GreenDevil

Brexit What Happens Next Thread ---multiple merged threads.

Recommended Posts

3 hours ago, Byron said:

Maths?

But then as my Gran always said, lefties can't do sums.

I doubt it will come down to simple maths, 

If things get so bad they lose a vote of confidence, there is little or no chance they could get their version of Brexit through the house.

What then, the only options I can see are hold a GE to resolve the issue or put it to a second referendum (this would have to be the simple choice of do we accept the proposed deal or revoke A50 - as we don't have control over any other options). 

 

 

 

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
11 hours ago, Futuroid said:

The disorganised disunity of the UK is not going unnoticed by our biggest European trading partner:

http://www.spiegel.de/politik/ausland/brexit-eu-und-grossbritannien-steuern-auf-scheitern-zu-a-1157448.html

Executive summary - they are starting to lose faith in the ability of the UK to get it's act together and decide what it wants. Interestly, even on the matter of citizen's rights post-Brexit, the UK doesn't seem to have a clear position.

Oh my !  The European Commission wants to continue  legal proceedings against London for 83 violations of EU treaties.  The Westminster clowns are toast.

Edited by ZeroSumGame

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
3 hours ago, ccc said:

 

Does he know about various Brexit related things that are happening ? Yes or no ? 

It's a rhetorical question btw. He clearly does. Which makes your statement nonsense. Yet again. 

Ok I agree. In your bizarrely limited interpretation, you are right he does know stuff is happening. But what that stuff is he seemed less clear about, as to what if anything concrete had been achieved he was completely unable to say.  

So in practical terms the interview revelled he knew nothing about where the negotiations are going, and seemed to disagree with both Boris and Hammond about some of the key issues being negotiated.   

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
15 hours ago, thecrashingisles said:

Having worked in the US and several EU countries, I would argue that culturally we are nothing like the US despite our shared language.

You only have to look at how Brits tend to blend in better when they emigrate to anglo countries. Compare that to the 'English' villages of France, the Spanish Brit 'costas'.

Even somewhere like Melbourne that still has ghettos where Italians, Greeks live (we are talking many generations too). No such British ghettos despite the million plus Brits who have moved out to Aus.

Sorry but on an individual level we have far more in common with people from anglo nations but that wasn't really my point.

My point was on a national level. It's been spelt out many times who are real friends are. The likes of Canada, Australia, the U.S., special relationships, first in line for trade deals, happy to lend negotiators etc etc.

I've never heard anything like this coming out of European leaders. We're now disliked even more due to Brexit. 

When it comes down to the vital issues of trust and security then look up 'five eyes'. Says it all to me.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
7 hours ago, Confusion of VIs said:

Ok I agree. In your bizarrely limited interpretation, you are right he does know stuff is happening. But what that stuff is he seemed less clear about, as to what if anything concrete had been achieved he was completely unable to say.  

So in practical terms the interview revelled he knew nothing about where the negotiations are going, and seemed to disagree with both Boris and Hammond about some of the key issues being negotiated.   

I was just pointing out that people on here saying "nothing" is happening or the people involved know nothing about what is going on are talking nonsense. 

And as people continue to come out with this nonsense - I shall continue to point it out. 

 

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Morning all! Another day, another complete lack of preparation and notable absence of strategy...

UK 'sleepwalking' into food insecurity after Brexit, academics say
Study attacks complacency after years of stable food supplies and prices, saying lack of policy ‘suggests chaos unless redressed’

https://www.theguardian.com/politics/2017/jul/17/uk-sleepwalking-into-food-insecurity-after-brexit-academics-say

Leave voters: Feel free to dismiss this report, it was prepared by experts. As we can see from the UK government cabinet, on matters of importance the British public prefer the word of amateurs. Try humming "they need us more than we need them" while you keep your fingers in your ears.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
Quote

 

Brexit-related anxiety and domestic political uncertainty continue

 

The UK needs to prepare itself for weaker economic performance, the downsides of the Brexit vote. Fragile business sentiment linked to Brexit-related anxiety, domestic political uncertainty and squeezed consumer budgets have caused UK business confidence to drop to its lowest point for almost six years. Meanwhile, Britain’s economic growth will continue to weaken this year due to a Brexit-related consumer-spending squeeze and muted earnings growth. Companies have become increasingly worried about the business outlook, largely as a result of heightened political uncertainties and the potential impact of Brexit.

Consumer spending, the economy’s main engine of growth, would continue to lose momentum as the pound’s collapse since the Brexit vote continued to stoke inflation. “The inflationary squeeze on consumers has been painful and shows little sign of easing any time soon. Sterling’s sharp drop is yet to fully feed through to the consumer price index, with inflation expected to reach up to 3.3% this autumn – well ahead of the growth in average earnings. Real household disposable income is forecast to fall by 0.2% in 2017. Guardian

 

Brexit must be now the number one excuse for everything, definitely overtook the weather.

 

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
2 hours ago, ccc said:

I was just pointing out that people on here saying "nothing" is happening or the people involved know nothing about what is going on are talking nonsense. 

And as people continue to come out with this nonsense - I shall continue to point it out. 

 

We you can but you just come across as unable to put comments in their context, maybe a bit of OCD going on. 

As almost anyone else would know when people say nothing is happening, they mean nothing useful or helpful to the UK's cause.   

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
12 hours ago, Futuroid said:

Your Gran hadnt't factored in the DUP and the possibility of a hard NI/Eire border, with possible reunification of Ireland ramifications...

Hardly a convincing reason.

The DUP are not likely to suddenly embrace Corbyn style left wing politics, and I doubt that the idea of a hard border with the Catholic South will bother them at all.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
6 hours ago, ExiledMatty said:

You only have to look at how Brits tend to blend in better when they emigrate to anglo countries. Compare that to the 'English' villages of France, the Spanish Brit 'costas'.

Easier to mingle when you share the same first language. What cultural similarities we've got with the USA are probably down to being far more familiar with US culture due to all the films and TV that come from there. Lack of as much sense of history in such places may contribute too (it would make a more interesting comparison to find very fluent speakers of non-English languages from such countries moving abroad and seeing how they fit in).

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
6 hours ago, ExiledMatty said:

You only have to look at how Brits tend to blend in better when they emigrate to anglo countries. Compare that to the 'English' villages of France, the Spanish Brit 'costas'.

Even somewhere like Melbourne that still has ghettos where Italians, Greeks live (we are talking many generations too). No such British ghettos despite the million plus Brits who have moved out to Aus.

Sorry but on an individual level we have far more in common with people from anglo nations but that wasn't really my point.

My point was on a national level. It's been spelt out many times who are real friends are. The likes of Canada, Australia, the U.S., special relationships, first in line for trade deals, happy to lend negotiators etc etc.

I've never heard anything like this coming out of European leaders. We're now disliked even more due to Brexit. 

When it comes down to the vital issues of trust and security then look up 'five eyes'. Says it all to me.

So the English live in villages, the Italians/Greeks in ghettos? not biased/bigoted at all are you.   

Talk is cheap and the US wants to address its trade imbalance with the UK so I am not sure getting involved in a trade deal is a good idea. The rest don't matter in macro terms.  You need to spend some time in the US and see how much they think or care about the UK. I would far rather be dealing with the French and Germans as an equal than being subservient to the US. 

The Germans and others have been very supportive of the UK over the years. Of course after all the years of name calling/whining we are getting disliked that's just one of the costs of Brexit.

 

 

 

 

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
15 minutes ago, Byron said:

Hardly a convincing reason.

The DUP are not likely to suddenly embrace Corbyn style left wing politics, and I doubt that the idea of a hard border with the Catholic South will bother them at all.

Ok, what happens when the government cannot get their version of Brexit through the HoC, do they give up on the whole idea or call a GE.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
7 hours ago, ExiledMatty said:

You only have to look at how Brits tend to blend in better when they emigrate to anglo countries. Compare that to the 'English' villages of France, the Spanish Brit 'costas'.

Even somewhere like Melbourne that still has ghettos where Italians, Greeks live (we are talking many generations too). No such British ghettos despite the million plus Brits who have moved out to Aus.

Sorry but on an individual level we have far more in common with people from anglo nations but that wasn't really my point.

My point was on a national level. It's been spelt out many times who are real friends are. The likes of Canada, Australia, the U.S., special relationships, first in line for trade deals, happy to lend negotiators etc etc.

I've never heard anything like this coming out of European leaders. We're now disliked even more due to Brexit. 

When it comes down to the vital issues of trust and security then look up 'five eyes'. Says it all to me.

Christ yes Brits abroad  - a friend of mine used to bring his own teabags lol!  I think it was Tenerife where I walked past umpteen cafes selling poor value 'anglophone' sh1t to find a modest local cafe dishing up superb food where the only other tourists seemed to be germanic looking families.

Extreme situation I know - embarrassing issues of language, conservatism etc, I'm sure as with our equivalent in Europe, many of the Europeans I meet here seem pretty happily integrated. Or were - those I've spoken to on this topic are worried we've lost the plot and (many on here Im sure will be pleased to hear) are contemplating leaving or know people who are. 

And then of course much of the anglophone countries think we have lost the plot too and in addition have joined in the worldwide revulsion of Trump - wasn't there a story where security agencies are on notice not to necessarily trust the Trump regime with sensitive material ? Can't wait till he braves our warm welcome !

France for the time being have escaped being defeated by nationalist insecurity, as have other EU countries - why would European leaders respect us, the mighty world war winning Great Britain, for having finally succumbed and turned into a mess ?

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
12 minutes ago, Confusion of VIs said:

Ok, what happens when the government cannot get their version of Brexit through the HoC, do they give up on the whole idea or call a GE.

They can't 'give up' on the idea - and anyway that Fox interview again indicated there is a coterie of MP's who want Brexit at any cost to Britain and at any level of cluelessness. Fox has been campaigning his whole career you know, have pity.

GE called or forced - over to the constitutional experts.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
8 minutes ago, pig said:

Christ yes Brits abroad  - a friend of mine used to bring his own teabags lol!  I think it was Tenerife where I walked past umpteen cafes selling poor value 'anglophone' sh1t to find a modest local cafe dishing up superb food where the only other tourists seemed to be germanic looking families.

Extreme situation I know - embarrassing issues of language, conservatism etc, I'm sure as with our equivalent in Europe, many of the Europeans I meet here seem pretty happily integrated. Or were - those I've spoken to on this topic are worried we've lost the plot and (many on here Im sure will be pleased to hear) are contemplating leaving or know people who are. 

And then of course much of the anglophone countries think we have lost the plot too and in addition have joined in the worldwide revulsion of Trump - wasn't there a story where security agencies are on notice not to necessarily trust the Trump regime with sensitive material ? Can't wait till he braves our warm welcome !

France for the time being have escaped being defeated by nationalist insecurity, as have other EU countries - why would European leaders respect us, the mighty world war winning Great Britain, for having finally succumbed and turned into a mess ?

At some point you have to just live how you want to live and dial out the white noise of others who think they are superior.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
4 hours ago, Futuroid said:

Morning all! Another day, another complete lack of preparation and notable absence of strategy...

UK 'sleepwalking' into food insecurity after Brexit, academics say
Study attacks complacency after years of stable food supplies and prices, saying lack of policy ‘suggests chaos unless redressed’

https://www.theguardian.com/politics/2017/jul/17/uk-sleepwalking-into-food-insecurity-after-brexit-academics-say

Leave voters: Feel free to dismiss this report, it was prepared by experts. As we can see from the UK government cabinet, on matters of importance the British public prefer the word of amateurs. Try humming "they need us more than we need them" while you keep your fingers in your ears.

Well the ram it with tanks Brexiters would claim that now even EU food is trying to derail Brexit and we've been putting the damn stuff in our mouths for decades.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
1 hour ago, pig said:

They can't 'give up' on the idea - and anyway that Fox interview again indicated there is a coterie of MP's who want Brexit at any cost to Britain and at any level of cluelessness. Fox has been campaigning his whole career you know, have pity.

GE called or forced - over to the constitutional experts.

The constitutional experts ,our Supreme Court, have already ruled there must be a meaningful vote to approve the Brexit deal.

So as Fox and his fellow travelers have no chance of getting a bad/no deal  through the HoC that means a GE or a second binding referendum to approve the deal.

As I cannot image the Conservatives wanting to go to the country on a "yes we have screwed up Brexit and the deal will make you much poorer platform but please vote for us/it anyway" platform we will be having a second referendum. 

I suppose that as before they could ignore they could ignore legal advice and try to ram it through without a vote, but then Gina Miller will be back to the court asking for it to be ruled unconstitutional which if granted make the A50 invocation invalid - and like that series of Dallas the whole Brexit fiasco will just have been a bad dream.   

The Tories  have created a deadly Zugzwang for themselves.

Edited by Confusion of VIs

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
28 minutes ago, Confusion of VIs said:

The constitutional experts ,our Supreme Court, have already ruled there must be a meaningful vote to approve the Brexit deal.

So as Fox and his fellow travelers have no chance of getting a bad/no deal  through the HoC that means a GE or a second binding referendum to approve the deal.

As I cannot image the Conservatives wanting to go to the country on a "yes we have screwed up Brexit and the deal will make you much poorer platform but please vote for us/it anyway" platform we will be having a second referendum. 

I suppose that as before they could ignore they could ignore legal advice and try to ram it through without a vote, but then Gina Miller will be back to the court asking for it to be ruled unconstitutional which if granted make the A50 invocation invalid - and like that series of Dallas the whole Brexit fiasco will just have been a bad dream.   

The Tories  have created a deadly Zugzwang for themselves.

Yeah............right.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
9 hours ago, ExiledMatty said:

You only have to look at how Brits tend to blend in better when they emigrate to anglo countries. Compare that to the 'English' villages of France, the Spanish Brit 'costas'.

Even somewhere like Melbourne that still has ghettos where Italians, Greeks live (we are talking many generations too). No such British ghettos despite the million plus Brits who have moved out to Aus.

Sorry but on an individual level we have far more in common with people from anglo nations but that wasn't really my point.

My point was on a national level. It's been spelt out many times who are real friends are. The likes of Canada, Australia, the U.S., special relationships, first in line for trade deals, happy to lend negotiators etc etc.

I've never heard anything like this coming out of European leaders. We're now disliked even more due to Brexit. 

When it comes down to the vital issues of trust and security then look up 'five eyes'. Says it all to me.

The US isn't an 'Anglo' nation.  It's a continental federation and melting pot from around the world that happens to speak English for historical reasons.

The US systematically destroyed the UK as a world power so to talk of them as our 'true friends' is perverse.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
39 minutes ago, thecrashingisles said:

The US isn't an 'Anglo' nation.  It's a continental federation and melting pot from around the world that happens to speak English for historical reasons.

The US systematically destroyed the UK as a world power so to talk of them as our 'true friends' is perverse.

Would you like the UK to be a world power?

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
3 hours ago, Confusion of VIs said:

We you can but you just come across as unable to put comments in their context, maybe a bit of OCD going on. 

As almost anyone else would know when people say nothing is happening, they mean nothing useful or helpful to the UK's cause.   

No - I am doing exactly that. Putting them in context.

These debates need balance. So if someone is going to come out and say something completely wrong like 'NOTHING' is happening - its perfectly reasonable to expect another person to point that out.

I am pretty certain. In fact no - I am 100% certain. Not even 99.99% - that if I came out and stated everything around Brexit was going amazingly perfectly - I would have at least 4-5 people coming out within minutes to respond to that and put me straight. Of this there is no debate.

Its only the remain side that appear to get rather annoyed when their mass exaggerations are called out.........

 

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
25 minutes ago, ccc said:

No - I am doing exactly that. Putting them in context.

These debates need balance. So if someone is going to come out and say something completely wrong like 'NOTHING' is happening - its perfectly reasonable to expect another person to point that out.

I am pretty certain. In fact no - I am 100% certain. Not even 99.99% - that if I came out and stated everything around Brexit was going amazingly perfectly - I would have at least 4-5 people coming out within minutes to respond to that and put me straight. Of this there is no debate.

Its only the remain side that appear to get rather annoyed when their mass exaggerations are called out.........

 

I assume this post is a long winded way of you saying yes to my question re OCD.

I would be interested to hear about what is going well, this seems to be singularly lacking in the press coverage - even the Daily Express cannot find anything positive to report.  

 

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
12 minutes ago, Confusion of VIs said:

I assume this post is a long winded way of you saying yes to my question re OCD.

I would be interested to hear about what is going well, this seems to be singularly lacking in the press coverage - even the Daily Express cannot find anything positive to report.  

 

Like weaning an addict off heroin, leaving will be hard.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Create an account or sign in to comment

You need to be a member in order to leave a comment

Create an account

Sign up for a new account in our community. It's easy!

Register a new account

Sign in

Already have an account? Sign in here.

Sign In Now

  • Recently Browsing   0 members

    No registered users viewing this page.

  • Brexit   463 members have voted

    1. 1. Since voting on the UK leaving the EU, have you reconsidered your position?


      • Voted remain, still want to remain
      • Voted remain, now want to leave
      • Voted leave, now want to remain
      • Voted leave, still want to leave

    Please sign in or register to vote in this poll. View topic