their bikes always at 90%, trying to keep the speed to a maximum, not wanting to slow down for anything.  If most people were just using an efficient mode of transport which is just great compared to walking then we wouldn't be having this conversation.

The lycra / mamil thing amuses me.  It is sold as being performance sportswear, but it is just about being part of a stupid club.  I found this article amusing http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-england-nottinghamshire-38131533 ... just compare the modern girl to the one from the 30s...

_93177500_250af450-549c-4c9e-a6da-a3e26a

and 

billie-fleming-6.jpg

And it isn't just the clothing.  She had a normal bike (single gear), went around stopping in tea rooms for sustenance and was sponsored by Cadbury's, which sent her more chocolate than she could eat.  She didn't even have a water bottle -- she stopped for water.

The stupid thing is, the mamils (well, and other genders/ages) don't want to stop or slow down, and want to have an expensive bike because it is all about being an efficient machine.  But if it is for the great exercise of it all, then they'd be better off wearing flappy clothing, having a bike made of girders that cost £40, stopping whenever they could so that they could start up again.  But no, they have to pretend to be sportspeople, trying to scrape 5 seconds off their stupid record.  I just wonder what the next fad will be.

Anyway, no plates or insurance, but I'd like to see the current rules being policed.

Oh, and I'd like to see something official done about cyclists and pavements.  IMO they should be allowed to use the pavement, but with a maximum speed limit of 6mph (or whatever) and made clear that pedestrians always have priority.  

 

 
 

I'd agree with all of this - well except for the bit about the lady in the bottom picture riding a single gear. Judging by the lower chain, I reckon her bike must have a derailleur. 

I have a friend who I go out mountain biking with about once a year. It is all rush rush, strava this and that, gear gear gear. He's pretty good, consistently 10% faster than me. Once as I caught up with him waiting yet again at the top of a hill he said, "you do realise I'm going flat out". Oh, I thought - I just take it easy and figure I'll get to the top of the hill eventually.  I have zero interest in going flat out, I'd rather enjoy the view. 

We need a movement of Zen cyclists - dedicated to chilling while riding,  and being nice to already miserable Londoners.

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HOLA4420
6 minutes ago, StainlessSteelCat said:

I'd agree with all of this - well except for the bit about the lady in the bottom picture riding a single gear. Judging by the lower chain, I reckon her bike must have a derailleur. 

You're right, she rode a Rudge with a three speed derailleur.    She was known for her scorn on modern bikes.  When she was asked about multi-speeds (referring to a 11x3 bike that was popular at the time) she said "You can’t tell the difference between them. Three is plenty, 33 is ridiculous."

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HOLA4421

Alot of the Mamils are training for weekend triathalons, i see them at the swimming pool in groups doing front crawl, they like to monopolise the lane and swim sets of 50mtr sprint repeats etc always timing themselves, heart rate monitors as well, They drag themselves through the water with their arms and dont kick as it is all about "saving your legs for the bike and run" 

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HOLA4422
1 hour ago, Will! said:

I suspect we can all appreciate the difference between rules (be they compulsory registration and insurance or Health & Safety) that protect the individual from themselves and rules that protect others from the individual.

You think so? That's not the way it looks to me.

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HOLA4423
1 hour ago, dgul said:

You're right, she rode a Rudge with a three speed derailleur.    She was known for her scorn on modern bikes.  When she was asked about multi-speeds (referring to a 11x3 bike that was popular at the time) she said "You can’t tell the difference between them. Three is plenty, 33 is ridiculous."

Depends how flat it is.

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HOLA4424
36 minutes ago, Riedquat said:

You think so? That's not the way it looks to me.

Does it look to you that we can't appreciate the difference or does it look to you that there is not a difference or something else?

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HOLA4425
3 minutes ago, Will! said:

Does it look to you that we can't appreciate the difference or does it look to you that there is not a difference or something else?

There's an awful lot of stuff about that appears to exist mostly to protect people from themselves. How much of that the rules and laws are directly responsible for, how much indirectly (i.e., rather ironically "not sure if I need to but better not take the risk"), and how much is just the general environment created by it I couldn't say.

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