leafsta Posted January 16, 2013 Share Posted January 16, 2013 Been reading through this thread for the last few days and have pointed a few people I know (Non-hpcers) to the thread, as I believe it will help them see the light... All have commented how much sense many of the comments make Anyway, it has given me an idea (not sure if it has already been done). Whenever I try to have a conversation about why I think house prices will fall, and why raising house prices are not a good thing, I always hold my own for so long until it feels as though I begin rambling. I think what we need to devise is a document of some sort that all us hpcers can print out and keep with us (if we must) to simply present to whoever we are having a house prince conversation discussion with. This document will list all the many reasons we discuss daily which will in turn hopefully sway the minds of Mr Joe Bloggs. Opinions? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
cybernoid Posted January 16, 2013 Share Posted January 16, 2013 I think what we need to devise is a document of some sort that all us hpcers can print out and keep with us (if we must) to simply present to whoever we are having a house prince conversation discussion with. This document will list all the many reasons we discuss daily which will in turn hopefully sway the minds of Mr Joe Bloggs. Opinions? Pretty crazy. What does it matter what people think, the market falls because the free money isnt available anymore. People on this site were trying to tell people what was coming during the bubble, myself included, but they paid no attention. I just got memorised cliches in response, no thinking went on at all. I knew several who bought new build 2 bed flats right at the peak and simple were incapable of listening to reason. The prices are determined by the lending, not sentiment, if the money was up for grabs again they'd all be queueing up to bankrupt themselves all over again. They'd just think you were nuts for carrying something around about the economy. Leave them to it, it's happening anyway. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
leafsta Posted January 16, 2013 Share Posted January 16, 2013 Pretty crazy. What does it matter what people think, the market falls because the free money isnt available anymore. People on this site were trying to tell people what was coming during the bubble, myself included, but they paid no attention. I just got memorised cliches in response, no thinking went on at all. I knew several who bought new build 2 bed flats right at the peak and simple were incapable of listening to reason. The prices are determined by the lending, not sentiment, if the money was up for grabs again they'd all be queueing up to bankrupt themselves all over again. They'd just think you were nuts for carrying something around about the economy. Leave them to it, it's happening anyway. Its happening too slowly. And sentiment is the key. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
rantnrave Posted January 17, 2013 Share Posted January 17, 2013 Its happening too slowly. And sentiment is the key. I hear a lot about how the rise in property prices was all down to immigration over the last decade. People prefer to regard it that way than admit it all the greed that was going round. AFAIK, the gates to the eastern Europeans didn't open until the bubble was already well inflated though? The conversation usually follows that this will push prices up higher. I then simply ask where the money is coming from to fund this - the banks lending more or people getting big pay rises. This normally results in a pause. I then mention that if folk are coming here from East Europe, then property prices should be falling there. As I read on HPC, they rose on the back of cheap lending as they were doing here, despite the exodus. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dances with sheeple Posted January 17, 2013 Share Posted January 17, 2013 Its happening too slowly. And sentiment is the key. Fair enough, but handing someone a document or pamphlet won`t wake them up like losing 100 or 200k on their bought at peak newbuild? UK sheeple are slowly learning that they were just being milked by bankers when they thought they were "getting on with their lives". Sit back and watch the fun, no one will be on the streets or starving, they just won`t get the silly price they were expecting and may have to go bankrupt, tough titty, they can apply for social housing along with all the other financial illiterates. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sour Mash Posted January 17, 2013 Share Posted January 17, 2013 Its happening too slowly. And sentiment is the key. In London/SE, sure. Elsewhere the HPC has been massive and pretty rapid. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dances with sheeple Posted January 17, 2013 Share Posted January 17, 2013 I hear a lot about how the rise in property prices was all down to immigration over the last decade. People prefer to regard it that way than admit it all the greed that was going round. AFAIK, the gates to the eastern Europeans didn't open until the bubble was already well inflated though? The conversation usually follows that this will push prices up higher. I then simply ask where the money is coming from to fund this - the banks lending more or people getting big pay rises. This normally results in a pause. I then mention that if folk are coming here from East Europe, then property prices should be falling there. As I read on HPC, they rose on the back of cheap lending as they were doing here, despite the exodus. Very good points.The bubble mania was well under way here in Edinburgh long before the Poles arrived, and most of them were renting and saving due to exchange rates which benefited them. If they were thinking of buying it was at home, so maybe that is the reason prices there shot up? A sort of currency swop which ended up in property? Cheap money and Liar loans caused it here and it won`t be coming back in our lifetimes. Downhill (depending on where you positioned yourself) all the way for property now IMO. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
cybernoid Posted January 17, 2013 Share Posted January 17, 2013 I hear a lot about how the rise in property prices was all down to immigration over the last decade. People either just won't think or can't think. The frothing at the mouth daily mail types who go on about immigration are the self same that think its fantastic that property prices have gone up. If they believe immigration is the cause of the bubble it's only when they think about their kids who can't buy, when they think about selling their own property the price is high and deservedly so because they 'worked hard all their lives', which in itself is usually another thought divorced from reality. People have all these thoughts or memes in their minds, and they contradict each other. They frankly cant be bothered to have a coherent collection of thoughts in their minds, and will spout whichever cliche suits a particular situation one day whilst contradicting the same the next day. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Monkey Posted January 17, 2013 Share Posted January 17, 2013 People either just won't think or can't think. i hear it time and time again, "Property is my Pension" "buy cheap at auction, do it up and sell it for a proffit, if it doesnt sell then rent it until it does" "renting is dead money" "'ll pay the I/O portion untill the debt is inflated away, free money INNT" "My parents gave me £**k for a deposit by remortgaging their house, its my inheritence anyway" "yeah its a 2 year mortgage, and i'll get get another I/O at the end of it" "with IR's so low, and they cant put them up its silly not to buy" "house prices will always go up" "yeah the ecconomy is in the shit, but house prices always go up, that just how it is" "you'll miss out if you dont buy this year" "it's an investment, but i just want a house to live in" Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
“Nasty Piece of work” Posted January 17, 2013 Share Posted January 17, 2013 HPI had nothing to do, and will have nothing to do with low end immigration. It is not the Eastern European "hot bunking" with a fellow shift worker - UK property is, and was, unattractive. You cannot bank it, or send it home. It was, and is the domestic BTL "owner"- who thankfully has little sense. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
AvoidDebt Posted January 17, 2013 Share Posted January 17, 2013 HPI had nothing to do, and will have nothing to do with low end immigration. It is not the Eastern European "hot bunking" with a fellow shift worker - UK property is, and was, unattractive. You cannot bank it, or send it home. It was, and is the domestic BTL "owner"- who thankfully has little sense. But where does the demand for HMOs come from? Why are so many people especially in London living in bedsits? When did we become a nation that has no issues living in a single room and sharing a toilet and kitchen with complete strangers? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bloo Loo Posted January 17, 2013 Share Posted January 17, 2013 But where does the demand for HMOs come from? Why are so many people especially in London living in bedsits? When did we become a nation that has no issues living in a single room and sharing a toilet and kitchen with complete strangers? about 1765 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
winkie Posted January 17, 2013 Share Posted January 17, 2013 In London/SE, sure. Elsewhere the HPC has been massive and pretty rapid. All the best places are where the property is becoming more affordable to buy......enticing the best people, the best new jobs and industry, therefore the best work life balances and wages that are able without assistance to pay the living costs........hard to compete in an area that attracts unfair uncompetitive behaviour. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
rantnrave Posted January 17, 2013 Share Posted January 17, 2013 about 1765 Around the time of the South Sea Company Bubble? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bloo Loo Posted January 17, 2013 Share Posted January 17, 2013 Around the time of the South Sea Company Bubble? could be...I just made it up...people have been living in tight squalor in London and most Cities for ever. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
erranta Posted January 17, 2013 Share Posted January 17, 2013 (edited) I hear a lot about how the rise in property prices was all down to immigration over the last decade. People prefer to regard it that way than admit it all the greed that was going round. AFAIK, the gates to the eastern Europeans didn't open until the bubble was already well inflated though? The conversation usually follows that this will push prices up higher. I then simply ask where the money is coming from to fund this - the banks lending more or people getting big pay rises. This normally results in a pause. I then mention that if folk are coming here from East Europe, then property prices should be falling there. As I read on HPC, they rose on the back of cheap lending as they were doing here, despite the exodus. Well the answer was reported numerous times in the media. At the height of it all Poles alone were sending over £6 Billion a year back home funding their own projects/savings. This of course obliterates The Govt propaganda that immigration solves everything - cos the above immigrants deprived the Govt of taxes/vat on bought goods and helped to destruct local economies by sucking cash out of the UK.(probably double the amount with cash in hand going on in black economy) Then they get laid off and rest of us have to give Poles families back home British rates of social security! Rates should be adjusted for their homelands At the same time The Euro-Meisters dumped Spain/Portugal/Ireland/Greece etc from Trillions pumped in euro-subsidies (overheating their economies ON PURPOSE) - leading to huge crashes of their economies Then IMF + other vultures moved in to suck the cash back out - thru usury interest and buy up cheap assets. They switched the Trillians €€€'s to East Europe - Poland (why Big Business Dell, Krafty-Cadburys etc moved for the free subsidies offered by Polish Govt - awash with Euro-taxpayer cash) The way Globalised/Big Business moves from region to region is like the Biblical LOCUSTS who leave nothing but destruction behind - fancy that Edited January 17, 2013 by erranta Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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