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#61 (Blizzard)

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Posted 05 February 2012 - 02:37 PM

nonsense

complain

but don't then use this as an excuse for inaction


I wouldn't disagree with that. Well, maybe the nonsense bit.
"As soon as the land of any country has all become private property, the landlords, like all other men, love to reap where they never sowed, and demand a rent even for its natural produce. The wood of the forest, the grass of the field, and all the natural fruits of the earth, which, when land was in common, cost the labourer only the trouble of gathering them, come, even to him, to have an additional price fixed upon them. He must then pay for the licence to gather them; and must give up to the landlord a portion of what his labour either collects or produces. This portion, or, what comes to the same thing, the price of this portion, constitutes the rent of land ...." — Adam Smith: The Wealth of Nations[17]

#62 Quicken

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Posted 05 February 2012 - 02:47 PM

complain

but don't then use this as an excuse for inaction


+1
Remember, if you need Government 'help' to get a mortgage then you are subprime.

Bubble Killer: Wages and salaries for the middle income quintile of non-retired households fell in real terms from £33,100 in 2007/08 to £28,300 in 2011/12. 15% fall.

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#63 (Blizzard)

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Posted 05 February 2012 - 02:52 PM

Perhaps people see something bleeding obvious that you are oblivious to.

You objected to the criticism of whingers and cited examples such as Ghandi and MLK in order to support the right to complain( which no one ever suggested should be curtailed)

By elevating the self pity resonating from many on here to the same plain as campaigns to free people from subjugation then you invited a sarcastic response.

Of course people have the right to complain. But then so do the recipient audience of these complaints.

As feedback in response to the complaining I will comment thus, " Ghandi and MLK had good cause to complain, many people on here would be better off channelling their energies into mitigating against the bad decisions made by others. Instead they do nothing but complain"


I thought it pretty obvious that 'Ghandi, what a whiner' was not something meant to be taken too seriously. I don't do smilies.

I made a light hearted defence of the worlds complainers, and somehow I'm comparing the housing market to gang-rape and discussing the 'right' to compain. Eh?

As it happens, the state of the housing market is an enormous injustice, not something to be downplayed as a rich-man's problem.


People should complain about it as often and as loudly as possible. This isn't incompatible with action, nor does opposing the rules stop you winning the game.

Edited by (Blizzard), 05 February 2012 - 03:00 PM.

"As soon as the land of any country has all become private property, the landlords, like all other men, love to reap where they never sowed, and demand a rent even for its natural produce. The wood of the forest, the grass of the field, and all the natural fruits of the earth, which, when land was in common, cost the labourer only the trouble of gathering them, come, even to him, to have an additional price fixed upon them. He must then pay for the licence to gather them; and must give up to the landlord a portion of what his labour either collects or produces. This portion, or, what comes to the same thing, the price of this portion, constitutes the rent of land ...." — Adam Smith: The Wealth of Nations[17]

#64 porca misèria

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Posted 05 February 2012 - 04:38 PM

Nothing wrong with moaning. It's therapeutic! Isn't that what this forum does best?

That said, all things in moderation. And moaning to the exclusion of acting, even just getting on with life, is not healthy.

#65 Crashman Begins

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Posted 05 February 2012 - 04:48 PM

I don't like the way this country has been run. I can see the flaws.
I do not cry about my personal circumstances because I can take action to hedge against mistakes.

We all know our currency is being devalued . Stop whinging that your 50k or whatever savings you have are being inflated.

By retaining in cash you are deliberately, wilfully, and explicitly accepting a counterparty whose credibility you doubt.

You are no different than a sub prime investor.

If you don't like the monetary policy of your fiat issuer short them or move your cash to gold .

This forum is full of people who were banging on about their pile of savings this time last year and how they hated chopper and merv and how qe was destroying their savings.

Did any of you keep it in Gbp despite your knowledge? Then stop whinging! You took a gamble and now you blame someone else for a decision you knew was wrong!


If you had 100k for a 50 pc deposit this time last year and you had switched it to gold, ( with a bit of quanto ) you could now almost buy your house . One year to buy half a house? How much more of a ******in crash do you want?

If you didn't move to gold ( I didn't) then you chose the wrong currency to invest in, proably because you didn't want to ! Your choice, your outcome, not my fickin problem !


Agree

Certain people on this site pleaded with everyone to understand what was going to happen. TO PROTECT THEMSELVES

A fair 50% crash was due, but they decided that it would be best to crash the system so hard that they could move the goal posts.
Youve got to keep up with how this is playing out.

An idea / plan from 2004 is not going to work in 2012
precious-metal-investment.blogspot.co.uk

BBB @ Dec 5 2004, 05:30 PM: some credit crunch guys....not my idea of a credit crunch......is it yours?
''first this will happen, then this will happen'' you all said..kind of throws all your baloney theories out of the window doesn't it?

They will do anything to avoid suggesting that the size of the pie is not the real problem, it's the way it is sliced.


#66 Total_Injustice

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Posted 05 February 2012 - 07:37 PM

So in order to avoid acting like 'a victim', people should stop complaining about their mistreatment?

Someone starts pissing in your letterbox, you just laugh and say 'oh well, there's always the back door?'


Well said.

+1
Recovery - Noun

1. The act of recovering from sickness, a shock, or a setback
2. Restoration to a former and better condition
3. The regaining of something lost
4. The extraction of useful substances from waste

Collins Essential English Dictionary 2nd Edition 2006 © HarperCollins Publishers 2004, 2006

If RECOVERY is what the country thinks the housing market needs then we're all fuc*ed.


Our taxes are effectively be paying the mortgages of all those 'rescued' over the past few months, and all those on 0.5% interest rates.

#67 Asheron

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Posted 05 February 2012 - 07:45 PM

Looks like they government is going to keep the economy going sideways 1 more year, whilst they prepare for war with Iran.

War with Iran will probably involve Russia and China.

The 95% Mortgages are Back! and 100% Mortgages :)

1 More Year People!

Right now we are in a situation where if you don't become a Debt slave. And think you are clever by saving your money in the bank, inflation will actually steal your purchasing power.





a lot of people on here recently are getting disgruntled about how things have panned out.

i personally left the market a few years ago with a hopefull expection that the boom was over. well, the boom is over. outside of london houses have been slipping somewhat slowly, but slipping. no there has not been a crash. well with .5 pct base rate that not really a supprise. the govenment has done all it can, along with banks who would go bust,lets be honest if a crash happened, to maintain prices as best they can.

a lot of us took the perfectly rational view that booms come to an end one way or another. we never invisaged a reasonably sound economic state printing money, who did.
but that was our gamble. thats what investment is.

the question is what to do now, not bitch about how we might have got it wrong.

if you need a large mortgage to buy then a house must me looked upon as an investment that can lose money. if you are buying for cash, then it somewhere to house you rent free.

as an investment , i think that the housing market has little going for it long term. there are many aspect often overlooked.

forget about short term things like interet rates and btl, they can in some ways be contrived by amanipulation, but other things can not.

the big one is financial demographics. simple logic, poorer people cannot afford more expensive housing. and we are going to get poorer, in real terms, and barring some unknown unknown thats a fact. this applies to the whole of europe.

the young are the hpc saviours. if you are fifty or sixty and sitting on your 1m pound property hoping to sell in 10 years for 2m and retire, i am affraid you are in for a nasty shock. where on earth do you think someone who is 30 now is going to get that sort of money, when they are years away from their first flat. and remember baby boomers, there are an awful lot of you who will all want to be selling at the same time, just as you all wanted to buy at the same time. (incidently forcing up prices) and how many are going to want to sell the second homes as well.

demographics is the real clue to long term investment. and from what i can see we are going japanese. moreso in the rest of europe than here.

the real question is what now. as far as i can see the govenment and bank are trying to stear the good ship uk economy( and west in total) between the rocks of depressive deflation and the waterfall of hyper inflation ( consequence of money printing) . now at the moment it looks like they are succeeding.but the straights of water between the two are getting narrower and there is no sign of open ocean yet, what ever they tell you.

baised on historical evidence the good ship britian will hit the rocks or go over the water fall. the problem is that the debts are so vast that depression could come or they are printing so much money it could be hyper inflation. now im no expert and from what i read no one really has any idea which way this will go. so all i think you can do is hedge your bets, have some multinational assests, have some cash. and jump one way or the other when it becomes clearer.

accept that you are not an expert and that you are going to become poorer in one way or another, keep an eye to trends stop worrying about volitility and try to come out of this with as mouch as you can save.


Edited by Asheron, 05 February 2012 - 07:48 PM.

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#68 Si1

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Posted 05 February 2012 - 08:24 PM

I wouldn't disagree with that. Well, maybe the nonsense bit.


fair enough

I just enjoy arguing too...




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