kzb Posted January 29, 2017 Share Posted January 29, 2017 32 minutes ago, pig said: Apparently gold medal-winning Knights of the Realm can't travel to America these days. O how we laughed at 'political correctness gone mad'. Nothing to do with Brexit. Off topic, but this knight of the uk realm actually lives in the USA. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Richmond Posted January 29, 2017 Share Posted January 29, 2017 9 minutes ago, kzb said: I don't understand why trade deals and mass migration are linked. Please explain? Obviously we haven't got anything worthwhile trading. Only space on this Island. Or the thing we have that is worthwhile is experience and knowledge, so they want to send people here to learn the skills they can take home (that is how I read Indias poisition). Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
pig Posted January 29, 2017 Share Posted January 29, 2017 9 minutes ago, kzb said: Nothing to do with Brexit. Off topic, but this knight of the uk realm actually lives in the USA. Oh yes AND he and family ACTUALLY LIVE in the US ?. Apparently, Trump, May, US/UK relations border control, 'thick racist' voters, geo-political stability, Putin and even 'the turd in golden lift' are all strangely related to Brexit - so I wouldn't be so hasty in trying to dismiss yet another dead canary in the mine.. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dugsbody Posted January 29, 2017 Share Posted January 29, 2017 1 hour ago, kzb said: It's completely different. If we were trying to join the EU, then of course his comments might be unhelpful. As it was, as an MEP it was his duty to highlight EU shortcomings. By shortcomings, you mean allowing citizens of the union to move around where they want to? Because, as a "non elite" I don't understand much about trade deals or why the USA is going to be so much better for us than the EU. The only thing that seems to be different is that we can stop people called Pavel moving in next door. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
kzb Posted January 29, 2017 Share Posted January 29, 2017 39 minutes ago, pig said: Oh yes AND he and family ACTUALLY LIVE in the US ?. Apparently, Trump, May, US/UK relations border control, 'thick racist' voters, geo-political stability, Putin and even 'the turd in golden lift' are all strangely related to Brexit - so I wouldn't be so hasty in trying to dismiss yet another dead canary in the mine.. I don't understand this post. The Mo Farah issue is completely off topic. How is it related to Brexit in any shape or form? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
kzb Posted January 29, 2017 Share Posted January 29, 2017 8 minutes ago, dugsbody said: By shortcomings, you mean allowing citizens of the union to move around where they want to? Because, as a "non elite" I don't understand much about trade deals or why the USA is going to be so much better for us than the EU. The only thing that seems to be different is that we can stop people called Pavel moving in next door. I don't know where this came from. FoM may have been one of Farage's criticisms, but I think the most remembered ones were actually on the subject of democracy. We're not replacing membership of the EU with membership of the USA. There could be some small increases in trade, that is all that is mooted. Nothing else. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ChewingGrass Posted January 29, 2017 Share Posted January 29, 2017 Because he can run fast it makes him uniquely qualified to comment on such things and due to ticking numerous other boxes be widely quoted in the media. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
pig Posted January 29, 2017 Share Posted January 29, 2017 2 minutes ago, ChewingGrass said: Because he can run fast it makes him uniquely qualified to comment on such things and due to ticking numerous other boxes be widely quoted in the media. Well, i think it's mostly due to the extreme unlikelihood of him being a terrorist, being a respected leader in his field and yet still being targeted by the immigration monkeys. Though to be fair I'm not sure either his general affability or being celebrated by the UK/ internationally helps Trumps cause either. But hey knock yourself out with your 'peculiar' bitterness over his talent . Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ChewingGrass Posted January 29, 2017 Share Posted January 29, 2017 Its January, I've put my shoulder out, I'm bored and I find his quorn adverts extremely patronising especially as there is growing evidence that that the disgusting stuff affects male fertility. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
the gardener Posted January 29, 2017 Share Posted January 29, 2017 1 hour ago, ChewingGrass said: Its January, I've put my shoulder out, I'm bored and I find his quorn adverts extremely patronising especially as there is growing evidence that that the disgusting stuff affects male fertility. Hasn't he been under the spotlight recently for possible doping? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mikhail Liebenstein Posted January 29, 2017 Share Posted January 29, 2017 8 hours ago, pig said: Hyperbole aside it's actually a valid debating point - not that long ago Indias demands for easing immigration threatened to derail Mays state/business trip to India. It needs a bit of the style of the Daily Mail to get people talking. But the key point on India is the want free movement as you also point out. The fact that some find this annoying merely shows how complex things are becoming and how little it was thought about before the whole thing started. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ccc Posted January 29, 2017 Share Posted January 29, 2017 3 minutes ago, Mikhail Liebenstein said: It needs a bit of the style of the Daily Mail to get people talking. But the key point on India is the want free movement as you also point out. The fact that some find this annoying merely shows how complex things are becoming and how little it was thought about before the whole thing started. So that's a no to the bet then ? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
rollover Posted January 29, 2017 Share Posted January 29, 2017 (edited) Is Theresa May's Brexit Plan B an elaborate bluff? (Financial Times article Google) Edited January 29, 2017 by rollover Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
pig Posted January 29, 2017 Share Posted January 29, 2017 1 hour ago, ChewingGrass said: Its January, I've put my shoulder out, I'm bored and I find his quorn adverts extremely patronising especially as there is growing evidence that that the disgusting stuff affects male fertility. You must be a journo for the Daily Mail Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
One-percent Posted January 29, 2017 Share Posted January 29, 2017 1 hour ago, ChewingGrass said: Its January, I've put my shoulder out, I'm bored and I find his quorn adverts extremely patronising especially as there is growing evidence that that the disgusting stuff affects male fertility. According to a mate who worked for ici, they made it by the bucket load. They were a chemical manufacturer. That's all you need to know really Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mikhail Liebenstein Posted January 29, 2017 Share Posted January 29, 2017 41 minutes ago, ccc said: So that's a no to the bet then ? Not sure what the bet was, you may have mentioned sums of money, but there was no definition or rules. Make it something like "If in 10 years from now, either the U.K. hasn't signed a trade deal with India or if having signed a trade deal with India that the UK won't see increases in immigration from India then you might get some takers. Especially if you agreed to pay the winner £100k on £1k down, " So no trade deal CC pays out, a trade deal and an associated increase in Indian immigration and CC pays out. Trade deal and Indian immigration falls or stays flat and CC wins." Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mikhail Liebenstein Posted January 29, 2017 Share Posted January 29, 2017 3 minutes ago, Mikhail Liebenstein said: Not sure what the bet was, you may have mentioned sums of money, but there was no definition or rules. Make it something like "If in 10 years from now, either the U.K. hasn't signed a trade deal with India or if having signed a trade deal with India that the UK won't see increases in immigration from India then you might get some takers. Especially if you agreed to pay the winner £100k on £1k down, " So no trade deal CC pays out, a trade deal and an associated increase in Indian immigration and CC pays out. Trade deal and Indian immigration falls or stays flat and CC wins." Obviously an escrow Bit Coin account is needed, if CC pays £100k in today I might consider the bet. Shall I send you a Public Key? Send the £100k first. signed from Palace in Nigeria Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Confusion of VIs Posted January 29, 2017 Share Posted January 29, 2017 On 1/28/2017 at 6:40 PM, Sheeple Splinter said: It's that remainian, defeatist affliction again! Picture the EU as a Trojan Horse; Rich, deep trade enveloping the EU elite's ideology. Leaving the EU does not mean that trade will cease. The latest stats shaw USA as top export partner, DE as top import partner and the UK is a net importer to the EU. https://www.uktradeinfo.com/Statistics/OverseasTradeStatistics/Pages/EU_and_Non-EU_Data.aspx Would you be disappointed if European countries continue to trade with the UK? As for other trade deals, time will tell... From my perspective it is the leavers that have the defeatist attitude, thinking we couldn't make the EU work so best give up. Of course not, and probably +80% of trade in goods will continue even in the longer term. The problem for the UK is the trade in services is likely to be much more heavily affected and this is the area that will not be made up by other trade deals in the foreseeable future. When you say time will tell, would you care to put a range on that, 10 years, 20 years, perhaps 50 years? After all on the day we leave the EU, unless we have come to some sort of soft Brexit deal we will lose our trade deal with the EU and 38 other states who have trade deals with the EU. What is sure is that any UK lawyers with experience of trade negotiations will be set up for life. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Confusion of VIs Posted January 29, 2017 Share Posted January 29, 2017 6 hours ago, kzb said: I don't understand why trade deals and mass migration are linked. Please explain? Because the people we want to do trade deals with (China and India) are saying they expect a more liberal visa regime including free movement of labor as part of the package. Whether this would lead to what could reasonably be described as mass migration is anybody's guess, but presumably the non EU immigration will go up significantly. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sheeple Splinter Posted January 29, 2017 Share Posted January 29, 2017 14 hours ago, rollover said: Turkey has high expectation and love Brexiters especially Boris Johnson: he urges EU to go soft on Turkey's plan to reintroduce the death penalty, Britain will help Turkey in any way join EU - but during the EU referendum Mr Johnson warned that the accession of Turkey would give millions of migrants the right to live and work in the UK, he said that he wants to build a "jumbo free trade deal" with Turkey. Ex-Ukip leader Nigel Farage wrote on Twitter: “One of the reasons the UK voted to leave the EU was the prospect of Turkey joining. “What on earth is Boris Johnson playing at?” But what does PM promised? Go soft on Turkey, jumbo free trade deal with visions of 75 million Turks exploiting free movement rules to head to the UK. Leaving aside the EU's dalliances with Turkey, do you have a link to TM's promises on Turkey? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sheeple Splinter Posted January 29, 2017 Share Posted January 29, 2017 15 hours ago, Richmond said: Maybe a silver lining for the establishment over Brexit is it makes it harder for Scotland to go it alone than it would have done within the EU. Once out of the EU the rest of the U.K. can 'punish' Scotland for leaving, whereas within the EU it would be business as usual. Benefits of being in the club and all that. Judging by the polls, taken with a pinch of salt naturally, it looks like the Scots don't need any more of the establishment shenanigans. Perish the thought of 'punishing' any referendum decision. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
the gardener Posted January 29, 2017 Share Posted January 29, 2017 12 minutes ago, Confusion of VIs said: Because the people we want to do trade deals with (China and India) are saying they expect a more liberal visa regime including free movement of labor as part of the package. Whether this would lead to what could reasonably be described as mass migration is anybody's guess, but presumably the non EU immigration will go up significantly. Do you do everything someone asks you? Asking for the moon on a stick doesn't mean you get it. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sheeple Splinter Posted January 29, 2017 Share Posted January 29, 2017 12 hours ago, Mikhail Liebenstein said: These manoeuvres will be lining us up to accept more Syrian refugees. The US is now blocking entry and the EU with Turkey onboard will provide a direct route to Calais and from there it's a short hop across the channel. Brexit will greatly boost refugee immigration from Middle East, and if we get a trade deal with India we could have over a Billion people able to freely come to the UK. In the plus side Brexit should be great for ethnic diversity and keeping the low wage economy fed with cheap labour. You forgot the ? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Confusion of VIs Posted January 30, 2017 Share Posted January 30, 2017 46 minutes ago, the gardener said: Do you do everything someone asks you? Asking for the moon on a stick doesn't mean you get it. Quite. However, as to the best of my knowledge every country we have recently approached about trade deals China, India and Australia have linked trade with greater freedom of movement, thinking we can become a more global free trading nation while limiting migration is looking increasingly implausible. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sheeple Splinter Posted January 30, 2017 Share Posted January 30, 2017 1 hour ago, Confusion of VIs said: From my perspective it is the leavers that have the defeatist attitude, thinking we couldn't make the EU work so best give up. Of course not, and probably +80% of trade in goods will continue even in the longer term. The problem for the UK is the trade in services is likely to be much more heavily affected and this is the area that will not be made up by other trade deals in the foreseeable future. When you say time will tell, would you care to put a range on that, 10 years, 20 years, perhaps 50 years? After all on the day we leave the EU, unless we have come to some sort of soft Brexit deal we will lose our trade deal with the EU and 38 other states who have trade deals with the EU. What is sure is that any UK lawyers with experience of trade negotiations will be set up for life. Knowing we couldn't make the EU work. It's almost the anniversary of Cameron's cracking EU deal announcement. Time scale: We will be trading with european countries and the RoW the day after we leave the EU. Lawyers and trade negotiators: not if we attract professionals from the RoW... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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