GreenDevil

Brexit What Happens Next Thread ---multiple merged threads.

Recommended Posts

2 hours ago, spyguy said:

Again, I voted remain.

Id treat tresury estimates for  10-15 years in the future as total BS. Really not worth the effort trying to calculate and pay for someone.

Having just finished "The Black Swan", I heartily agree. Completely pointless.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
1 minute ago, Futuroid said:

The only thing funnier will be look on the faces of the voters of Burnley and Sunderland when they meet their new replacements from India and get their 3 days notice, then find out that the benefits system was mothballed just after the NHS was sold off!

I think when that particular penny sinks in, we'll have even more whining from them than we do currently.  I give you Grimsby - No, we want to leave, now.  Sorry, what do you mean it will cost most of us our jobs?  OK, we want YOU to leave now, whilst we get a transition deal and special arrangement with the EU.

No, sorry, but I have to start giggling at that, and Cornwall getting all patriotic, until they've woken up to rotting crops in the fields and a shortfall in labour, let alone the decimation of their own fishing fleets.

As I said, be careful what you wish for...

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
8 minutes ago, Futuroid said:

It was all so easy, all we had to do is leave the EU. But wait! Now we are hearing from prominent Brexit supporters that there are a few additional steps required before the unicorns and rainbows arrive.

It's simple, all we need to do is cut regulation, cut corporation tax to zero and then the magic happens...

http://www.huffingtonpost.co.uk/entry/sir-james-dyson-brexit_uk_5a08336fe4b01d21c83eff64

https://www.theguardian.com/politics/2017/nov/14/jacob-rees-mogg-hard-brexit-would-boost-uk-by-135bn-over-5-years

It it talks like a neoliberal, if it cuts regulations like a neoliberal and if it quacks like a neoliberal, then it is a neoliberal. 

And some posters on here blame the EU and claim that it is the source of neoliberal ideas in the UK. :lol:

The only thing funnier will be look on the faces of the voters of Burnley and Sunderland when they meet their new replacements from India and get their 3 days notice, then find out that the benefits system was mothballed just after the NHS was sold off!

Well of course, we'll be the centre of no regulation, private healthcare and tax avoidance, meanwhile in the EU

http://www.independent.co.uk/news/uk/politics/paradise-papers-eu-tax-avoidance-vampires-pierre-moscovici-a8053926.html#gallery

Have not heard any Tory even mention them in the last few days. Strange that. Maybe we should dare to ask an expert, Rees-Mogg?

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
24 minutes ago, IMHAL said:

Significantly worse off depends on the amount of disposable income you have. If you are on the bread line then any increase of prices will have a significant and deliterious effect. The more disposable income you have the less significant the effect will be.

You think Brexit is good and fine therefore I suppose you have success criteria - what are they?

Also, lets say for arguements sake that Brexit does not go well - what would be the keys things that define it as a failure for you?

Success is out of the EU without being significantly worse off. I wasn't talking about significant to me individually but across the entire country.

CofVI's 1-2% sounds negligable. How far back do you go to a point where the country that less well off than it is now? Don't recall life being awful then. 2% growth gets people handwringing about it being hardly any, but a drop by the equivalent amount (OK that's the other way around, a 2% fall isn't the same absolute number difference as a 2% rise, but it's not that different) is a disaster? Or is it falling 2% year on year forever? That would be bad, but implausible.

Edited by Riedquat

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
1 hour ago, Riedquat said:

Success is out of the EU without being significantly worse off. I wasn't talking about significant to me individually but across the entire country.

CofVI's 1-2% sounds negligable. How far back do you go to a point where the country that less well off than it is now? Don't recall life being awful then. 2% growth gets people handwringing about it being hardly any, but a drop by the equivalent amount (OK that's the other way around, a 2% fall isn't the same absolute number difference as a 2% rise, but it's not that different) is a disaster? Or is it falling 2% year on year forever? That would be bad, but implausible.

The first thing that happened after we joined the EEC in 1973 was GDP contracted by 4%. 

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
1 minute ago, kzb said:

The first thing that happened after we joined the EEC in 1973 was GDP contracted by 4%. 

Oh will you just piss off with this shite kdb, you're just using this as a stick to beat the EEC with when the truth is we were shagged in 1972, as I have proven many times you've brought this nonsense up.

I wish you'd give this shit up as it makes you look stupid.  If that's the look you wish to portray, then please carry on.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
1 hour ago, kzb said:

The first thing that happened after we joined the EEC in 1973 was GDP contracted by 4%. 

So GDP should expand by 4% in 2019 then!

It's Brexinomics / Numberwang.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
6 hours ago, Errol said:

I'd be more worried about you, to be honest. Anyone who thinks that Farage is Russia's 'point man' is clearly misguided in the extreme.

He's been anti-EU since at least the mid-1980s from public records, so it would be some stretch to say his entire UKIP/Brexit/anti-EU stance was engineered by Russia. 

This nonsense is just too funny. And luckily everyone else is seeing it as joke as well ('RUSSIANS!!!!!').

Are you a ‘point man’ for Russia ?

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
3 hours ago, Futuroid said:

And some posters on here blame the EU and claim that it is the source of neoliberal ideas in the UK. :lol:

Given that the UK invented Limited Liability Companies - the origin of neoliberalism - it would be... interesting....  if anyone could claim that the EU is the source of neoliberal ideas in the UK.

Which posters/posts are you referring to?

Link please.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
8 minutes ago, HairyOb1 said:

I've just found the first image of an early adopter of 'hard brexit'.

Worrying which of these folk it could be.  

 

DOnMsQ6WkAAlkFq.jpg-large.jpeg

Don't you have anything more worthwhile to do?

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
3 minutes ago, highYield said:

Given that the UK invented Limited Liability Companies - the origin of neoliberalism - it would be... interesting....  if anyone could claim that the EU is the source of neoliberal ideas in the UK.

Which posters/posts are you referring to?

Link please.

Not exactly HY

http://evonomics.com/economic-ideas-change-the-world-keynes-hayek-friedman-reagan/

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
2 minutes ago, highYield said:

Don't you have anything more worthwhile to do?

Not at the moment, you?

Quote

Honda UK telling MPs it imports 2 million components a day from Europe on 350 trucks and holds 1 hours worth of stock. It would take 18 months to put customs admin in place but every 15 minutes of delay would cost £850,000 a hour. That's not including WTO tariffs of 10% and 4.5% and if there's a divergence in regulatory standards, Honda UK cites research showing cost of converting a EU car to match US standards is equivalent to another 26% tariff increase. 40% of extra workers hired to build new Civic at Swindon were EU workers, 30% at Bracknell HQ.

Quote

Aston Martin Chief says no-deal Brexit would be "semi-catastophic" and would mean suspending production.

 

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
2 hours ago, kzb said:

The first thing that happened after we joined the EEC in 1973 was GDP contracted by 4%. 

Yes, there was an impact caused by the economic dislocation of joining the EEC. Many commentators think it took 10+ years before the benefits of joining paid off and we recovered the lost ground.

And that was caused by us leaving behind some pretty limited trade deals in return for a much bigger and deeper one.

Now we are going to have the economic dislocation of leaving the words biggest and deepest trade deal (single market) plus the other 60 or so deals we access by being members of the SM - in return for almost nothing.   

Not going to be pretty is it ?

 

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
14 minutes ago, HairyOb1 said:

Not at the moment, you?

Touché :P

Not trying to win some point here, but you seem to be taking this debate a little personally - does our chat here on a fairly obscure corner of the web really warrant as much time, passion and effort as we all put in?

Whatever we say here doesn't change much - or does it?

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
29 minutes ago, jonb2 said:

I was asking Futuroid for a link to the source of the idea that the EU is the source of neoliberal ideas in the UK - I'm genuinely interested in where that came from.

3 hours ago, Futuroid said:

And some posters on here blame the EU and claim that it is the source of neoliberal ideas in the UK. :lol:

 

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
45 minutes ago, jonb2 said:

Sorry, you've lost me here.

Limited Liability companies have a simple UK origin. In the old days, if a moneyman financed a ship to go and explore for booty, and it sunk or never returned, then the backer was liable to provide for the widows and orphans of the lost sailors. Unlimited liability. A bit like a Lloyds name.

So, we, the UK, invented Limited Liability companies. The moneymen formed a Ltd company, put the money for the ship into the company, which owned the ship and employed the sailors. Ship lost? Ltd company folded. Shares go to 0 pence, but shareholders not liable for the sailors. Their liability is limited to their investment.

Limited liability companies enabled - indeed are - our pirates, our history. Capitalism is our, the UK's, creation.

I'd argue that Neoliberalism is just the latest name for our capitalism - our limited liability companies - our pirates that made us Great Britain.

Edited by highYield

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Did PM shot herself in the foot by stating Russia has been meddling in UK election?

If it will be proved that Russia's troll army swings the Brexit vote, what will she do?

Edited by rollover

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
6 minutes ago, rollover said:

Did PM shot herself in the foot by stating Russia has been meddling in UK election?

If it will be proved that Russia's troll army swings the Brexit vote, what will she do?

Something.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
51 minutes ago, highYield said:

I was asking Futuroid for a link to the source of the idea that the EU is the source of neoliberal ideas in the UK - I'm genuinely interested in where that came from

Really? Actually, I thought you were one of the posters who said that you voted out of the EU because it was too neoliberal. Maybe I'm mistaken but I think it's a common sentiment on here anyway.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
24 minutes ago, dugsbody said:

Really? Actually, I thought you were one of the posters who said that you voted out of the EU because it was too neoliberal. Maybe I'm mistaken but I think it's a common sentiment on here anyway.

Don't think i'd have said that - link would be good, but this thread is soooooo long :)

My point was that perhaps neoliberalism is an inflection point of society vs. Ltd liability companies (inc. Public limited liability companies). Without a representative government incorporating external costs, could the UK's invention of limited liability companies have had any other endpoint other than what we call neoliberalism?

Edited by highYield
end point => inflection

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
5 hours ago, Riedquat said:

Success is out of the EU without being significantly worse off. I wasn't talking about significant to me individually but across the entire country.

CofVI's 1-2% sounds negligable. How far back do you go to a point where the country that less well off than it is now? Don't recall life being awful then. 2% growth gets people handwringing about it being hardly any, but a drop by the equivalent amount (OK that's the other way around, a 2% fall isn't the same absolute number difference as a 2% rise, but it's not that different) is a disaster? Or is it falling 2% year on year forever? That would be bad, but implausible.

You asked what would be a significant fall and 1-2% definitely would not be negligible to a chancellor who needs more not less growth to balance the books and is already having to work with some pretty bleak predictions from the OBR. 

I would have thought your biggest concern would be the actions that the likes of Mogg would take to try and compensate for the loss of EU trade.  A massive investment in infrastructure mainly roads and housebuilding fueled by relaxation of planning rules is definitely on the cards    

 

 

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Create an account or sign in to comment

You need to be a member in order to leave a comment

Create an account

Sign up for a new account in our community. It's easy!

Register a new account

Sign in

Already have an account? Sign in here.

Sign In Now

  • Recently Browsing   0 members

    No registered users viewing this page.

  • Pay Day Loans   194 members have voted

    1. 1. Do you believe the government should intervene in the payday loan market?


      • The market should be free to regulate itself.
      • The government should impose maximum interest rates.
      • The government should ban payday loans.

    Please sign in or register to vote in this poll. View topic