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If I Keep Wondering 'how Can People Afford Private School?'

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"Just over 7.2% of pupils in England attend private schools but make up over a quarter of the intake at the 25 most selective universities, and 46.6% at Oxford . . . However, research carried out for the government has shown that pupils from comprehensives are likely to do better at university than private or grammar school pupils with similar A-level results."

But there are lots of talented kids whose parents can't / won't pay who will be pipped to the top places by richer thickies.

Friend the other day: 'Lots of people can afford private school. It's as little as only six grand a year for one child, and even if it's more, people are prepared to go without just so their child gets the best education blah etc . . .'

I'm getting sick of it of hearing this. But even sicker of myself to clinging on to my experience of private school being seemingly unaffordable to even the middle classes in the late 70's and 80's.

Is it just low interest rates keeping these places going?

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I guess if you'[ve paid off your house, then you will have a significant discretionary income.

If you've been MEWing too...

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"Just over 7.2% of pupils in England attend private schools but make up over a quarter of the intake at the 25 most selective universities, and 46.6% at Oxford . . . However, research carried out for the government has shown that pupils from comprehensives are likely to do better at university than private or grammar school pupils with similar A-level results."

But there are lots of talented kids whose parents can't / won't pay who will be pipped to the top places by richer thickies.

Friend the other day: 'Lots of people can afford private school. It's as little as only six grand a year for one child, and even if it's more, people are prepared to go without just so their child gets the best education blah etc . . .'

I'm getting sick of it of hearing this. But even sicker of myself to clinging on to my experience of private school being seemingly unaffordable to even the middle classes in the late 70's and 80's.

Is it just low interest rates keeping these places going?

if you went to a private school then you can only go to a private university... oh, thats already happened!

Edited by douggggy

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if you went to a private school then to can only go to a private university... oh, thats already happened!

Oh yeah :(

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I guess if you'[ve paid off your house, then you will have a significant discretionary income.

If you've been MEWing too...

Oh yeah. So maybe this private school affordability mystery is merely a generational blip based on housing boom / mewing / mortgage paid off scenario.

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Oh yeah. So maybe this private school affordability mystery is merely a generational blip based on housing boom / mewing / mortgage paid off scenario.

Yes, but the blip has lasted the duration of the housing boom... about 50 years.

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Yes, but the blip has lasted the duration of the housing boom... about 50 years.

And the credit expansion has ended...or has it :ph34r:

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A professional couple earning a combined net monthly income of £4,500 who prioritise their childrens education over all else is not beyond the realms of possibility. There are millions of 'professionals'. We looked at sending one private, sending two would be far too much of a stretch and found some of the preparatory schools offered very little more than a good state primary could provide (our primary school takes in 9 pupils a year, not typical and is rated outstanding by Ofstead). A friend of mine facilitates Russians sending their sprogs to our private schools and it is not uncommon for them to pay him the fees upfront (£20k+) and he typically gets discounts in the order of £3-4k to pay up front.

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Take my girls out of private school? I'd rather starve, says desperate mum

Read more: http://www.dailymail.co.uk/femail/article-1332846/Take-girls-private-school-Id-starve.html#ixzz1AdQ8MTR3

We owned a house — once.

But in the eight years we lived there we were forced to remortgage three times to keep ­paying the school fees. When we finally sold up in 2008, just before the market fell through the floor, we came out with so little equity that we now have to rent and somehow - in our 40s - save up for a deposit all over again.

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Yes, but the blip has lasted the duration of the housing boom... about 50 years.

Sorry Lepista, I was agreeing with you, not being sarky (for a change).

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Friend the other day: 'Lots of people can afford private school. It's as little as only six grand a year for one child, and even if it's more, people are prepared to go without just so their child gets the best education blah etc . . .'

I don't know if there is anywhere that's six grand a year now .. My old school was one of the worst independents and in the mid 80's it was £5000 a year .. Private schools (especially boarding schools) were subsidised by the fact that they did not have to employ qualified teachers (and thus could pay them nothing) and they did not have to (and still don't) have to comply with the same regulations as state run institutions. Add into this the huge subsidy given to them due to the number of students paid for by the state (children of civil sevants, Army Kids etc ).

My guess is the number who PAY is closer to 3-4%. The main argument for keeping these schools feepaying is that the state would have to educate the pupils if they were closed .. whereas for every private paying pupil there is one the state is paying for, without that subsidy most independeny schools would close ..

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A professional couple earning a combined net monthly income of £4,500 who prioritise their childrens education over all else is not beyond the realms of possibility. There are millions of 'professionals'. We looked at sending one private, sending two would be far too much of a stretch and found some of the preparatory schools offered very little more than a good state primary could provide (our primary school takes in 9 pupils a year, not typical and is rated outstanding by Ofstead). A friend of mine facilitates Russians sending their sprogs to our private schools and it is not uncommon for them to pay him the fees upfront (£20k+) and he typically gets discounts in the order of £3-4k to pay up front.

Oh my god! :o That's it. I'm starting a new business, 'The Harry Potter School for divvy rich foreigners' kids', £30k p.a. per child.

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Many can't afford to continue sending their children to private school, a good state school is better than a poor private school...if your kids are bright they will make it to what they want to be whatever, private school is a more of who you meet than what you learn. :P

A couple of mothers I know are working full time to support their kids in private school, they obviously think it is important and therefore make sacrifices for their children's future.... ;)

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Friend the other day: 'Lots of people can afford private school. It's as little as only six grand a year for one child, and even if it's more, people are prepared to go without just so their child gets the best education blah etc . . .'

I'm getting sick of it of hearing this.

Is it just low interest rates keeping these places going?

I do think that there is some truth in this, a lot of people can afford it, even at the very high end: £30k per year for private boarding schools. But even at the lower end £6k per year at primary level, people can afford it or are willing to make that sacrifice. I also think that some sections of society will make larger sacrifices to ensure a good education at a significant disadvantage to themselves. Also when looking at some boarding schools and top tier universities, foreign parents see a benefit in sending their kids to them - well known and internationally extremely well respected universites do hold a significant appeal.

Personally I find it amazing but for some parents sending a kid from 8yrs to 18 to a boarding school at a cost of £300k and then university is something that they can easily afford to do, so a couple of kids is going to cost you at least £1million in pretax income.

I would agree that interest rates being low probably does help, I would guess there are some parents who are on IO mortgages currently paying a tiny amount and either banking the extra for future fees or spending it on school fees.

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Is it just low interest rates keeping these places going?

For a number of years private schools have been merging, some closing down. Many would be stuffed if they lost their charitable status. Its not been an expanding business sector for 3 or 4 years.

Interest rates are no doubt helping some avoid closing, so in time a few more may close. Thats just a natural ebb and flow. Private schools will not completely disappear, at least not for this reason. They have after all survived a number of recessions over the decades.

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"Just over 7.2% of pupils in England attend private schools"

...

Is it just low interest rates keeping these places going?

I would have thought that the richest 7.2% of the population will always be able to afford school fees, whatever interest rates are.

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A couple of mothers I know are working full time to support their kids in private school, they obviously think it is important and therefore make sacrifices for their children's future.... ;)

So just to send 1 kid they have at least 12K in disposable income?

Are they bank CEOs or working 'on their backs'.?

This is typical of the lack of transparency and a country built on scams that the UK has become. I hate it and can't wait to emigrate.

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"Just over 7.2% of pupils in England attend private schools but make up over a quarter of the intake at the 25 most selective universities, and 46.6% at Oxford . . . However, research carried out for the government has shown that pupils from comprehensives are likely to do better at university than private or grammar school pupils with similar A-level results."

But there are lots of talented kids whose parents can't / won't pay who will be pipped to the top places by richer thickies.

What a tool. It's not the private schools' fault that the state system is fecked. You would have thought the solution might just be to fix it, but that would be too much work. It's a lot easier to blame the universities because it somehow must be their fault.

The cretin studied at Cambridge, but seems to have already forgotten that Oxbridge go into the effort of interviewing pretty much every single take-able candidate. Just what more does he think can be done to find the clever ones? I suspect he just feels that spouting garbage will further his career, rather being genuinely clueless. It's a tragedy either way.

Friend the other day: 'Lots of people can afford private school. It's as little as only six grand a year for one child, and even if it's more, people are prepared to go without just so their child gets the best education blah etc . . .'

I'm getting sick of it of hearing this. But even sicker of myself to clinging on to my experience of private school being seemingly unaffordable to even the middle classes in the late 70's and 80's.

Is it just low interest rates keeping these places going?

6k a year is indeed trivial to a lot of people. At that rate it's possible to educate a child for the cost of a large car. That is why the exclusive places charge 30k a year :-)

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Sorry Lepista, I was agreeing with you, not being sarky (for a change).

np :)

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One interesting point by Simon Hughes from the article is:

Giving the example of a "fantastically bright" woman from his own south London constituency, Hughes said: "People like her ... just never get the opportunity, because there is no real pressure on universities to go out looking in schools like the one she was at. And we've just got to change that. So for me – of all the bits of the jigsaw, that for me is where I want to have most influence, and I want to try and persuade them that they have to be really tough with the universities, really really really tough."

Surely if someone is fantastically bright, they would apply to the good universities, isnt the application process fairly straightforward anyway? Also arent the very good uni's swamped with applications anyway? so why would they go searching for candidates and would the uni's even have the resources to do so?

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"Just over 7.2% of pupils in England attend private schools but make up over a quarter of the intake at the 25 most selective universities, and 46.6% at Oxford . . . However, research carried out for the government has shown that pupils from comprehensives are likely to do better at university than private or grammar school pupils with similar A-level results."

But there are lots of talented kids whose parents can't / won't pay who will be pipped to the top places by richer thickies.

It is worth noting that many private schools are selective, and they get very few "thickies".

Also you need to read between the lines here, pupils from comprehensive with "similar" grades do better, but by and large, private/grammar school pupils achieve higher grades, and do better overall at university, and dare I say it have greater career prospects.

I used to be in the won't pay brigade. Faced with the lack of choice of secondary schools for my son, I have changed.

Due to the crooked selection criteria which means people living further away in a different borough from the school of choice get preference, we have applied for the local independent school rather than be forced to attend an underachieving school which would mean over two hours travel a day,

I did not even consider private education until a year ago when I found out how poor my son had been taught in his so-called high ranking Catholic primary school. After spending most weekend and evenings working with him, he is now back to the level he needs to be at to apply for independent/grammar schools. It is no use having talent (which my son has, even if I do say so myself), if the teaching is not adequate.

We did try to move earlier in the year to save on the fees, but given we would have to spend £200K more + another £30K in stamp duty and other moving expenses, the £80K or so we would expect to pay in the next 5 years is a cheaper option.

Edited by arrgee1991

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"Just over 7.2% of pupils in England attend private schools but make up over a quarter of the intake at the 25 most selective universities, and 46.6% at Oxford . . . However, research carried out for the government has shown that pupils from comprehensives are likely to do better at university than private or grammar school pupils with similar A-level results."

And that's why private school alumni are disproportionately represented at at the most selective universities.

It is worth noting that many private schools are selective, and they get very few "thickies".

A combination of that and quite simply better teaching. Most of the teachers at the better private secondary schools have PhDs, discipline is better (because, unlike state schools, they can simply throw out seriously disruptive pupils) and they don't teach the softer 'A' levels.

Oh my god! :o That's it. I'm starting a new business, 'The Harry Potter School for divvy rich foreigners' kids', £30k p.a. per child.

Too late. That description effectively fits the university department I teach in.

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A friend of mine ( in Hampshire ) had a 500K morgage, 150K income, lived THE LIFE...2 kids going to pricate school.

He rackedup massive debts, wife walked out, house repo'd...bankruptcy, no job...kids had to come out of private school.

If'd not sent them in the first place he'd have kept his head above water...but wified wanted them to go. :lol:

EDIT, sorry shouldnt :lol: at that...... :lol::lol::lol::lol::lol:

Edited by TheCountOfNowhere

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Wasn't there some scandal 18 months ago about PS getting bailouts from LA?

(on the principal that the kids don't take up school places that would cost the LA money?)

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