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Btl Scum Regrouping And On The Offensive. -- Merged


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HOLA441
19 hours ago, Dyson Fury said:

So this chap Lyndon (who turns out to be a letting agent as well as a highly leveraged BTL landlord - ouch!) pens a reply to the Housing Minister, which rambles on for over 1400 words. Then Ros immediately congratulates Lyndon that his reply is "very cogently argued".  You couldn't make these characters up.

Been doing a bit of digging, and it seems Lyndon's letting agency charges a £270 application fee for his letting agency business. 

http://l-a-lettings.co.uk/

"I absolutely acknowledge that there are many rogue agents who in areas of extremely high demand for property, charge extortionate fees. My two daughters both rent in London and believe me I know! However, the moderate fees that most agents charge are realistic and are necessary to enable the agent to provide a good 24 hour service."

OK, since when is £270 a 'moderate fee' for doing a £3 credit check and printing a template contract? I'd love to see a justified breakdown for that cost. And also, why is it the tenants job to pay for a 24-hour service?! If the letting agent were not involved, the *landlord* would be having to make themselves contactable 24 hours a day for emergencies, therefore the costs of the 24 hour 'service' should be born by the *landlord*, not the tenant, as it is the landlord who benefits. 

Letting agents are totally getting what they deserve and I have absolutely zero sympathy. If they had indeed kept to moderate fees, there would be no ban. I do not know of a single letting agent who charges anything even close to a moderate fee. Mine couldn't even be bothered to come round and do an inventory for the £200 I paid, which caused a dispute when I left. Fortunately, I'd taken some pics when I moved in and got my money back thanks to DPS... 

Will be funny watching these guys and landlords turning on each other when tenant fees are banned...

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HOLA442
11 hours ago, mrtickle said:
 

They say a 4 phase but it is actually 3 years of phase, as the 4th year is 100%. More lies or as they call it in politics spin…
1 year 75%
2nd year 50%
3rd year 25%

That’s it from then on it’s 100% you don’t get the 4th year. The full inpact is conducted in 3 years,

 

LOL. But it's almost 6 years, Pauly darling.

1st (almost) Year - Summer Budget 2015 until April 2016. What did you spend that year doing? Not making plans to adjust to the new rules?

2nd year - April 2016 - April 2017. What did you spend that year doing? Wearing orange T-shirts?

3rd year - April 2017 - April 2018. 75%/25%. Bill doesn't land until 2019.

4th year - April 2018 - April 2019. 50%/50% . Bill doesn't land until 2020.

5th year - April 2019 - April 2020. 25%/75% . Bill doesn't land until 2021.

6th year - April 2020 - April 2021. The first year of full implementation of the new rules. Bill doesn't land until 2022.

Summer Budget 2015 -> 2021 = five and a half years.

More than enough time to "plan for the new rules", I think. 

ps. I'm keen to be corrected on those dates if they are wrong.

 

 

 

You are missing an important date

April 2017 - your total income is no longer salary + net rental income (after all costs including interest) but is now salary + rental income before interest. There is than an allowance for interest payments which is going to be reduced every year until at least 2020.

That means that your income may increase above the level where different things start impacting you....

1) £32,000 or so you can no longer claim working tax credits - there are links to that elsewhere on this thread

2) £50,000 start losing child benefit

3) £100,000 start losing your personal allowance

And that is also going to really hurt a lot of people....

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HOLA443

Can't edit so a second post

2 minutes ago, monkeyprojects said:

 

You are missing an important date

April 2017 - your total income is no longer salary + net rental income (after all costs including interest) but is now salary + rental income before interest. There is than an allowance for interest payments which is going to be reduced every year until at least 2020.

That means that your income is now going to appear to be £x,000s more than it used to be and will increase well above the level it was above hitting other allowances:-

1) £32,000 or so you can no longer claim working tax credits - there are links to that elsewhere on this thread

2) £50,000 start losing child benefit

3) £100,000 start losing your personal allowance

And that is also going to really hurt a lot of people....

And its not difficult for the impact to be large: 2 houses at £1000 a month with mortgages of £700 a month and suddenly your income is £16,800 greater than it was before (2x£700x12)..

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HOLA444
9 hours ago, monkeyprojects said:

 

You are missing an important date

April 2017 - your total income is no longer salary + net rental income (after all costs including interest) but is now salary + rental income before interest. There is than an allowance for interest payments which is going to be reduced every year until at least 2020.

That means that your income may increase above the level where different things start impacting you....

1) £32,000 or so you can no longer claim working tax credits - there are links to that elsewhere on this thread

2) £50,000 start losing child benefit

3) £100,000 start losing your personal allowance

And that is also going to really hurt a lot of people....

Thanks. Great first post, welcome to the forum!

The only thing I'd dispute is that it's going to really hurt a lot of landlords. Calling them "people" is excessively kind IMHO :)

So from 6th April, which is just 40 short days away, (2) and (3) will kick in. (1) is disgraceful anyway, that a BTL landlord has dodged the tax system so systematically as to be claiming working tax credits intended for poor workers

However, I doubt they'll be rushing to the local benefits office to get their records corrected.

 

Edited by mrtickle
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HOLA445
27 minutes ago, mrtickle said:

Thanks. The only thing I'd dispute is that it's going to really hurt a lot of landlords. Calling them "people" is excessively kind IMHO :)

So from 6th April, which is just 40 short days away, (2) and (3) will kick in. (1) is disgraceful anyway, that a BTL landlord has dodged the tax system so systematically as to be claiming working tax credits intended for poor workers

However, I doubt they'll be rushing to the local benefits office to get their records corrected.

 

Tax credits might change automatically in April. Anyone know if they ask for details of rental income on the current forms? I can only find the 2011 form (on a Polish website) and there is only an income from other sources section.

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HOLA446
47 minutes ago, This time said:

Tax credits might change automatically in April. Anyone know if they ask for details of rental income on the current forms? I can only find the 2011 form (on a Polish website) and there is only an income from other sources section.

Doesn't matter I reckon, HMRC will tie it up with other records

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HOLA447

NLA update on their lobbying...

https://nlauk.wordpress.com/2017/02/23/lobbying-update-a-fortnight-in-the-life/?utm_campaign=8026588_focus-members-2017.02.24&utm_medium=email&utm_source=National Landlords Association&dm_i=11G,4S1CS,CADIQD,HYXEX,1

'Ministers have been clear that they are yet to be convinced by our arguments'

As a result they've commissioned a study to tell them what they want to hear.

 

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HOLA448
13 hours ago, Si1 said:

Doesn't matter I reckon, HMRC will tie it up with other records

It doesn't really matter if a landlord on tax credits claims this year by misrepresenting their income with the incorrect rental income (i.e. after costs rather than before costs). They will receive the money this you but will need to repay it next year when they fill in their tax return....

Your typical high leverage landlord is now on the fast track to bankruptcy unless they have already sold.... And good riddence to the lot of them..

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HOLA449
1 hour ago, Lavalas said:

NLA update on their lobbying...

https://nlauk.wordpress.com/2017/02/23/lobbying-update-a-fortnight-in-the-life/?utm_campaign=8026588_focus-members-2017.02.24&utm_medium=email&utm_source=National Landlords Association&dm_i=11G,4S1CS,CADIQD,HYXEX,1

'Ministers have been clear that they are yet to be convinced by our arguments'

As a result they've commissioned a study to tell them what they want to hear.

 

Commissioning a study? Pah. What they really need is to write a really LONG letter. I'm not taking the sort of pathetic 86 page half hearted cereal box soundbites roz has been spitting out weekly, I'm talking the sort of letter that only comes in HARDBACK. If these plucky parasites want to be taken seriously as the business people no one but themselves believe they are, they need to realise that less is less and more is more.  If we aren't responding to your letters in the way we should it's because your letters are too LIGHTWEIGHT. Think encyclopedia not novel. Think terrabyte not megabyte. Overwhelm the world with your words. It's the only way we will listen.

Alternatively, file for bankruptcy now.

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HOLA4410
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HOLA4411

I like that. It really works.

Hey Busta, how's the petition going?

'Tenants, most landlords and the all of the general public have been clear that they are yet to be convinced by our arguments'.

Hey Cooper, how's the Judicial Review going?

'Judges have been clear that they are yet to be convinced by our arguments'.

Hey Steve, how's the lobbying going?

'Ministers have been clear that they are yet to be convinced by our arguments'.

Rozza! How's that report working out for you...

 

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HOLA4412
1 hour ago, Lavalas said:

I like that. It really works.

Hey Busta, how's the petition going?

'Tenants, most landlords and the all of the general public have been clear that they are yet to be convinced by our arguments'.

Hey Cooper, how's the Judicial Review going?

'Judges have been clear that they are yet to be convinced by our arguments'.

Hey Steve, how's the lobbying going?

'Ministers have been clear that they are yet to be convinced by our arguments'.

Rozza! How's that report working out for you...

 

The odd one out being Rozza would answer via the medium of the library. The whole library.

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HOLA4413

Looks like the Dullard is finally losing the plot. Starting to feel a bit sorry for him if I'm honest:

https://www.property118.com/my-correspondence-showing-complete-ministerial-lack-of-understanding/94953/comment-page-3/#comment-87970

Whatever the increase is irrelevant Barry, because it is unaffordable by either benefit tenants, landlords or any other tenant.

The tax is not going to be found by any landlord, the tenants pay for everything that I do.

Is that not the case in your business?

Just 1/4% rate rise is horrendous and the further north or south you go from Hadrians Wall the worse it gets.

Whether it’s worth even doing this business anymore is in doubt, the banks are now issuing warning letters to landlords and it’s not even a fair tax, so don’t worry about the figures.

You’ve tried being logical – it doesn’t work does it?

it’s time to stir emotions in your tenants and tell them that it’s because the Tory government hates poor people and renters.

They intend to tax them through the landowners or landlords with a new Tenant Tax and blame me for it, well they can f*** off.

The message is,

Theresa May, you are about to lose the next election as you give any opposition party total credibility by not killing this stone dead.

They won’t be sidelined by Brexit, every year this is going to get worse and when the interest rates increase blood will be spilt on the streets.

Millions will be made homeless unless they can afford the new tax bills coming via their landlords.

And quite frankly, if you chance your political arm with this stupidity, you deserve everything that you get.

My letters to tenants say that a Tory Government hates tenants and sick people so much that they have introduced swingeing tenant tax increases and NHS cuts, so that their rich donators can put landlords and the NHS out to the big companies, that can’t compete with us or the NHS at the moment

Like watching a car crash in slow motion. The penny is starting to drop (I suppose, continuing the car crash analogy, they are just realising that the brakes don't work and are careering towards the hairpin bend...).

I imagine one would have to be very careful in referring to it as a "tenant tax" in letters to tenants. My understanding was that government are the only ones who can impose a "tax" on people. Some of the letters being discussed on P118 talked about sending an itemised rent increase letter, specifying the percentage of "Tenant tax" being charged to tenants. Seems a little dodgy, although I'm not sure exactly which law it'd be breaking...

As for the Tories losing the next election, you only have to look at the Copeland result to see that nobody cares about landlords paying more tax...

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HOLA4414
11 hours ago, Lavalas said:

NLA update on their lobbying...

https://nlauk.wordpress.com/2017/02/23/lobbying-update-a-fortnight-in-the-life/?utm_campaign=8026588_focus-members-2017.02.24&utm_medium=email&utm_source=National Landlords Association&dm_i=11G,4S1CS,CADIQD,HYXEX,1

'Ministers have been clear that they are yet to be convinced by our arguments'

As a result they've commissioned a study to tell them what they want to hear.

 

Works both ways... 

Quote

The Budget is (at time of writing) now just 13 days away.  We continue to work on the reversal of Section 24 whilst at the same time helping our members with its impact by lobbying Ministers on measures to ease the effects of this vicious and barbaric assault on members livelihoods and savings.

Ministers have been clear that they are yet to be convinced by our arguments

What they tell themselves and want others to hear about.... emo.

So much excess by a BTL own-reality VI, not seeing a wider reality.

Also you're still getting 20%, not available to most other investors.  You made your choices.  BTL has enjoyed amazing advantages for tax-treatment, and for individuals to structure their financial affairs, as well as position for outbidding FTBs, for way too many years.

ft yesterday

Quote

HMRC successfully argued that Eclipse 35 never carried on a trade — a pre-requisite for investors to qualify for tax reliefs —
https://www.ft.com/content/56733656-fa99-11e6-9516-2d969e0d3b65

 

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HOLA4415
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HOLA4416

 

3 hours ago, oatbake said:

Looks like the Dullard is finally losing the plot. Starting to feel a bit sorry for him if I'm honest:

https://www.property118.com/my-correspondence-showing-complete-ministerial-lack-of-understanding/94953/comment-page-3/#comment-87970

It gets even better later on.  Almost makes me think that he is just exaggerating his opinions a little to get his moment of fame on the HPC website.  But he probably is actually just cracking up. 

  • Reply to the comment left by “Barry Fitzpatrick” at “26/02/2017 – 18:02“:
  • Barry, I don’t pay for a single tax or invoice, my tenants do.
    I spend their money one way or another.

    Every single penny I spend comes from them.
    Every holiday, chocolate bar, Netflix subscription, wife’s hairdo, sons birthday gifts and tins of pedigree chum for the Labrador.

    I don’t pay for a single thing that the moronic political fools dream up.

    My point is to get landlords to hammer this home.

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HOLA4417
3 hours ago, oatbake said:

Like watching a car crash in slow motion. The penny is starting to drop (I suppose, continuing the car crash analogy, they are just realising that the brakes don't work and are careering towards the hairpin bend...).

I imagine one would have to be very careful in referring to it as a "tenant tax" in letters to tenants. My understanding was that government are the only ones who can impose a "tax" on people. Some of the letters being discussed on P118 talked about sending an itemised rent increase letter, specifying the percentage of "Tenant tax" being charged to tenants. Seems a little dodgy, although I'm not sure exactly which law it'd be breaking...

As for the Tories losing the next election, you only have to look at the Copeland result to see that nobody cares about landlords paying more tax...

Certainly a very colourful story.

Meanwhile back in the real world the council tell the Dullard's tenants to stay where they are till they are evicted (this is what already happens). The Dullard will go bankrupt because. He will lack the funds to arrange evictions so the arrears will pile up until his lenders appoint an LPA receiver (this is what already happens) at which point the arrears will continue to accrue as the lender arranges the eviction. The tenants are evicted later (win for the tenants) and by somebody else (a point about which they care not at all).

Blood in the streets? Nope.

Bankrupt overleveraged tw@ts? Yup.

Wisdom of leveraging up to your eyeballs on crappy houses letting at market clearing rates?

giphy.gif

 

Edited by Bland Unsight
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HOLA4418
4 minutes ago, Bear Hug said:

 

It gets even better later on.  Almost makes me think that he is just exaggerating his opinions a little to get his moment of fame on the HPC website.  But he probably is actually just cracking up. 

  • Reply to the comment left by “Barry Fitzpatrick” at “26/02/2017 – 18:02“:
  • Barry, I don’t pay for a single tax or invoice, my tenants do.
    I spend their money one way or another.

    Every single penny I spend comes from them.
    Every holiday, chocolate bar, Netflix subscription, wife’s hairdo, sons birthday gifts and tins of pedigree chum for the Labrador.

    I don’t pay for a single thing that the moronic political fools dream up.

    My point is to get landlords to hammer this home.

Someone needs to tweet this, just in case there are still people that think landlords are actually humans.

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HOLA4419
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HOLA4420
1 hour ago, CunningPlan said:
Quote

 

I don’t pay for a single tax or invoice, my tenants do.
I spend their money one way or another.

Every single penny I spend comes from them.
Every holiday, chocolate bar, Netflix subscription, wife’s hairdo, sons birthday gifts and tins of pedigree chum for the Labrador.

I don’t pay for a single thing that the moronic political fools dream up.

The BTL LLs' turn to pay £.  And pay £.  And pay £.

Johnny (Karate Kid): "You couldn't leave well enough alone... No, you had to push it. Well, now you're gonna pay!"

Edited by Venger
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HOLA4421
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HOLA4422
8 hours ago, Bear Hug said:

 

It gets even better later on.  Almost makes me think that he is just exaggerating his opinions a little to get his moment of fame on the HPC website.  But he probably is actually just cracking up. 

  • Reply to the comment left by “Barry Fitzpatrick” at “26/02/2017 – 18:02“:
  • Barry, I don’t pay for a single tax or invoice, my tenants do.
    I spend their money one way or another.

    Every single penny I spend comes from them.
    Every holiday, chocolate bar, Netflix subscription, wife’s hairdo, sons birthday gifts and tins of pedigree chum for the Labrador.

    I don’t pay for a single thing that the moronic political fools dream up.

    My point is to get landlords to hammer this home.

Just like my cleaner then, since I pay her wages.

Everybody's money comes from someone else, only landlords attribute this to their own magical powers.

 

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HOLA4423
15 minutes ago, BuyToLeech said:

Just like my cleaner then, since I pay her wages.

Everybody's money comes from someone else, only landlords attribute this to their own magical powers.

 

I always frustrates me how a simple client-provider relationship is completely distorted when it comes to renting a property.  

In everything else, if you pay money, you get a service.  In rental, you pay money but landlords (and estate agents) still often behave like they are doing you a favour.

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HOLA4424
18 hours ago, oatbake said:

 

Looks like the Dullard is finally losing the plot. Starting to feel a bit sorry for him if I'm honest:

https://www.property118.com/my-correspondence-showing-complete-ministerial-lack-of-understanding/94953/comment-page-3/#comment-87970

Whatever the increase is irrelevant Barry, because it is unaffordable by either benefit tenants, landlords or any other tenant.

The tax is not going to be found by any landlord, the tenants pay for everything that I do.

Is that not the case in your business?

Just 1/4% rate rise is horrendous and the further north or south you go from Hadrians Wall the worse it gets.

Whether it’s worth even doing this business anymore is in doubt, the banks are now issuing warning letters to landlords and it’s not even a fair tax, so don’t worry about the figures.

You’ve tried being logical – it doesn’t work does it?

it’s time to stir emotions in your tenants and tell them that it’s because the Tory government hates poor people and renters.

They intend to tax them through the landowners or landlords with a new Tenant Tax and blame me for it, well they can f*** off.

The message is,

Theresa May, you are about to lose the next election as you give any opposition party total credibility by not killing this stone dead.

They won’t be sidelined by Brexit, every year this is going to get worse and when the interest rates increase blood will be spilt on the streets.

Millions will be made homeless unless they can afford the new tax bills coming via their landlords.

And quite frankly, if you chance your political arm with this stupidity, you deserve everything that you get.

My letters to tenants say that a Tory Government hates tenants and sick people so much that they have introduced swingeing tenant tax increases and NHS cuts, so that their rich donators can put landlords and the NHS out to the big companies, that can’t compete with us or the NHS at the moment

 

If you had to choose one member of P118 to comically misspell "swingeing" and accidentally refer to a swinging tenant tax, your money would have been on Gary, wouldn't it? And then he goes and lets us down by spelling it correctly.

I draw comfort from the suspicion that he actually meant to write swinging, like a pair of soiled underpants from a light fitting, but spelled it wrongly anyway.

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HOLA4425

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