GreenDevil

Brexit What Happens Next Thread ---multiple merged threads.

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6 hours ago, ExiledMatty said:

You only have to look at how Brits tend to blend in better when they emigrate to anglo countries. Compare that to the 'English' villages of France, the Spanish Brit 'costas'.

Easier to mingle when you share the same first language. What cultural similarities we've got with the USA are probably down to being far more familiar with US culture due to all the films and TV that come from there. Lack of as much sense of history in such places may contribute too (it would make a more interesting comparison to find very fluent speakers of non-English languages from such countries moving abroad and seeing how they fit in).

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6 hours ago, ExiledMatty said:

You only have to look at how Brits tend to blend in better when they emigrate to anglo countries. Compare that to the 'English' villages of France, the Spanish Brit 'costas'.

Even somewhere like Melbourne that still has ghettos where Italians, Greeks live (we are talking many generations too). No such British ghettos despite the million plus Brits who have moved out to Aus.

Sorry but on an individual level we have far more in common with people from anglo nations but that wasn't really my point.

My point was on a national level. It's been spelt out many times who are real friends are. The likes of Canada, Australia, the U.S., special relationships, first in line for trade deals, happy to lend negotiators etc etc.

I've never heard anything like this coming out of European leaders. We're now disliked even more due to Brexit. 

When it comes down to the vital issues of trust and security then look up 'five eyes'. Says it all to me.

So the English live in villages, the Italians/Greeks in ghettos? not biased/bigoted at all are you.   

Talk is cheap and the US wants to address its trade imbalance with the UK so I am not sure getting involved in a trade deal is a good idea. The rest don't matter in macro terms.  You need to spend some time in the US and see how much they think or care about the UK. I would far rather be dealing with the French and Germans as an equal than being subservient to the US. 

The Germans and others have been very supportive of the UK over the years. Of course after all the years of name calling/whining we are getting disliked that's just one of the costs of Brexit.

 

 

 

 

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15 minutes ago, Byron said:

Hardly a convincing reason.

The DUP are not likely to suddenly embrace Corbyn style left wing politics, and I doubt that the idea of a hard border with the Catholic South will bother them at all.

Ok, what happens when the government cannot get their version of Brexit through the HoC, do they give up on the whole idea or call a GE.

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7 hours ago, ExiledMatty said:

You only have to look at how Brits tend to blend in better when they emigrate to anglo countries. Compare that to the 'English' villages of France, the Spanish Brit 'costas'.

Even somewhere like Melbourne that still has ghettos where Italians, Greeks live (we are talking many generations too). No such British ghettos despite the million plus Brits who have moved out to Aus.

Sorry but on an individual level we have far more in common with people from anglo nations but that wasn't really my point.

My point was on a national level. It's been spelt out many times who are real friends are. The likes of Canada, Australia, the U.S., special relationships, first in line for trade deals, happy to lend negotiators etc etc.

I've never heard anything like this coming out of European leaders. We're now disliked even more due to Brexit. 

When it comes down to the vital issues of trust and security then look up 'five eyes'. Says it all to me.

Christ yes Brits abroad  - a friend of mine used to bring his own teabags lol!  I think it was Tenerife where I walked past umpteen cafes selling poor value 'anglophone' sh1t to find a modest local cafe dishing up superb food where the only other tourists seemed to be germanic looking families.

Extreme situation I know - embarrassing issues of language, conservatism etc, I'm sure as with our equivalent in Europe, many of the Europeans I meet here seem pretty happily integrated. Or were - those I've spoken to on this topic are worried we've lost the plot and (many on here Im sure will be pleased to hear) are contemplating leaving or know people who are. 

And then of course much of the anglophone countries think we have lost the plot too and in addition have joined in the worldwide revulsion of Trump - wasn't there a story where security agencies are on notice not to necessarily trust the Trump regime with sensitive material ? Can't wait till he braves our warm welcome !

France for the time being have escaped being defeated by nationalist insecurity, as have other EU countries - why would European leaders respect us, the mighty world war winning Great Britain, for having finally succumbed and turned into a mess ?

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12 minutes ago, Confusion of VIs said:

Ok, what happens when the government cannot get their version of Brexit through the HoC, do they give up on the whole idea or call a GE.

They can't 'give up' on the idea - and anyway that Fox interview again indicated there is a coterie of MP's who want Brexit at any cost to Britain and at any level of cluelessness. Fox has been campaigning his whole career you know, have pity.

GE called or forced - over to the constitutional experts.

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8 minutes ago, pig said:

Christ yes Brits abroad  - a friend of mine used to bring his own teabags lol!  I think it was Tenerife where I walked past umpteen cafes selling poor value 'anglophone' sh1t to find a modest local cafe dishing up superb food where the only other tourists seemed to be germanic looking families.

Extreme situation I know - embarrassing issues of language, conservatism etc, I'm sure as with our equivalent in Europe, many of the Europeans I meet here seem pretty happily integrated. Or were - those I've spoken to on this topic are worried we've lost the plot and (many on here Im sure will be pleased to hear) are contemplating leaving or know people who are. 

And then of course much of the anglophone countries think we have lost the plot too and in addition have joined in the worldwide revulsion of Trump - wasn't there a story where security agencies are on notice not to necessarily trust the Trump regime with sensitive material ? Can't wait till he braves our warm welcome !

France for the time being have escaped being defeated by nationalist insecurity, as have other EU countries - why would European leaders respect us, the mighty world war winning Great Britain, for having finally succumbed and turned into a mess ?

At some point you have to just live how you want to live and dial out the white noise of others who think they are superior.

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4 hours ago, Futuroid said:

Morning all! Another day, another complete lack of preparation and notable absence of strategy...

UK 'sleepwalking' into food insecurity after Brexit, academics say
Study attacks complacency after years of stable food supplies and prices, saying lack of policy ‘suggests chaos unless redressed’

https://www.theguardian.com/politics/2017/jul/17/uk-sleepwalking-into-food-insecurity-after-brexit-academics-say

Leave voters: Feel free to dismiss this report, it was prepared by experts. As we can see from the UK government cabinet, on matters of importance the British public prefer the word of amateurs. Try humming "they need us more than we need them" while you keep your fingers in your ears.

Well the ram it with tanks Brexiters would claim that now even EU food is trying to derail Brexit and we've been putting the damn stuff in our mouths for decades.

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1 hour ago, pig said:

They can't 'give up' on the idea - and anyway that Fox interview again indicated there is a coterie of MP's who want Brexit at any cost to Britain and at any level of cluelessness. Fox has been campaigning his whole career you know, have pity.

GE called or forced - over to the constitutional experts.

The constitutional experts ,our Supreme Court, have already ruled there must be a meaningful vote to approve the Brexit deal.

So as Fox and his fellow travelers have no chance of getting a bad/no deal  through the HoC that means a GE or a second binding referendum to approve the deal.

As I cannot image the Conservatives wanting to go to the country on a "yes we have screwed up Brexit and the deal will make you much poorer platform but please vote for us/it anyway" platform we will be having a second referendum. 

I suppose that as before they could ignore they could ignore legal advice and try to ram it through without a vote, but then Gina Miller will be back to the court asking for it to be ruled unconstitutional which if granted make the A50 invocation invalid - and like that series of Dallas the whole Brexit fiasco will just have been a bad dream.   

The Tories  have created a deadly Zugzwang for themselves.

Edited by Confusion of VIs

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28 minutes ago, Confusion of VIs said:

The constitutional experts ,our Supreme Court, have already ruled there must be a meaningful vote to approve the Brexit deal.

So as Fox and his fellow travelers have no chance of getting a bad/no deal  through the HoC that means a GE or a second binding referendum to approve the deal.

As I cannot image the Conservatives wanting to go to the country on a "yes we have screwed up Brexit and the deal will make you much poorer platform but please vote for us/it anyway" platform we will be having a second referendum. 

I suppose that as before they could ignore they could ignore legal advice and try to ram it through without a vote, but then Gina Miller will be back to the court asking for it to be ruled unconstitutional which if granted make the A50 invocation invalid - and like that series of Dallas the whole Brexit fiasco will just have been a bad dream.   

The Tories  have created a deadly Zugzwang for themselves.

Yeah............right.

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9 hours ago, ExiledMatty said:

You only have to look at how Brits tend to blend in better when they emigrate to anglo countries. Compare that to the 'English' villages of France, the Spanish Brit 'costas'.

Even somewhere like Melbourne that still has ghettos where Italians, Greeks live (we are talking many generations too). No such British ghettos despite the million plus Brits who have moved out to Aus.

Sorry but on an individual level we have far more in common with people from anglo nations but that wasn't really my point.

My point was on a national level. It's been spelt out many times who are real friends are. The likes of Canada, Australia, the U.S., special relationships, first in line for trade deals, happy to lend negotiators etc etc.

I've never heard anything like this coming out of European leaders. We're now disliked even more due to Brexit. 

When it comes down to the vital issues of trust and security then look up 'five eyes'. Says it all to me.

The US isn't an 'Anglo' nation.  It's a continental federation and melting pot from around the world that happens to speak English for historical reasons.

The US systematically destroyed the UK as a world power so to talk of them as our 'true friends' is perverse.

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39 minutes ago, thecrashingisles said:

The US isn't an 'Anglo' nation.  It's a continental federation and melting pot from around the world that happens to speak English for historical reasons.

The US systematically destroyed the UK as a world power so to talk of them as our 'true friends' is perverse.

Would you like the UK to be a world power?

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3 hours ago, Confusion of VIs said:

We you can but you just come across as unable to put comments in their context, maybe a bit of OCD going on. 

As almost anyone else would know when people say nothing is happening, they mean nothing useful or helpful to the UK's cause.   

No - I am doing exactly that. Putting them in context.

These debates need balance. So if someone is going to come out and say something completely wrong like 'NOTHING' is happening - its perfectly reasonable to expect another person to point that out.

I am pretty certain. In fact no - I am 100% certain. Not even 99.99% - that if I came out and stated everything around Brexit was going amazingly perfectly - I would have at least 4-5 people coming out within minutes to respond to that and put me straight. Of this there is no debate.

Its only the remain side that appear to get rather annoyed when their mass exaggerations are called out.........

 

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25 minutes ago, ccc said:

No - I am doing exactly that. Putting them in context.

These debates need balance. So if someone is going to come out and say something completely wrong like 'NOTHING' is happening - its perfectly reasonable to expect another person to point that out.

I am pretty certain. In fact no - I am 100% certain. Not even 99.99% - that if I came out and stated everything around Brexit was going amazingly perfectly - I would have at least 4-5 people coming out within minutes to respond to that and put me straight. Of this there is no debate.

Its only the remain side that appear to get rather annoyed when their mass exaggerations are called out.........

 

I assume this post is a long winded way of you saying yes to my question re OCD.

I would be interested to hear about what is going well, this seems to be singularly lacking in the press coverage - even the Daily Express cannot find anything positive to report.  

 

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12 minutes ago, Confusion of VIs said:

I assume this post is a long winded way of you saying yes to my question re OCD.

I would be interested to hear about what is going well, this seems to be singularly lacking in the press coverage - even the Daily Express cannot find anything positive to report.  

 

Like weaning an addict off heroin, leaving will be hard.

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1 hour ago, Confusion of VIs said:

I assume this post is a long winded way of you saying yes to my question re OCD.

I would be interested to hear about what is going well, this seems to be singularly lacking in the press coverage - even the Daily Express cannot find anything positive to report.  

 

:lol::lol:

Amazing. You have just proven my point perfectly. And I only said this as a hypothetical example. And you STILL couldn't help yourself.

Absolutely superb. :D

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22 hours ago, ccc said:

Nothing is happening ? Would you like to have a bet in that ? 

Money = mouth. 

Something is happening ? Would you like to have a bet on that ? 

Money = mouth. 

Edited by HairyOb1

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2 hours ago, GrizzlyDave said:

Like weaning an addict off heroin, leaving will be hard.

Well, there is no giving up on the future of your country - ever. Surprising or not that's the point Leavers seem to miss.

Immigration aside, for many Leavers, Brexit seems to be a reward in itself not really a means to an end - thats what Leavers are misinterpreting as mindboggling complacency.

 

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2 minutes ago, pig said:

Well, there is no giving up on the future of your country - ever. Surprising or not that's the point Leavers seem to miss.

Immigration aside, for many Leavers, Brexit seems to be a reward in itself not really a means to an end - thats what Leavers are misinterpreting as mindboggling complacency.

 

Not at all, brexit is the beginning and not the end.

One chapter closes and another starts.

You are quite out of touch with the pulse of the nation. What part of the country / industry are you in?

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31 minutes ago, GrizzlyDave said:

Not at all, brexit is the beginning and not the end.

One chapter closes and another starts.

You are quite out of touch with the pulse of the nation. What part of the country / industry are you in?

At least one or two of the vociferous remainiacs on here actually worked / have worked for the EU - the upward movement on the gravy train being restricted is reason enough for them to want the rest of the country to prop up the sucking of the teat ..  :-)

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58 minutes ago, GrizzlyDave said:

Not at all, brexit is the beginning and not the end.

One chapter closes and another starts.

You are quite out of touch with the pulse of the nation. What part of the country / industry are you in?

Well, after endlessly asking for a viable strategy/plan/vision, online, in person, via the various admissions by MP's and so on    I think we're well past the point of believing there ever was any. Blaming Cameron for not having a Brexit strategy or May for not being able to square the circle as if everything would have been fine if not doesn't really cut it either. Even the incessant brainwashing from the MSM, the billionaires Dacre and so on just begs the question - what was the point anyway ? A whinge that got out of hand ?

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4 minutes ago, pig said:

Well, after endlessly asking for a viable strategy/plan/vision, online, in person, via the various admissions by MP's and so on    I think we're well past the point of believing there ever was any. Blaming Cameron for not having a Brexit strategy or May for not being able to square the circle as if everything would have been fine if not doesn't really cut it either. Even the incessant brainwashing from the MSM, the billionaires Dacre and so on just begs the question - what was the point anyway ? A whinge that got out of hand ?

More of the same vs. Shake it up.

You are aware this is HPC?

So where in the UK do you live?

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What about the Blair "intervention" this weekend?

If it had been Trump, the BBC would've been all over it, saying he's delusional and spreading fake news.

Because it's Blair, they let him say the EU is willing to compromise on FoM, with little challenge.  This was actually reported as serious news on BBC TV.

Blair apparently has heard it said the EU would compromise to keep the UK in.  He was never challenged to reveal where this came from.  The official line is the four freedoms are non-negotiable:  "This is not poussible" remember from Barnier only the other week.

How is it this Blair interview was reported like this?

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1 hour ago, HairyOb1 said:

Something is happening ? Would you like to have a bet on that ? 

Money = mouth. 

What's your point ?

You lot really seem to get in real hissyfits when I point out something you don't like - but which you can't argue with as it's clearly true. 

I have simply responded to two points made recently which are complete nonsense.

(1) Nothing is happening with Brexit

(2) Fox knows nothing about Brexit

When I point this out I am responded to with such claims as I have OCD or I have some strange view on reality and can't put things in context. 

It's pathetic. It really is. 

I will continue to point out nonsense when it's typed on here and is 100% factually incorrect. 

If you don't like that - I couldn't really give a toss.

It will continue - for as long as the remainers on here post nonsense.

I don't expect it to end any time soon. :D

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